Losses at the Forest Service

[BuzzH]

My dad is a disabled veteran that uses the VA all the time with no issues. However, he lives a couple miles from the VA in Helena and I think that's definitely advantageous as opposed to a more populated area. He's had multiple surgeries, PT, and cancer treatment through it without a hiccup.

Without a deep dive into the day to day function of the VA as a whole, it would be impossible to say what effects the cuts will have. Businesses can get more efficient with less people. I'm not saying that will be the case here, but more people isn't always a correlation to better business.

I don't believe having less nurses, less Drs, less psychologists is going to be the way to provide better care for Veterans. I just don't buy it.

I've been lucky that I avoided ever having to be in a hospital over night until 2022. In my experience of the one night stay, the nurse I talked with said burnout, long hours, and not having enough staff was taking a toll. From how the nurses all looked, I believe it. I have a lot of respect for those doing that job, I wouldn't want to do it.

 

[BuzzH]

Hoo boy.

The employees were fired “without cause nor based on performance or conduct,” Spero said, and the emails were “from an ‘exec order’ Microsoft email address” — not a government email address. A copy of the termination email that was provided to the AP shows the sending address from the address “[email protected].”

Trump begins firings of FAA staff just weeks after fatal DC plane crash

The Trump administration has begun firing several hundred Federal Aviation Administration employees, upending staff on a busy air travel weekend and just weeks after a fatal midair collision near Washington.

apnews.com

No big deal, we can all fly safer and more efficiently with less FAA staff.

BTW, every probationary period employee across all agencies have been fired with no cause and all were told they had poor performance as a reason.

 

[Bonasababy]

Hoo boy.

The employees were fired “without cause nor based on performance or conduct,” Spero said, and the emails were “from an ‘exec order’ Microsoft email address” — not a government email address. A copy of the termination email that was provided to the AP shows the sending address from the address “[email protected].”

Trump begins firings of FAA staff just weeks after fatal DC plane crash

The Trump administration has begun firing several hundred Federal Aviation Administration employees, upending staff on a busy air travel weekend and just weeks after a fatal midair collision near Washington.

apnews.com

"Other FAA employees who were fired were working on an urgent and classified early warning radar system the Air Force had announced in 2023 for Hawaii to detect incoming cruise missiles, through a program that was in part funded by the Department of Defense. It’s one of several programs that the FAA’s National Defense Program manages that involve radars providing longer-range detection around the country’s borders."

I'll say it again--these are golden times for terrorists and foreign governments wanting to do harm to this country.

 

[Bonasababy]

You are such an arrogant dick and nobody will call you on it. I just talked to my brother who is a retired Lt Colonel. He is on a veterans disability with a complete lung transplant that is related to his service in the U.S. Army. He is under constant care for this disability and he told me he is receiving continual monitoring and evaluation for this condition. He lives at home and can live as normal a life as you can with a lung transplant. He is not concerned about the cuts that are being made in the government, and you want to make it look like anyone needing care will be neglected and that just isn’t true…

The VA has been short staffed for YEARS. Cutting more staff helps how?

Maybe there will be more orgs that crop up wanting our donations to pay back our veterans for their service?

I much prefer we treat them right and take care of them rather than toss them aside looking for volunteer org help.

 

[El Jason]

Hoo boy.

The employees were fired “without cause nor based on performance or conduct,” Spero said, and the emails were “from an ‘exec order’ Microsoft email address” — not a government email address. A copy of the termination email that was provided to the AP shows the sending address from the address “[email protected].”

Trump begins firings of FAA staff just weeks after fatal DC plane crash

The Trump administration has begun firing several hundred Federal Aviation Administration employees, upending staff on a busy air travel weekend and just weeks after a fatal midair collision near Washington.

apnews.com

Three ring circus…with extra clowns.

 

[SAJ-99]

VA should take the money being spent on the VA facilities etc and instead use it to provide full coverage for veteran health care elsewhere.

There was a proposal a while back about rolling VA in Medicare and allowing veterans broader access to HC system. Never happened. There were some legit obstacles but mostly it was about the $$$ and lobby interest. The VA system remains a mess, and pretty much 99.9% of people will agree on it.

 

[Chama Grande]

I find it interesting the amount of work that is contracted out by federal and state agencies. Cheaper than a few more employees I guess

In the end it's more expensive. I pay a contractor 70k per year to do something that amounts to a .25 FTE. It's a core mission thing that we should be doing ourselves since we're obligated by federal decrees to do them. But then departments got hacked back so bad 30ish years ago by some small government republicans, and then again during the 'sequester' and tea party era. So now we have less employees with the same or greater obligations and we just spend more to accomplish it. It's an absurd reality where the intent of the policy and the implementation of that policy are so different. I read a really good book on this recently, linked below. It takes some very necessary shots at bad policy implementation from the left and the right. (I don't have much time to talk about this, but it's a really good book that I recommend for both sides of the endless void here. If you're able, you can see some critical faults in policy implementation from whichever side you vote for. The stuff the left has done to hamstring government is just as absurd as the right.)

Amazon.com

 

[shrapnel]

The VA has been short staffed for YEARS. Cutting more staff helps how?

Maybe there will be more orgs that crop up wanting our donations to pay back our veterans for their service?

I much prefer we treat them right and take care of them rather than toss them aside looking for volunteer org help.

You didn’t pay attention to what I said. My brother is a patient under the care of the VA and isn’t having any concerns and his care requires constant monitoring.

Having a lung transplant isn’t any small operation and he is not being neglected by the VA.

This is an actual situation, not a generalization…

 

[TOGIE]

Hoo boy.

The employees were fired “without cause nor based on performance or conduct,” Spero said, and the emails were “from an ‘exec order’ Microsoft email address” — not a government email address. A copy of the termination email that was provided to the AP shows the sending address from the address “[email protected].”

Trump begins firings of FAA staff just weeks after fatal DC plane crash

The Trump administration has begun firing several hundred Federal Aviation Administration employees, upending staff on a busy air travel weekend and just weeks after a fatal midair collision near Washington.

apnews.com

packing up your desk after receiving termination from an e-mail address like that is basically like sending 20k over to some saudi prince who needs is his funds unfrozen.

 

[BuzzH]

You didn’t pay attention to what I said. My brother is a patient under the care of the VA and isn’t having any concerns and his care requires constant monitoring.

Having a lung transplant isn’t any small operation and he is not being neglected by the VA.

This is an actual situation, not a generalization…

Great, but why not ask the other 8,999,999 other veterans about their care?

If its so stellar for all of them, why are they complaining?

 

[BuzzH]

packing up your desk after receiving termination from an e-mail address like that is basically like sending 20k over to some saudi prince who needs is his funds unfrozen.

Tough to pack up your desk when you're locked out of the building.

Just sayin'...

Spero said messages began arriving after 7 p.m. on Friday and continued late into the night. More might be notified over the long weekend or barred from entering FAA buildings on Tuesday, he said

 

[Straight Arrow]

You are such an arrogant dick and nobody will call you on it. I just talked to my brother who is a retired Lt Colonel. He is on a veterans disability with a complete lung transplant that is related to his service in the U.S. Army. He is under constant care for this disability and he told me he is receiving continual monitoring and evaluation for this condition. He lives at home and can live as normal a life as you can with a lung transplant. He is not concerned about the cuts that are being made in the government, and you want to make it look like anyone needing care will be neglected and that just isn’t true…

Uplifting example, thank-you. The VA gets much criticism which is unwarranted. It's helpful to understand the role of Congress in establishing laws, rules, policy often resulting in red tape bureaucracy that slows the process. In my opinion, the VA sifts through the red tape quagmire better than most organizations.

In my Agent Orange case, understandably it required completing much paperwork, providing documentation from military service, medical reports and related information. It takes time and attention to detail, with required administrative process at the VA to support the Veteran. Cutting the staff that completes that process on behalf of Veterans is absurdly foolish ... ultimately costly in so many ways for the personal care of Veterans. For me, cancer robotic surgery at Huntsman Cancer Institute in SLC didn't cost me a dime.
God bless the VA and Medicare!

 

[Straight Arrow]

Great, but why not ask the other 8,999,999 other veterans about their care?

If its so stellar for all of them, why are they complaining?

As someone belonging to a number of Veteran organizations and even helping fellow Vets before, I can tell you that some just struggle with the process. Not meaning to be disrespectful, but many are the same folks who have a hard time registering their vehicle or filing income tax or other administrative tasks. They get frustrated because of the wait times, the paperwork, the documentation requirements and so forth. The frustration results in complaining, rather than determining how to cope. But trimming the support help and administrative staff at the VA sure ain't the answer. It will not ease the process and eliminate the complaining.

 

[brymoore]

This thread is a chit show!

For what it’s worth, veterans trust the VA at 92%.

https://department.va.gov/veterans-experience/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/VA-FY2024-Trust-Report_FNL508.pdf

 

[Nick87]

This thread is a chit show

Just when you think so...

 

[BuzzH]

This thread is a chit show!

For what it’s worth, veterans trust the VA healthcare at 92%.

https://department.va.gov/veterans-experience/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/VA-FY2024-Trust-Report_FNL508.pdf

FIFY, 80% trust the VA, room for improvement there I think.

 

[elkduds]

The VA has been short staffed for YEARS. Cutting more staff helps how?

Maybe there will be more orgs that crop up wanting our donations to pay back our veterans for their service?

I much prefer we treat them right and take care of them rather than toss them aside looking for volunteer org help.

Lincoln said so when he established federal veterans' care after the Civil War. Unfathomable resources are spent during wars. Congress authorizes same with no $ budgeted for caring for the veterans of that war, instead relegating that to the Veterans' Administration which is a shamefully easy target for budget haircuts every year. If Congress were required to allocate for veterans' oof that war's care as part of every war budget, two changes would result. First, the actual cost of that war would be debated in budget talks, likely leading to fewer wars. Second, the $ to care for veterans of that war would be in place, not raided in annual budget shenanigans. Veterans and their families deserve our thanks for their service and sacrifice. Even more, they deserve the VA keep the promise it makes to them when they enlist.

 

[Big Fin]

This thread is a chit show!

Agree. Though few things in our country's budget is more important than taking care veterans in the manner we have promised, this thread is getting way too far off the trail.

Get the thread back to the "losses at the USFS" and what impact that will have on hunting, public lands, and access. Or, we can just close the thread.

 

[ismith]

As someone belonging to a number of Veteran organizations and even helping fellow Vets before, I can tell you that some just struggle with the process. Not meaning to be disrespectful, but many are the some folks who have a hard time registering their vehicle or filing income tax or other administrative tasks. They get frustrated because of the wait times, the paperwork, the documentation requirements and so forth. The frustration results in complaining, rather than determining how to cope. But trimming the support help and administrative staff at the VA sure ain't the answer. It will not ease the process and eliminate the complaining.

You're not wrong, but there is much more at play than veterans who are unfamiliar with administrative processes that can vary from place to place. Having worked at the VA I can tell you that some systems and processes are a pain in the ass for employees as much as veterans. Lack of standardization is a major issue from what I had seen. The excessive wait times, redundant paperwork and lost records and documentation are inexcusable.

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

You're not wrong, but there is much more at play than veterans who are unfamiliar with administrative processes that can vary from place to place. Having worked at the VA I can tell you that some systems and processes are a pain in the ass for employees as much as veterans. Lack of standardization is a major issue from what I had seen. The excessive wait times, redundant paperwork and lost records and documentation are inexcusable.

I've often told people that if you think it's hard (dealing with the government) from the outside, you should try it from the inside sometime. There is huge room for gains in efficiency. Updated processes and standardization are one. Contracting is a HUGE one. Hiring is another. And believe me, nobody wants to see these gains more than the employees themselves who have to deal with the ridiculous rules and restrictions every single day (not just on the odd occasion that they deal with a gov office). But it pays to keep in mind where these rules and regulations come from - Congress. And where does Congress get the ideas for the added rules and regulations? Their constituents! This is how it works folks. Like it or not, admit it or not. Given the power to find and put into place efficiencies and savings, nearly every federal employee would do exactly that. But they aren't allowed to, because of rules and laws promulgated by (guess who....).

Imagine a large corporation where the CEO, their leadership and their priorities changed every 2-4 years and you have no idea what your operating budget is until 3/4 of the year has gone by. Now ask yourself how efficient that organization would be. And yet some of you still want to blame the employees. smdh