Montana season structure proposal 2.0

[INMT]

No, you could still hunt both species of deer during the archery season.

Thanks for the clarification. I’ve read through the proposal but didn’t connect the dots.

 

[DFS]

I just don’t see enough protections for region 6 and 7 to get very fired up about this plan. We are going to see the same amount of nonresidents and western Montana hunters for 2 months instead of 5 weeks. It is going to increase landowner fatigue. The benefit I do see is taking the rut out of mule deer season. With western Montana and nonresident pressure it still won’t be a quality hunt. You could have a jackalope hunt in August and people would bring their campers out for it. Taking pick your region out of the plan is darn near a deal breaker for me.

 

[4ohSick]

I get what your saying - but my point was largely about getting the average montanan in for it.

With the added benefit of getting way more people burning mule deer points. Even just like 10 rut hunt permits per general unit would clear out hundreds of higher point holders and help make the truly premium units more achievable for the people who are willing to hold out. I'd be a big fan of this adjustment.

 

[cgasner1]

I just don’t see enough protections for region 6 and 7 to get very fired up about this plan. We are going to see the same amount of nonresidents and western Montana hunters for 2 months instead of 5 weeks. It is going to increase landowner fatigue. The benefit I do see is taking the rut out of mule deer season. With western Montana and nonresident pressure it still won’t be a quality hunt. You could have a jackalope hunt in August and people would bring their campers out for it. Taking pick your region out of the plan is darn near a deal breaker for me.

When we sat down as a group we discussed goals first thing. The goal we all wanted was for mule deer to not be shot in November with a center fire. The biggest push back we have gotten really is that all the change is to radical in a sense of if it works we won’t know why. Was it moving the dates or pick your region or the pick your species. I’ve said from the beginning that I felt any change that would be made would have to be death by a thousand cuts. This plan even without the region is a serious step in the right direction. It lays a lot of ground work with mandatory reporting and other things to get fwp better data. With that data if we can get this pushed thru adding a regional cap or anything else down the road would be easier for them with having actual numbers to do so

 

[Forkyfinder]

With the added benefit of getting way more people burning mule deer points. Even just like 10 rut hunt permits per general unit would clear out hundreds of higher point holders and help make the truly premium units more achievable for the people who are willing to hold out. I'd be a big fan of this adjustment.

Make more people a fan .... More seasons and places to chop both deer/elk points up is a big enough sell to me to not care about mule deer season as much at all..... Itd be like adding several major draw units to both deer and elk (if it was 5 even per area) in terms of draw odds we would see a rare improvement or flatline.

Literally everyone complains about draw odds. Youd have so many quality hunt choices and places to put your points....

 

[mthunter33]

To whom it may concern.

First off thank you for your support on protecting Montana’s big game populations. I have to say after reading your groups proposal it does seem to favor a bit more of an outfitter and large land owners approach. Personally I’ve been hunting Montana for almost 20 years and I’ve seen the populations rise and fall. I agree that’s really frustrating especially when your hard earned dollars are supposed to support the big game resource. The issues with your proposal are there are too many moving parts it’s over complicated and most Montanans won’t go for it. Montanas love the freedom of the hunt not restrictions that benefit the large land owner or outfitters. We must keep it simple and I believe we can achieve it very simply with only a few tweaks. First off we need to eliminate the land owner tags this is largely a money grab and doesn’t support the average Montana Hunter that will incentivize more Block Management for the average hunter. To maintain healthy deer populations we must eliminate either sex tags, B tags when a unit is stressed and it must happen swiftly not after the population is in such decline. Either sex A tags should be allowed for youth 10-15y without the youngsters success coming up we won’t maintain a population of stewards to look over the land for the future. Then in stressed areas go to 3 point or better for bucks. Maybe we add a couple of additional trophy units to help prop up surrounding units until population increases. Predator management, make Incentives for coyotes and wolves. We must keep it simple, Montana is not any other state we’re our Own and so can be our ideas and processes. Simple is the way forward to achieve success to many moving parts or limiting opportunities will only hurt the average hunter. Unfortunately big money has dictated our hunting for too long. Let’s make simple changes that benefit most and preserve our heritage as hunters.

 

[Muleyassassin406]

When we sat down as a group we discussed goals first thing. The goal we all wanted was for mule deer to not be shot in November with a center fire. The biggest push back we have gotten really is that all the change is to radical in a sense of if it works we won’t know why. Was it moving the dates or pick your region or the pick your species. I’ve said from the beginning that I felt any change that would be made would have to be death by a thousand cuts. This plan even without the region is a serious step in the right direction. It lays a lot of ground work with mandatory reporting and other things to get fwp better data. With that data if we can get this pushed thru adding a regional cap or anything else down the road would be easier for them with having actual numbers to do so

There is one thing that most of us do know living in regions 6 and 7 is that we will still be over run with people until we get pick your region with caps… basically we won’t see a difference except everyone will be packed in R6 and 7 for a month instead of 5 weeks and the deer hunting will be worse then it is now… that is if there is much for any deer left after the slaughter begins in 2 days

 

[cgasner1]

There is one thing that most of us do know living in regions 6 and 7 is that we will still be over run with people until we get pick your region with caps… basically we won’t see a difference except everyone will be packed in R6 and 7 for a month instead of 5 weeks and the deer hunting will be worse then it is now… that is if there is much for any deer left after the slaughter begins in 2 days

A couple things that have worried me about region caps. First is the numbers would more than likely be set so high due to lack of information it wouldn’t make a difference you’d still see a ridiculous amount of pressure. By removing pick your region it can allow hunters to stay more fluid and move around and try to possibly escape pressure. The second thing would be a guy coming over from region 2 with a region 7 deer tag will more than likely shoot a buck before he leaves 7. Especially if he isn’t coming back for the remainder of season. Given the opportunity to maybe day hunt closer to his home he might let a young buck walk that he wouldn’t have. The problem with both our ideas is we don’t have great numbers and it’s speculative. All I know is a shooters gonna shoot

 

[Flatbrimmer]

Great point.. these guys would be upset if they picked their own home region and then couldn’t escape the pressure that they demanded everyone mark ahead of time… I know I’d let a youngn walk if I could still hunt close to home. You guys are doing a good job. I’m following along.

 

[antlerradar]

To whom it may concern.

First off thank you for your support on protecting Montana’s big game populations. I have to say after reading your groups proposal it does seem to favor a bit more of an outfitter and large land owners approach. Personally I’ve been hunting Montana for almost 20 years and I’ve seen the populations rise and fall. I agree that’s really frustrating especially when your hard earned dollars are supposed to support the big game resource. The issues with your proposal are there are too many moving parts it’s over complicated and most Montanans won’t go for it. Montanas love the freedom of the hunt not restrictions that benefit the large land owner or outfitters. We must keep it simple and I believe we can achieve it very simply with only a few tweaks. First off we need to eliminate the land owner tags this is largely a money grab and doesn’t support the average Montana Hunter that will incentivize more Block Management for the average hunter. To maintain healthy deer populations we must eliminate either sex tags, B tags when a unit is stressed and it must happen swiftly not after the population is in such decline. Either sex A tags should be allowed for youth 10-15y without the youngsters success coming up we won’t maintain a population of stewards to look over the land for the future. Then in stressed areas go to 3 point or better for bucks. Maybe we add a couple of additional trophy units to help prop up surrounding units until population increases. Predator management, make Incentives for coyotes and wolves. We must keep it simple, Montana is not any other state we’re our Own and so can be our ideas and processes. Simple is the way forward to achieve success to many moving parts or limiting opportunities will only hurt the average hunter. Unfortunately big money has dictated our hunting for too long. Let’s make simple changes that benefit most and preserve our heritage as hunters.

There is nothing more friendly to landowners and outfitters that are looking to just make money than the current season. The current season is a big part of why so much private land in MT is commercialized. @Eric Albus and @Big Shooter will tell you some of the stiffest opposition to this proposal is coming from other outfitters.

 

[INMT]

I support the proposal as is. It’s already a big change from the status quo and will take some serious selling to get a majority of Montanans on board.

Making folks pick a region based on arbitrary caps without hard data will be dead in the water.

I for one would struggle with supporting pick your region. I live on the border of two regions and hunt both interchangeably. I live in one and my best friend and main hunting partner lives in the other. Cry me a river, I know. Just my perspective.

You don’t have to worry about me degrading your experience, I’ve never hunted 3, 5, 6, or 7 and really have no desire to.

 

[OpenCountry]

Great point.. these guys would be upset if they picked their own home region and then couldn’t escape the pressure that they demanded everyone mark ahead of time… I know I’d let a youngn walk if I could still hunt close to home. You guys are doing a good job. I’m following along.

A lot of us willingly lock ourselves into a much smaller area than an entire region for archery elk right now. Wouldn’t be upset one bit about being locked into an entire region of the state for deer. The only thing in this proposal that might help is not hunting mule deer in the rut. That’s just an assumption at this point without limiting the amount of pressure 6&7 get.

 

[Flatbrimmer]

A lot of us willingly lock ourselves into a much smaller area than an entire region for archery elk right now. Wouldn’t be upset one bit about being locked into an entire region of the state for deer. The only thing in this proposal that might help is not hunting mule deer in the rut. That’s just an assumption at this point without limiting the amount of pressure 6&7 get.

It says you’re in SW Montana? You traveling to 6&7 for fruitless Breaks archery and mulie dinks too?????

 

[Flatbrimmer]

Lock in, bro!

 

[OpenCountry]

It says you’re in SW Montana? You traveling to 6&7 for fruitless Breaks archery and mulie dinks too?????

Born and raised 14 miles from the Canadian border and started hunting it in 97. I’ve seen what it was and what it is now. Keep enjoying the glory days bud.

 

[Flatbrimmer]

Born and raised 14 miles from the Canadian border and started hunting it in 97. I’ve seen what it was and what it is now. Keep enjoying the glory days bud.

I don’t disagree that the highline used to be the go-to for exceptional mule deer hunting. Still the go to but far from exceptional. Dunno why you picked my comment of all of them to respond to? I said I’m watching and they’re doing a good job? I’m excited to see some change. I’m excited at the thought of seeing what a mule deer can REALLY grow into! I don’t think I’m the one that’s still “living in the glory days”…

When and IF I get a big muley, which will be my first mule deer, (because I know how they’re supposed to look), I will drop the exact pin on HuntTalk.



………Need a whaaburger wit dem French cries…..

 

[FREAK]

Just take the antelope regs, do a ‘find-replace’ antelope with mule deer and submit that.

I'm with you on this and it was my feedback when the proposal first came out.

I personally like the proposal but I do think it’s a lot of moving parts and will make it difficult to gain traction with the average public hunter and FWP. I just think of all the people at work going on about how many b tags they filled over the weekend.

Antelope regs are something FWP and hunters are already familiar with. Just copy paste but also implement the mandatory reporting so you can adjust quotas accordingly. Then cut 2.5 weeks off the back end of deer season and add an extra week or two to the front end of all the mountain units. Keep the prairie a short season with limited special permits for rut hunts. Just some ideas. Everything’s struggling but deer seem to be in the worst condition. I’d focus on deer.

I don’t think a lot of people would give up the first two weeks of elk season to drive across the state to shoot a forky. People have limited time to hunt, and I think a lot of guys would apply for a deer tag for the same unit they’re elk hunting rather than a deer tag on opposite ends of the state. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Shed God]

Be interesting to see a poll just on hunt talk.

1. Otc October vs LE

2. Close numbers to say maybe wyoming but a few more incentives towards outfitters on tags allocated to residents, non resident, landowners, throw in outfitters. Just a yes or no thing, whether u agree on tag allocation.

 

[Fire_9]

Be interesting to see a poll just on hunt talk.

1. Otc October vs LE

2. Close numbers to say maybe wyoming but a few more incentives towards outfitters on tags allocated to residents, non resident, landowners, throw in outfitters. Just a yes or no thing, whether u agree on tag allocation.

Why do you keep bringing up LE? FWP told these guys from the beginning to bring them any idea EXCEPT LE. I agree LE might make sense but it is a waste of everyone’s time to talk about it as it I absolutely not going to happen in MT

 

[Forkyfinder]

Why do you keep bringing up LE? FWP told these guys from the beginning to bring them any idea EXCEPT LE. I agree LE might make sense but it is a waste of everyone’s time to talk about it as it I absolutely not going to happen in MT

@Shed God gets a little caught up in what should be instead of what is possible. Im not sure he remembers LE being a proposal killer.

Maybe a dumbarse way to phrase but some here will appreciate/understand - what can be, unburdened by what has been .