Crazy Application Fees - Burn Them Down!

[KipCarson]

I completely agree @Bullshot unfortunately your paddling upstream against a waterfall on this. When I see phrases like “administrative fees” it always irritates me, especially on any kind of online application that will be completely automated and with minimal input from any personnel possible. I get cost increase overtime, but most of what you’re addressing here is just blatant money grabbing because they can and there wasn’t the public will to stop them when all these fees were added.

 

[Gr8bawana]

Why are we OK with them?

Limited resources exist all over. Parking spots, hotel rooms, event tickets, picnic and camping sites, beaches, boat slips, fishing holes, and a million other things. But somehow, some way, we have accepted that the privilege to even APPLY for a theoretical chance at a hunting licence (or even a point for a future chance) is a thing that has “value” and for which we can be charged exorbitant fees by a government entity. Why is hunting so unique that we must accept this very odd scenario that occurs nowhere or almost nowhere else? Why not similarly priced applications for a “chance” to get a drivers licence. Or a “chance” to obtain prime viewing spots at a parade. I don’t think it is wrong to point out how far from normal our hunting application paradigm has drifted from very nearly every other personal , professional, or recreational endeavor undertaken by individual Americans.

Serious question - what is the outfitter application fee for a limited slot (relative to its commercial value). What is the application fee for a logging or grazing allotment (relative to its value). What is the application fee for an oil/gas lease relative to its value. And probably many many other examples out there yet.

I am not criticizing the charging of application fees to cover administrative costs of processing (how this all started). And nothing in here is about licence costs or user fees. But Application fees are out of control many places, it is gratuitous, a moral hazard for abuse, and it has crossed into the wrong.

And yet even with the "out of control" application fees thousand upon thousands of hunters gladly pay those fees every year.
If you want to boycott those fees by not applying that would be your choice. It's no different than the thousands of hunters applying for just a handful of tags for one species or another.

 

[Bullshot]

“ paddling upstream against a waterfall”

I love lost causes! Often a good sign of a fight worth fighting…..

But yeah, isn’t likely to reverse until something utterly breaks in the current system. Which won’t be good either. Leading contenders… CWD crossover…. Ballot Initiatives…. Great Depression II…. World war…Pandemic II. Any takers??

And yet even with the "out of control" application fees thousand upon thousands of hunters gladly pay those fees every year.
If you want to boycott those fees by not applying that would be your choice. It's no different than the thousands of hunters applying for just a handful of tags for one species or another.

No kidding!

So peculiar the pleasure so many get out of saying this over and over and over.

 

[SaskHunter]

Make app fees higher and non-refundable. It’s to fight climate change.

And just like that:

 

[ismith]

I love lost causes! Often a good sign of a fight worth fighting…..

But yeah, isn’t likely to reverse until something utterly breaks in the current system. Which won’t be good either. Leading contenders… CWD crossover…. Ballot Initiatives…. Great Depression II…. World war…Pandemic II. Any takers??

No kidding!

So peculiar the pleasure so many get out of saying this over and over and over.

Conspiracy theories?

 

[Bullshot]

Conspiracy theories?

It’s gonna take something BIG to undo ever-increasing interest and the tempting cash cow that creates.

 

[lynlan1819]

Why are we OK with them?

Limited resources exist all over. Parking spots, hotel rooms, event tickets, picnic and camping sites, beaches, boat slips, fishing holes, and a million other things. But somehow, some way, we have accepted that the privilege to even APPLY for a theoretical chance at a hunting licence (or even a point for a future chance) is a thing that has “value” and for which we can be charged exorbitant fees by a government entity. Why is hunting so unique that we must accept this very odd scenario that occurs nowhere or almost nowhere else? Why not similarly priced applications for a “chance” to get a drivers licence. Or a “chance” to obtain prime viewing spots at a parade. I don’t think it is wrong to point out how far from normal our hunting application paradigm has drifted from very nearly every other personal , professional, or recreational endeavor undertaken by individual Americans.

Serious question - what is the outfitter application fee for a limited slot (relative to its commercial value). What is the application fee for a logging or grazing allotment (relative to its value). What is the application fee for an oil/gas lease relative to its value. And probably many many other examples out there yet.

I am not criticizing the charging of application fees to cover administrative costs of processing (how this all started). And nothing in here is about licence costs or user fees. But Application fees are out of control many places, it is gratuitous, a moral hazard for abuse, and it has crossed into the wrong.

Plenty of other guys will be more than willing too pay if you dont,demand is super high for hunting in every state.

 

[Bullshot]

Plenty of other guys will be more than willing too pay if you dont,demand is super high for hunting in every state.

insightful

 

[rogerthat]

insightful

But true

 

[lynlan1819]

And yet even with the "out of control" application fees thousand upon thousands of hunters gladly pay those fees every year.
If you want to boycott those fees by not applying that would be your choice. It's no different than the thousands of hunters applying for just a handful of tags for one species or another.

Hunters don't care about costs,it's about hunting,anyone that can't afford it ,can take up knitting I guess.

 

[Bullshot]

Hunters don't care about costs,it's about hunting,anyone that can't afford it ,can take up knitting I guess.

You are contributing nothing to this discussion. My post is about the application fee. Not the cost of tags or the cost of hunting generally. Unless you are personally benefitting fron the insane costs of the erstwhile “administrative” component, or are trying to impress with your ability not to “care about” costs, what is your point. By the way, what do you do for a living and what is your income, since you seem to have some sort of hunter “caste system” in mind. I am a hunter, and I do care about costs. By national statistics it would allow me to guess I make more money than you and probably have a nicer house. Should I win this arguement if so? I’ll take the high road and say it shouldn’t.

 

[Dave N]

Hunters don't care about costs,it's about hunting,anyone that can't afford it ,can take up knitting I guess.

 

[lynlan1819]

You are contributing nothing to this discussion. My post is about the application fee. Not the cost of tags or the cost of hunting generally. Unless you are personally benefitting fron the insane costs of the erstwhile “administrative” component, or are trying to impress with your ability not to “care about” costs, what is your point. By the way, what do you do for a living and what is your income, since you seem to have some sort of hunter “caste system” in mind. I am a hunter, and I do care about costs. By national statistics it would allow me to guess I make more money than you and probably have a nicer house. Should I win this arguement if so? I’ll take the high road and say it shouldn’t.

Keep dreaming !

 

[Buffs35]

You are contributing nothing to this discussion. My post is about the application fee. Not the cost of tags or the cost of hunting generally. Unless you are personally benefitting fron the insane costs of the erstwhile “administrative” component, or are trying to impress with your ability not to “care about” costs, what is your point. By the way, what do you do for a living and what is your income, since you seem to have some sort of hunter “caste system” in mind. I am a hunter, and I do care about costs. By national statistics it would allow me to guess I make more money than you and probably have a nicer house. Should I win this arguement if so? I’ll take the high road and say it shouldn’t.

I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.

 

[Bullshot]

I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.

Another useful contributor. Glad I give you reason to practice your small words.

 

[DFS]

We are seeing the break down of the NAM model. People willing to pay whatever it takes for a tag, game agencies that are managing the wildlife right into the ground on public or accessible land to try to keep up. Demand is high, populations of wildlife declining. Bringing more people to the table broke the system. My hope is game agencies will take note of this and try to preserve hunting for its residents. I like to hunt out of state but realistically the opportunities are going away fast. Too much demand and the almighty dollar always wins usually at the expense of wildlife.

 

[Forkyfinder]

We are seeing the break down of the NAM model. People willing to pay whatever it takes for a tag, game agencies that are managing the wildlife right into the ground on public or accessible land to try to keep up. Demand is high, populations of wildlife declining. Bringing more people to the table broke the system. My hope is game agencies will take note of this and try to preserve hunting for its residents. I like to hunt out of state but realistically the opportunities are going away fast. Too much demand and the almighty dollar always wins usually at the expense of wildlife.

 

[Treeshark]

My hope is game agencies will take note of this and try to preserve hunting for its residents.

Good luck getting them to pay their own budgets.

 

[thusby]

Feel free to follow my lead, burn all your points over the next 3 years and become a waterfowler.

 

[BuzzH]

Feel free to follow my lead, burn all your points over the next 3 years and become a waterfowler fisherman.