Mercenary , fur harvester or Recreational hunter

[DAA]

I think I'm a recreational mercenary that harvests fur!

Seriously - with the very limited time I have to hunt, it's PURE recreation, for me. Wherever, whenever I call. But, I do in fact skin most of the coyotes I kill and make use of the fur. And, I have on occasion killed denning coyotes on private ground at the landowners request.

At the end of the day though, it's all about the pure enjoyment of it, so I'd have to say I'm a recreational caller first and foremost.

- DAA

 

[Dick Reece]

Yeah,that's what I was trying to give [poorly] as my opinion to Krusty,it's all about enjoyment,each of us may pursue it in a slightly different form.

 

[Slydog]

This thread is only asking everyone to "self evaluate" and to conclude this in the end, Its damn hard if not impossable to make a living on fur. Its hard to make a living on depridation and realy if you don't like hunting predators your certanly not going to spend the kind of money that it takes, for all the trap of the trade, to do something you don't like to do.

Everyone has a reason that they hunt coyotes or all predators for that matter, the bottom line is that we all love the challenge and flat out we love the sport.

As DAA so elegantly put it: I think I'm a recreational mercenary that harvests fur!

I am a Mercenary that harvests fur and a recreational call maker,,,

this post is to make you think and for most of you it has....Ahhhhhhhhhhh success.

sly

 

[Krustyklimber]

MtO,

I did not mean to bring elicit or illegal activities to light because I do, or want to participate in it... only as an example of something that is not legal because society deems it so... even though (for the most part) the user is the one effected by it... much like alcohol.
And nakedness doesn't hurt anyone, but it's not my bag either.

You see, there are things we didn't know about eachother that really bring emotions to a rise. Someone could have this same level of hostility towards those who are ruining their fun (like the hunters from the thick green part of my state have before, for going to the desert east of the mountains (on another board)) no matter how they are going about ruining it.

SE,

Well said.

It is the actions "you" are going to take in reaction to what I do that I am concerned with... for nadedity you'll "drop a dime".
What reaction might I get from armed men for ruining their honey hole?

As for how a coyote might be educated by a photographer, often times I have read where you should stop a coyote for the shot (rifle) before he winds you.
With a camera he is going to do just that wind you, then associating that sound and situation, with a jester of a man... probably reacting negatively to the next man with a calling sound like mine.
I can't imagine having to go out to where Rich Higgins may have been filming and trying to call in a coyote who's been hit over the head with a tripod (to make it stop trying to eat the big fat rabbit in camo clothes), or one who'd been painted red with a squirtgun last month.

New hunters already seem to take a lot of "flak" for being too unskilled to closed the deal... thus educating critters. I only imagined that would be more true of camera hunters.

I am really having difficulty figuring out where I fit in with all of this, or if I even do.
Thanks for your patience and assistance,

Maybe all I am is a dude who makes calls for a hobby...

Jeff

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 07-01-2003 23:21: Message edited by: Krustyklimber ]</font>

 

[Dick Reece]

Here's where knowing something about the nature of any wild animal helps.Any creature will stop and look on his own,he doesn't need whistle stopped or anything else.In the several videos I've watched so far this summer,all the coyotes presented shots on there own, they didn't need stopped.I think most of the ones needing stopped are either the ones charging right in,or the ones who've busted you anyway.Most wild creatures don't wander around unaware of what's around them.They all stop frequently and smell that air,observe,and listen.It's one onf the things that makes them wild and keeps them wild

Personally,I'm not going to worry about where I fit in,I'm going to go out when it's time and do my best to legally kill coyotes.If any hunter,professional or otherwise,wants to give me crap about what I'm doing, he may find out the best thing for him to do is mind his own buisness.

I think you fit in just like the rest of us,you're an American,you have a license,when the time is right,go call them and shoot them with a camera or a gun.Even using a camera,you should have some sort of hand cannon in your possession,for the aggressive predators that may come in.

Have fun,do it legally,and to hell with what some possessive idiot hunter thinks.People like that shouldn't be in the woods to start with.Get there license number,spend a dime,and remove there redneck butt from the woods legally and permanently.

 

[Pup]

I have mixed thoughts on the called and recalled coyotes. I have been hunting with Rich Higgins, and have been in spots where He is on a personal relationship with some of them, meaning that he has called them back time and time again.

On the other hand in my area, I have had some come in and not present themselves with a shot, busted me and I have not had success from that spot for the rest of the season. Now I would go to the other side and get one to come. Kinda like fishing try it form the other side, or change baits.


Maybe Rich it is just that Rich is a better caller than myself. He makes a good howler and can flat out work a call.


I would not shoot pics at a spot that I know my buddies are trying to hunt, or where landowners are having problems. Why create hardships for somebody else, is what I am thinking there. If it is public access, I would do what I wanted, you pay the taxes, knock yourself out.

I would also add that parks where hunting is not allowed makes for some easy calling, If the rangers will let you call.

Stopping coyotes where you want them is a good lesson learned. It will help with making the shots. It is a whole lot better to use that control than to let the coyote get in a postion to bust you. A simple bark, will stop them, yet will not always spook them from coming on in.

later pup

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 07-02-2003 08:53: Message edited by: Pup ]</font>

 

[Dick Reece]

Just to clarify,all my comments relate to public land,it is all I hunt,and I find it a bigger challenge to succeed on public land at any type hunting than private land.

 

[ColdNosed]

Krusty, Rich Higgins calls the same coyotes several times throughout the year, yet they continue to respond to his calls. He truly has forgotten more than I will ever know about coyotes. I can’t play a tune on a howler, or squealer like Rich, but I believe I could call a coyote down in that area.

I’m surly not going to fault Rich for what he is doing. Nor am I going to fault you for your choices. Have you noticed that photos of wolves are everywhere? Where is the coyote artwork? Maybe I’m looking in the wrong places.

Many believe that if you call one in and don’t shoot at him, he can be called again. There are things that I believe make it more difficult for me in my area, but photographers are not it.

BTW If he isn’t centered in the frame, you missed.

 

[No Shoes]

Hey Sly,
Riddle me this. Coons like to eat crawdads,minners and a few other live things.They also like to sneak up on a unsuspecting can of mustard tuna and a persimmon on occasion. Does that make them a predator? If so I hunted 'em because it was damn fun trompin through the swamp in the middle of the night listenin' to the bay of my Redbones. Sometimes we let em' go,sometimes we shot em'. But we always had fun and that's what it's all about.
Guess Who?

P.S. Hey Maineiac & Crow Woman. How are ya'll doin'. Formerly Lil'Dawg of that other forum. The new name is more me.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 07-02-2003 23:25: Message edited by: No Shoes ]</font>

 

[Slydog]

People,
First of all I find it offencive to read about how much "flak" we(the vetran) hunters give the rookies.We were rookies once also. It realy gets old listening to 1 out of 100 wine about unfair treatment and about how we don't want the new guys to know anything. That is such a crock of chit... Helloo, this is a hunting forum. We tell our secrets every day for those who will pay attention and want to learn. I myself have spent 1/2 of my life teaching others how to hunt and so have many of the others here at this board.

2nd some people spend to much time worring about what others will think or how others will react if they try something new or diffrent... Thats how you learn. Predator calling on public or private land is leagle, your worried about making someone mad because you want to call predators and take photos not fur... This is one reason that most predator hunters who do hunt for the fur won't take people to their honey holes. They will take them out to teach them how to call just not where they make their money.

predator calling can be taught to almost anyone but common sence can't be taught it is a learned behaveyour. Fighting with folks don't make them want to help you.


Krusty,
You will fit in if you allow yourself to and stop worring about the small chit. You seem to have many talents and are very good on the computer. Your calls are looking good and from what I hear they sound good also. Seems to me you are fitting in quite well.

People here at Hunt Talk aren't going to gangbang or jump you like a dog for having an opinyon, relax and get to know everyone you will find we're not that bad.


Now lets get back to positive posts and positive energy

We're in the house of Moosie, let the fun begin

 

[Maineiac the original]

No shoes, boyah where you been hiden at. I hated too, but I had ta eat all that conbread dressin' with out ya, Bo.

I bet ain't no body called ya Bo since you were down home? After being in South Carolina for spell I thought my name was Bo.

I hope you doin' well. Stop by more, I miss seein ya, Bo.

 

[No Shoes]

Hey Maineiac, I was hoping I'd from you.
I've been good , how 'bout you? What part of S.C. were you in. What made you go all the way down there?

 

[Slydog]

No shoes is from so far south he was only 3 steps north of wet. I think all that water stunted his growth.

I'm just funnin ya Gene

sly

 

[Nut]

As soemone who is just starting out, I am sure I will have many blunders since it will be from the school of learn as you go. But I would hope to be at one point all 3 of the types mentioned.

But I do want to know where I can hunt them critters naked! I would do that for sure.

 

[Krustyklimber]

Coldnosed,

By no means did I intend to single out or criticize what Mr. Higgins might want to do... he's the only example I could think of.

Slydog,

I am sure your just as sick of hearing it as I am... I did not mention the fact that experienced hunters don't like "sharing the wealth" of land or knowledge... that is a debate for another day.

I mentioned the fact that other experienced hunters have accused me and my neighbors of ruining the sport for them, by crossing the mountains to hunt easier public grounds (I can provide quotes if you like).

I sure didn't think I was whining about it, by mentioning that the concerns of my fellow man are my concern also.

I never intended to pick a fight, and I certainly I am not willing to get in one.
If I am fitting in, why do you accuse me of hostility and why do I feel like I just got jumped by you?

Just like on Predator Masters... I will let this issue go, it seems to piss off the moderators, and I don't seem to get any real answers to my questions.

Thanks anyways

Jeff

P.S. I have been a member of this site for a long time, I thought I knew how things went on here before Slydog the Moderator.
I will try to work under your watchful eye... as long as you'll allow me to, I had a feeling when you were made moderator my days here were numbered.

 

[Moosie]

Krusty, I'm guessing your days are only Numbered if ya let them be...

Make it simple, ASK one question and I aand others will answer it. I read your post and Don't quiet know what You're looking for ?!?! MAKe it simple for the Simple minded... I'll give you an Example :

Question : What is your Favorite Color..
Answer : Cammo

See........ Easy

This Isn't Pred. Masters, yote gods forums, or anything else. It's My house, And I open it up to All that want to kick off their shoes to have a good time. You've kicked off your Shoes in the Past but seem to be walking around with them on trying to stomp in here since Sly's become a mod. Kick off the shoes again bud, if you two had a past (Which I haven't followed) It's non of My business.

BEFORE I get bashed for not answering any Questions here is my take on your Questions :

1.Is it appropriate to call to a camera?

MY Answer is Hell no, If I want to Video or takea snapshot of something I have my rights to do so. I'd jsut as soon Kill a Yote then Take a picture but maybe thats just me.

2. Because you are educating the animals to the call?

My Answer: Actually Yes, I think animals Get Edjucated, But so do Ducks and Geese and elk . If I'm Bugleing for Practice I'll call and work them and Try to slip out Un noticed. Becaue if I don't, It will screw up chances later.. BUT ya never get better not working the real situation.

DING, "Fries are done", Time to get back to work......

 

[Krustyklimber]

Moosie,

That a moderator doesn't have access to the ban button is news to me... I figured he had the power to make me not be able to post here. My mistake (I hope).

You say that since Slydog has become moderator I am stomping around?
Sly became moderator on or about 6-17-03, since then I have made a total of five posts to this site (this one being six)... four (now five) of them have been in this thread, and one was a joke about how I require bullets in a varmint gun. In the first two in this thread I never addressed Slydog, but the problem I am having coming to terms with killing or not... I did not address Slydog personally until he accused me of whining and of the same hostility you now accuse me of?

And in that one post I thought I addressed Slydog politely, and in the spirit of what a forum board is supposed to be... I said "I never intended to pick a fight, and I certainly am not willing to get in one"...

I said I didn't want to fight, and I don't still... where is all this supposed hostility from me being displayed?

Personally I don't see the moral issues, I am wrestling with, as small "stuff"... it means the world to me.

But obviously, it doesn't mean as much to everyone else here, I can live with that.

I will sort out the answers for myself... or I will be confused by myself.
I didn't think that's why I joined this board, but hey it's your board.

Thank you for the straightest answers I got here. See no bashing from me.

I thought people wouldn't find it appropriate, but I don't understand why you don't.
As for your second answer I am not sure I understand what you mean to say at all.

Sly and I did have some history, and I thought it was all water under the bridge. I am not the one who brought up his calls, or his computer skills... and I don't understand how either are relevant to this conversation?
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> People here at Hunt Talk aren't going to gangbang or jump you like a dog for having an opinyon <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno what you and Slydog are on me about then, if it isn't my opinions???
Is it my grammar? Or my math? Spelling?

I did say it seems as if newbies take a lot of "flak"... (opinion)
And that I thought my days would be numbered... (opinion)
And that I was having difficulty knowing if I fit in... (opinion)

Seems to me you guys got a crock of your own, and it don't smell like butter.

Jeff

 

[Moosie]

My bad.. I assumed those were alot of smart alec,"set up" comments. Using Quotes and telling the other person what they were trying to say.... But I'm new to that since I haven't ever done that before

(Notice the Smiles, that means I'm being sarcastic

)

"That a moderator doesn't have access to the ban button is news to me"

That would be news to me too ? DID I ever say they didn't ? I said it was MY board and everyones Welcome (Something like that, I hate getting the Exact quotes..

"he accused me of whining and of the same hostility you now accuse me of"

I never accused you of Hostility, I said you were stomping around. It's not what ya say, It's how ya say it. Maybe the word "STOMPING" was harsh, I'll take that word. When I asked Slydog if there was History in an Email, he said a little but it was under the bridge. Funny you said that too.. YET I could pick up on it so easly. Once again, I'm not new to causing trouble.. Ask about 9 other hunting boards about Moosie. From Huntinfo to Hunting america to Monstermulies... HEll Even Yoopers board, Which I'm currently "BANNED" from.

Also, If you weren't trying anything you would have come back with a question.. Yet, inthe 10 Question marks you posted, HArdly a question was Asked...

As far as your Grammer and Typing you're light years ahead of someone like me, So no worries on that

I do have a question though, Were these Sencere (SP?) Comments or a little "STOMPING/DIGGING" ?

"I didn't think that's why I joined this board, but hey it's your board."

"I figured he had the power to make me not be able to post here. My mistake (I hope).

"

Remember, Smile, Moosie loves ya !!

PS, What was your question again

 

[Moosie]

Crap, I feel like a Newbie doing back to back posts

"As for your second answer I am not sure I understand what you mean to say at all."

K-Climber, I was telling you that you are educating the Coyote if you call one in and it busts out of there without you shooting it. So my answer is "YES". But sometimes that happens. so my second part is "SO WHAT?"

I hunt more big Game so I can relate that more to Elk calling. I go out and Practice. I even go out in the Archery season and throw out a call. Sometimes with bow in hand, Sometimes not. Whether that's "ACCEPTED" I'm guessing it's up to each's own. But I think in order to get better at calling you need to practice too. You don't have to have a gun in hand to be hunting.

And hunting a smart animal isn't all that bad, Otherwise it would be Easy if they always ran in all the time anyways, right ?

Did any of that make sence to anyone besides me ?

 

[Krustyklimber]

OK straight up questions...

Can a moderator ban a user?

So, the number of my days left here could be decided by someone other than me?

Even Slydog?

Have I broken any rules here?

Where did I do any "stomping"?

Am I actually welcome here?

Did I make a mistake accepting an invitation to join this site?

Is one Slydog more important than a new member?

What will happen to this site, or this sport, if newbies aren't made to feel welcome here?

Do you really think Slydog represents your site well?

Do you know that if Slydog said we have a "little history" he's hugely underestimating the ordeal (read lying)? ...we had a huge blowout, or three, one even over the phone when I was woke up in the middle of the night.

There you go, eleven question marks, ten serious questions and one infoquestion ("stomping").

Jeff