USO's latest threat to Arizona

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

Great point Bucksnort ,
This whole USO lawsuit fiasco may be the begining of the end of our hunting heritage and traditions . Hunting will no longer be passed on to our sons and daughters , it will be bought and sold by assholes like "Retired" and USO . Commercialized hunting for profit and greed is a slippery slope , eventually we will all suffer as a result of this lawsuit , some of us have the foresight to oppose taking our sport in that direction .

Hey "Retired" ,
We're all real impressed that you can buy yourself an elk anytime you want to , but that doesn't make you a hunter , you're just a poacher who pays the fine before you pull the trigger !

 

[danr55]

Somehow I smell something cooking.. Does someone have a dutch oven on the fire? ..... Hmm.... YOu don't suppose????? Na... not possible.

Hey gummer, are you a scum sucking lawyer?

This is an interesting conversation, but it's all just so much noise. None of us has enough pull to influence this thing one way or the other... so carry on fellas.. and let's see what comes of it.

 

[BuzzH]

AZ402,

Wasnt the whole reason for the USO lawsuit that NR's were, in fact, drawing LESS than 10% of the available tags?

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

No Buzz ,
The whole reason for the USO lawsuit is to put more money in George Taulmans pocket , he's not doing this for anyone but himself .

 

[Delw]

Bucksnort, unfortunatly most of the hunteres in AZ are greedy and only care about themselfs.
Youve seen some of the ideas and proposlas some of these yahoos have come up with, what else can you call it but being greedy.

DOnt get buzz wrong I think he said 10% was satifactory, I think its satisfactory also.

As far as getting a tag DUDE it took me 20 years to get a elk tag and another 2 years to get another one as far as deer thats not even funny, Ive been drawn I think three times since 1981.Antelope well lets jsut say I get tags often for AZ the reason I dont get the other tags is mostly due to where I apply. I have freinds that get tags every 1-3 years for elk and deer, but they hunt cow elk and does or areas where drawing success is high.

Not to mention the population boom here in AZ tags are going to get harder to get.

Delw

 

[Delw]

Buzz
the way I understood usos first lawsuit was that they wanted non residents to have an equal amount of the tags that residents get. 50 50 split. they kept cutting it down over the years and if I recall at the meetings( told to me by game and fish employees) with game and fish they wanted 20% and and the judge settled for 10%
Unfortunatly there was alot of crap going on with uso and believe it or not it was pretty damn simple, however everyone and there brother started spreading rumors and the thing got even worse as far as what the lawsuit was really about.


Delw

 

[cjcj]

One thing that goes on "alot" down here in AZ is Tons of people put in their whole extended family [many who don`t hunt] so if grandpa/grandma gets a tag they take them along and shoot it for them [semi- poaching] if you ask me. but this is very common...Yes i`m greedy but i could live with a "true" 10% cap .

 

[JoseCuervo]

As a resident of AZ I say if I want to hunt out of state I will pay what ever it takes and have done so many times. As with all hunters and fisherman we have been and are the only ones who pay for conservation of what we enjoy. So if you can't pay the price in AZ then go somewhere else we don't want you here.
cost workes out something like this if G&F gives out 10,000 permits for elk and 10 % of that goes to nonresidents thats 1000 nonresident permits at $371.00 thats $371,000 As for residents 9,000 permits at a cost of $76.50 each is $688,500.00 so it seems residents carry the burdon anyway not to mention year round taxes in our State which go to wildlife not just in the State but everywhere.

Jigmaker,
Your math is bad.... You don't consider that of the 1000 non-Resident permits issued, there were 4000 unsuccessful applicants who bought $113 license and a $5 bonus point.

The state of AZFGD is being carried on the backs of the non-residents, and the greedy AZ guys want to further eliminate tags (see all of AZ402's schemes posted).


Hey DanR,
I didn't see any posts or pictures of you hunting this past season. I am kinda thinking you don't hunt much. You aren't frequenting these hunting boards hoping to hook up with ugly wimmin agaian are you? hump

 

[danr55]

No gummer, I'm not.. I just like to cruise these boards to keep up on the scum sucking lawyers who try to interject thier far left, liberal ideas and convert the hard core conservatives to their way of thinking.. Speaking of which, you never did tell me if you are a scum sucking, bottom feeding lawer or not. Are you?

Oh, as a point of information, I didn't hunt this year for two reasons. The primary of which has to do with some non resident drawing my elk tag..and as usual, you are only accounting for a small portion of the AZGF budget. There are several other venues of income for the AZGF. Hunt tags are only a portion of the revenue. So don't get carried away feeling like the state of Arizona will collapse if the non-res quit buying hunting licenses. It just ain't so... Hell, one Governors Elk Tag sold at auction last year brought in over $130,000....

 

[BuzzH]

Danr said, "Hell, one Governors Elk Tag sold at auction last year brought in over $130,000...."

And purchased by a resident or Non-Resident????

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

danr ,
You have totally misread the gummer , let me help ;
Reading Elkgunners' posts you picture a young snot-nosed lawyer , fresh out of college , brainwashed by liberal professors with no concept of the lifestyles or attitudes of everyday working class Americans , Right?

But what you don't realize is that 'he' is actually a 'she' !

Now her opinions make a little more sense don't they ?

What's frustrating about this USO topic is people like her and Buzz can't see the dangerous direction this lawsuit will take us in . It's not about non-resident tags , it's all about commercialized hunting for profit , non-resident hunters are only 'useful idiots' in this fiasco . Maybe when Buzz hikes in 20 miles to hunt and a USO chute plane flies over his head he'll see that .

 

[cjcj]

danr ,
You have totally misread the gummer , let me help ;
Reading Elkgunners' posts you picture a young snot-nosed lawyer , fresh out of college , brainwashed by liberal professors with no concept of the lifestyles or attitudes of everyday working class Americans , Right?

But what you don't realize is that 'he' is actually a 'she' !

Now her opinions make a little more sense don't they ?

What's frustrating about this USO topic is people like her and Buzz can't see the dangerous direction this lawsuit will take us in . It's not about non-resident tags , it's all about commercialized hunting for profit , non-resident hunters are only 'useful idiots' in this fiasco . Maybe when Buzz hikes in 20 miles to hunt and a USO chute plane flies over his head he'll see that .

Now that is some funny shit go gettum Danr55 and Fairchaseben this stuff is cracking me up.

 

[Delw]

Azg&F gets very very little money from gov tags if any at all.
most of it goes to the group who auctions it off ie rocky mountain elk foundation or whom ever. in the case of the elk tag.
so using the case that azg&f gets moneys from that is pretty much null and void.
AZG&F gets alot of its money from fishing licence sales, last 3 years do to major drought conditions azg&f has lost alot of licence sales which has hurt azg&f not to mention or dyke govenor locking AZG&F's general fund and causing kaos into areas where she dont belong ( ie the lion fiasco last year)


Wanna hear some stupid ideas where people dont think before they speak or give a proposal.

a extra bonus point for every year you have been a res.
a extra bonus point for every X amount of wildlife service
a extra bonus point for the X amount of land you own.
A extra bonus point for how each person in your immediate family that buys a hunting licence
A tag( at the people who turn them ins choice) giving away to the person or persons that turn in poachers + extra bonus points this ones great 10 people turn in a poacher and 10 people get a tag of thier choice.
a extra bonus point to people who buy and put in for all tags/ stamps and species( including fishing stamps and fishing licence's
a extra bonus point for every lion that you kill in a deer or elk area( points giving to specific species ie a deer area and you kill a lion you get a extra bonus point)
a extra bonus point for every game and fish meeting you attend

oh and the list keeps on going. these are some I remember off the top of my head

Whats funny is after a while and things settle down only a hand full of people are even concerned about it. but yet soon as a new rumor comes along or a new lawsuit starts everyone and there brother will start with rediculous ideas again.

Delw

 

[JoseCuervo]

Oh, as a point of information, I didn't hunt this year for two reasons. The primary of which has to do with some non resident drawing my elk tag..and as usual, you are only accounting for a small portion of the AZGF budget. There are several other venues of income for the AZGF. Hunt tags are only a portion of the revenue. So don't get carried away feeling like the state of Arizona will collapse if the non-res quit buying hunting licenses. It just ain't so... Hell, one Governors Elk Tag sold at auction last year brought in over $130,000....

LMAO at that one dAnR. The Deseret Sheep Society or somebody else auctioning tags for charity/habitat is definitely a good funding model for AZGFD to revert. I would love to see how many $130k tags you buy in your lifetime..... Lemme guess...... Uhhhh....maybe none?

You definitely have an "unique" insight into how to fund a Fish and Game agency.... Hey, speaking of questions you never answered, do you remember as you aged, at what age that you were first aware your mental capcities had began to shrink? And was it linear, or some sort of progressive deterioration that led you to this point, where you make dumb comments like that.....

Maybe you best head back to the "Curling Iron", and see if you can pick up some ugly chicks on a hunting bulletin board.....

And as for me trying to convert "conservatives", that is funny that you have so little faith in your fellow "conservatives" that you realize they are all so stupid, that they could be converted that easily..... hump

 

[JoseCuervo]

Wanna hear some stupid ideas where people dont think before they speak or give a proposal.

a extra bonus point for every year you have been a res.
a extra bonus point for every X amount of wildlife service
a extra bonus point for the X amount of land you own.
A extra bonus point for how each person in your immediate family that buys a hunting licence
A tag( at the people who turn them ins choice) giving away to the person or persons that turn in poachers + extra bonus points this ones great 10 people turn in a poacher and 10 people get a tag of thier choice.
a extra bonus point to people who buy and put in for all tags/ stamps and species( including fishing stamps and fishing licence's
a extra bonus point for every lion that you kill in a deer or elk area( points giving to specific species ie a deer area and you kill a lion you get a extra bonus point)
a extra bonus point for every game and fish meeting you attend

oh and the list keeps on going. these are some I remember off the top of my head

Delw

Thanks Del, I wonder if AZ402 can now see that most of these schemes are designed to "eliminate" access/opportunity for non-resident hunters.

AZ402, Do you actually not see the intent of all these schemes?

Straight up question: Do you think all these new "rules", "ideas", or "suggestions" are designed to INCREASE non-Res opportunity, or DECREASE non-Res opportunity?

 

[danr55]

Gummer, I appreciate your trying to help me with my social life, but I do fine without your advice.

I guess being a bottom feeder and looking up and everyone, you get a slightly diagonal view of things.. You should learn to take things a face value..

You claim that NR hunters are carrying the financial load for AZGF.. I sincerely, for your clients sake, hope you are better at litigating than you are at accounting.. Seems you are the one having trouble with linear thinking. Why can't you go from 1 tag for $130,000 = income for AZGF? It has nothing to do with my hunting or not hunting.

Do you confuse stuff like that when you are arguing a case for some poor druggy or a wife beater or .. well, you know what I mean.. Ha!HA!Ha!

 

[Delw]

ELkgunner and dan and a few others, You guys really know how to get at each others throats why dont you 2 lay off posting in the sportsman section for a while so you both can cool off.
I am not telling you to I am asking you too,

Delw

 

[AZ402]

EG, I've never seen any of those proposals in my life, only the ones I pulled off the AZGFD. I still can't find any literature on AZ eliminating non-resident hunting opportunities.

How about you ask Oscar for some podium time at the DHI banquet and propose your plan to eliminate the non-resident quota in ID. You seem to be the non-resident martyr here. Tell all in attendance that Stan from AZ will have as good a chance as they do for their early rifle bull tags or their rut mule deer hunts when your plan is done. See what kind of reaction you get from the ID resident hunters. I'm also aware that there are tags I can getin ID without going in the limited entry draw system. I do believe that ID has a 1 out of every 10 system in place. You also can come on down to AZ and hunt eveyday of teh year with your non-resident hunting license.

 

[BuzzH]

FCB,

I understand the issue, and thats why I chose to write letters in support of the AZ residents...you must have:

1. Not seen that part in my first couple posts
2. Been unable to comprehend simple English

The facts are that the AZGF had the opportunity to "cap" the NR tags at a guaranteed 10% at some point in time. They CHOSE not to do that and let the courts decide. They lost their ass on some poor advice by a $35K a year state attorney.

The main reason Taulman sued was self-serving, no question. What AZ should have done was just guaranteed NR's 10%, instead of NOT MORE THAN 10%...

Montana will be in the same boat with Goat, Sheep, Moose, special deer, special elk, and antelope as they have the NOT MORE THAN 10% rule.

Wyoming will not face Taulman in court, they GUARANTEE 25% of all their tags to NR's.

We arent a bunch of greedy residents.

 

[JoseCuervo]

AZ402,
I am more than happy to tell Idaho hunters that they either need to increase our funding of F&G or allow the non-Res to do it, and realize an associated decrease in resident tags. In 2004, I sent money to Fish and Game departments in Idaho, Alaska, Montana, Oregon, and Nevada for out of state hunting licenses. I am very aware of how much it non-Residents pay for the opportunity, or possible opportunity.

I also have no problem seeing Out of State license plates at the trail head of some of the places I hunt. It is not a big deal.

The other part that is funny here, is how the AZ guys whine about not drawing tags, but don't consider the fact that they can get Elk tags every year if they are willing to leave AZ. Of course, they can't "use their ATV off trail for game retrieval", so I guess that would eliminate most of them.....