should teachers be armed, at school

[sweetnectar]

Not everyone is trained in first aid in this country and some are better at it then others. So if you try and save someones life with first aid and you mess up are you at fault? There is a good Samaritan law that says you aren't.
And who said teachers have to have a pistol? How about the school secretary or principle having a shotgun if they want. It would make the head shot a little easier when the murder is blasting his way through the window to gain entry and perhaps be put down before he can gain entry to a kindergarten classroom.
As for unions I don't know as much about them as Buzz but I was always under the impression that unions are for the union members. So why would a union deny its members tools that can help them be safe? I would think the unions would fight for the rights of their members to be able to choose to have a weapon. Now I can see a union fighting for more security but a union not fighting for the right of its members to choose doesn't make sense to me.
One thing that I do like that I see in Billings is that some of the schools get a city cop. The cop has an office and does his/her paperwork from the various cases they are involved in. I think they rotate in and out a bit but I like the idea of cops doing paperwork at a school instead of a police station.

 

[tjones]

This is a good topic, but no one has all the answers. I think first of all that the parents of the students should have some say in it. They should be involved in the details and let it go to a vote needed on if a school district should allow it or not.

I think you missed my point. Just because a teacher wants to carry a gun to school doesn't mean the should, should meaning qualified.

I been to the rifle range the day before season and I see hunters that should be no where near a firearm.

 

[whiskeydog]

the other problem with teachers having guns is that schools have extremely thin "partition style" walls. bullets would go a long way after a miss! yeah, i realize that if a teacher pops of 3 shots and hits a student as well as the gunman, it's better than the gunman killing 20...but still a consideration.

 

[sweetnectar]

Whisky, there is ammunition available that won't penetrate the second layer of drywall and kills people dead. SWAT likes to use it for that purpose. I don't know on the divider thing but I imagine it is similar.

 

[Art Vandeley]

what this guy said, mental health access needs to be free.

What has this world come to when people have to go therapy to realize that shooting a bunch of innocent people is wrong .

 

[huntme]

I am an avid hunter, own several guns, have a conceal carry permit, and would rather die than give up the 2nd amendment. that being said, arming teachers, whether they want to carry or not, is asinine. consider this...take a school has excellent security, metal detectors, etc which make it extremely difficult to get a gun past the front door. now arm your teachers. someone wants to shoot up the school, so where do they get the gun? easy...just knock down your 105 pound home economics teacher and take hers. schools are for education, and teachers are for teaching. a simple concealed carry class does not make them qualified to respond with force...they would be much better served to do what many of the heroes in CT did...spend their efforts in guiding kids to safety. the only way i would ever endorse guns in our schools would be with a properly trained security guard. if a school wanted to maintain a "teacher react force" made of teachers who had been through extensive training (and by extensive, i mean several weeks and several thousand rounds), i would buy off if the "react" guns were kept locked-up for emergencies only.

all you people out there that are parents,how far would you go to protect your children?
i do not have children,but i would go by what i was taught by my father,and i know to this day that my father would go to the gates of hell,fighting for me and my brothers and sister.
so what makes you think that one of these parents, or teacher,or maybe both parent and teacher,would not defend there kids,and maybe your,the same way,yet people want to tie your hands and tell you that because you are in a school,a bank,or any place else your kids might be,you cant use all means possible to protect them,if you learn to shoot,shoot often,and qualify to carry a C.W,then by all means you should be able to carry your weapon,even in a school,and i know that young man would of shot the security guard,because he would not of had a gun,because it is against the law to carry it.
and now what happens if he does get past the armed guard,then the nut job has a free rain to kill,because there is no one between him and your kids.
but if a teacher,or maybe 4 or 5 teachers are armed,one of them might have a chance to kill the nutjob.:W:- the nut job,and what he might do if fired on by another person carring a gun,like a teacher.:hump:

 

[Oak]

What has this world come to when people have to go therapy to realize that shooting a bunch of innocent people is wrong .

It has nothing to do with "what this world has come to." Thanks for making the point that one big problem with mental illness is that many people don't understand it.

 

[schmalts]

Schmalts,

Give up...its a dumb idea.

Yea your right. And a CCW holder has never stopped a robbery, a murder, a mall shooting, a rape, a car jacking. So denying a volunteering, qualified teacher a gun in a secure lock box in a school is way worst than a undefended slaughter because your unions may not like it, or it may cost the tax payers a couple grand in tax money, some range time, ammo ,and a finger print lock box.
And besides, look at how many kids and bystanders have been killed by school teachers that already have a CCW permit and carry outside of the school. Look at how many rookie wannabee CCW holders have killed scores of people all over. Maybe your right, ALL teachers are all cowards, terrible shots, and too stupid to own a gun. All of them would make the body count way higher in a school shooting, there is only but more to lose by letting a teacher who also teaches hunter safety and is an avid shooter have that. I would much rather see him cower in the corner waiting for the police who dont show up until the last bullet is put in the shooters head self inflicted.

 

[schmalts]

. someone wants to shoot up the school, so where do they get the gun? easy...just knock down your 105 pound home economics teacher and take hers. schools are for education, and teachers are for teaching.

Kind of hard to do if it is kept in a lock box and never taken out until the alarm goes off.

 

[Nemont]

Yea your right. And a CCW holder has never stopped a robbery, a murder, a mall shooting, a rape, a car jacking. So denying a volunteer teacher a gun in a secure lock box in a school is way worst than a undefended slaughter because your unions may not like it, or it may cost the tax payers a couple grand in tax money, some range time, ammo ,and a finger print lock box.
And besides, look at how many kids and bystanders have been killed by school teachers that already have a CCW permit and carry outside of the school. Look at how many rookie wannabee CCW holders have killed scores of people all over. Maybe your right, ALL teachers are all cowards, terrible shots, and too stupid to own a gun. All of them would make the body count way higher in a school shooting, there is only but more to lose.

Really? It has zero to do with the intelligence of teachers, it has to do with what is the correct course of action. It can't be based just on emotions that are currently raw due to this recent event.

http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/Chann...pdates-school-transportation-crash-stats.aspx

Homicides In Schools


From 1993 to 2010, the number of homicides committed at primary and secondary schools by students has steadily shrunk.

http://www.npr.org/2012/03/16/148758783/violence-in-schools-how-big-a-problem-is-it

again far more kids are killed every year by bus accidents than are killed by shooting. Not to minimize these deaths but arming teachers won't achieve the results you want. If you truly want to worry about your kids, you should worry twice as much about them being killed on a bus than by a shooter.

Reacting with emotion rather than reason almost leads to stupid policies.

Nemont

 

[schmalts]

Nemont, your not going to get me to disagree with you on that last post. The disagreement is only that you think in a case of when a school mass shooting happens, that the whole thing is better off with the shooter being the only one with a gun. Not going to convince me that the couple teachers I know would have added to the body count in every case.

 

[Art Vandeley]

It has nothing to do with "what this world has come to." Thanks for making the point that one big problem with mental illness is that many people don't understand it.

Yep, I do not understand it at all.

 

[schmalts]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luke_Woodham
Nemont, would it have been better if there was no gun in the employee's car?. The shooter was headed to another school. Just sayin. Yes maybe the cops would have got him before he got to the other school, maybe not.

 

[bjtc_brian]

I don't know that I am for or against teachers having guns. I think if a teacher feels they can save some childrens lives in a situation like this with a gun, then it is something that should be looked at. Whatever we are doing now isn't working. I also pose this question, do you think the teachers that were killed trying to "disarm" the psycho would rather have had a gun to use in this situation. I am not saying it would definitely work, but I do know, not having one didn't work.

And by the way, you don't have to be a crack shot to shoot a judge!

 

[BuzzH]

What has this world come to when people have to go therapy to realize that shooting a bunch of innocent people is wrong .

You'll understand it when a friend or family member commits suicide...must be nice to live your sheltered life.:W:

Suicide is not the act of a rational person with proper mental health...just like shooting a bunch of innocent people isnt either.

I also believe if you think therapy alone will cure these problems...maybe you should check your mental health.

 

[bjtc_brian]

Also, I think there are other options. For one, I don't know if this school used this technique or not, but my daughters school has a "locked door" rule. The door locks when the teacher walks out and has to be opened with the key. My sons school does not do this. Not much, but might have helped a little.

Also, I am for having armed guards, metal detectors, etc.

It is sad these things happen, and we will probably NEVER stop or have all the answers, but I think ALL options should be looked at. Our kids should not have to be scared to go to school nor should parents be scared to send their kids to school.

Oh yeah, I can't bring myself to read or watch anything on this. I have 3 kids under 8 that are my life, and it makes me physically sick to think about.

 

[schmalts]

Also, I think there are other options. For one, I don't know if this school used this technique or not, but my daughters school has a "locked door" rule. The door locks when the teacher walks out and has to be opened with the key. My sons school does not do this. Not much, but might have helped a little.

Also, I am for having armed guards, metal detectors, etc.

It is sad these things happen, and we will probably NEVER stop or have all the answers, but I think ALL options should be looked at. Our kids should not have to be scared to go to school nor should parents be scared to send their kids to school.

Not sure of all the media, but I read he broke a window.
Buzz I understand mental illness and how hard it is on families. My family tried to commit a family member that was self destructing. It is damn near impossible to get a person put in, and kept there to get help if they know the right things to say to the shrinks these days. That is a good place to start with all of this.

 

[whyelkhunt]

It has nothing to do with "what this world has come to." Thanks for making the point that one big problem with mental illness is that many people don't understand it.

Good post, If the answer was easy we would have this solved.

 

[jerrym]

I am a teacher and when I want to do a little hunting after school and have a firearm in my truck I need to park off school property. I can't see our district wanting me to carry a gun. I don't want to carry a gun, and I have a concealed carry permit. I want to teach.

I have heard parents here saying we need a security guard, but where I live they never pass a mill levy and our school district needs to run at 86 % of their budget. Everybody wants more things for schools but don't want to pay for them. School security guards would be great, but where I live they want no tax increase or levies for schools.

 

[shoots-straight]

I am a teacher and when I want to do a little hunting after school and have a firearm in my truck I need to park off school property. I can't see our district wanting me to carry a gun. I don't want to carry a gun, and I have a concealed carry permit. I want to teach.

I have heard parents here saying we need a security guard, but where I live they never pass a mill levy and our school district needs to run at 86 % of their budget. Everybody wants more things for schools but don't want to pay for them. School security guards would be great, but where I live they want no tax increase or levies for schools.

It's the same where I live. Oh, wait, where you live I live.

I think there could be a higher degree of hoops to jump through in getting through the doors of a school. If an alarm went off the doors could automatically lock only to be opened from inside. ( In case of fire) . The technology is there for this. This would keep individual rooms safe. JMO