Anybody Buying Yet? Where’s the Bottom?

[BigHornRam]

Don’t remember anyone saying that taxing unrealized gains was a good idea. i think @TOGIE points out the position I support. If you take out a loan with your stock as collateral that loan should be taxed as income.

But also, as I understand the original idea, I don’t think if stock values fall they get a rebate. Still a horrible idea, but that would require a lot of creative accounting.

You must not listen to the news much then. This idea is about as horrible as you and TOGIEs loan tax.

There’s a growing interest in wealth taxes on the super-rich. Here’s why it hasn’t happened

Americans increasingly favor a wealth tax on the ultra-rich, but despite the uptick in proposals, these policies have struggled to gain traction.

www.cnbc.com

 

[TOGIE]

You must not listen to the news much then. This idea is about as horrible as you and TOGIEs loan tax.

There’s a growing interest in wealth taxes on the super-rich. Here’s why it hasn’t happened

Americans increasingly favor a wealth tax on the ultra-rich, but despite the uptick in proposals, these policies have struggled to gain traction.

www.cnbc.com

if the richest men in the world can get away with an effective income tax rate of under 5% i should be able to get away with it too.

let's not call it "taxing the rich" or "getting the wealthy to pay their fair share" let's just call it "getting the rich to actually pay a tax".... like everyone should

 

[BigHornRam]

if the richest men in the world can get away with an effective income tax rate of under 5% i should be able to get away with it too.

let's not call it "taxing the rich" or "getting the wealthy to pay their fair share" let's just call it "getting the rich to actually pay a tax".... like everyone should

Who is getting away with an under 5% income tax rate? Show me the list, and show me the math.

 

[TOGIE]

Who is getting away with an under 5% income tax rate? Show me the list, and show me the math.

Bezos, Buffett, Bloomberg, Musk, Icahn and Soros pay tiny fraction of wealth in income taxes, report reveals

Billionaires like Jeff Bezos of Amazon, Elon Musk of Tesla, and George Soros at times have paid zero federal income taxes.

www.cnbc.com

 

[TOGIE]

You must not listen to the news much then. This idea is about as horrible as you and TOGIEs loan tax.

There’s a growing interest in wealth taxes on the super-rich. Here’s why it hasn’t happened

Americans increasingly favor a wealth tax on the ultra-rich, but despite the uptick in proposals, these policies have struggled to gain traction.

www.cnbc.com

did you read this article? here's a quote from it, from Warrent Buffett - “A wealth tax is popular among voters on both sides for good reason: because they understand the system is rigged to benefit the wealthy and large corporations,” Warren said in a statement."

 

[TOGIE]

Who is getting away with an under 5% income tax rate? Show me the list, and show me the math.

but do we really need hard facts and data to know that richest americans are already getting away with countless legal ways to have effectively very low tax rates? while the rest of us middle class americans shoulder the tax burden in this country?

i don't know why so many americans are super quick to defend the ultra wealthy out of some misaligned solidarity for a group of people that would just as soon wipe their asses with our lives if it meant they could see a better share price on their fortunes.

 

[BigHornRam]

Bezos, Buffett, Bloomberg, Musk, Icahn and Soros pay tiny fraction of wealth in income taxes, report reveals

Billionaires like Jeff Bezos of Amazon, Elon Musk of Tesla, and George Soros at times have paid zero federal income taxes.

www.cnbc.com

The article uses net worth as the basis for income when calculating the income tax rate. So you do want to tax net worth.

 

[BigHornRam]

did you read this article? here's a quote from it, from Warrent Buffett - “A wealth tax is popular among voters on both sides for good reason: because they understand the system is rigged to benefit the wealthy and large corporations,” Warren said in a statement."

I did read the article. I don't have a favorable opinion of Elizabeth Warren, but understand that a percentage of people gravitate to her bullshit.

Apparently you don't read so good cause you think Elizabeth Warren is Warren Buffett!

 

[TOGIE]

The article uses net worth as the basis for income when calculating the income tax rate. So you do want to tax net worth.

no they just use net worth growth as a means of estimating and calculating what their income tax rate might look like. since many of these guys have no income, you gotta come up with ways to estimate their income.

who said anything about taxing net worth? i didn't. SAJ didn't.

but i bet you will again try to say that we're saying we should tax their net worth and/or unrealized gains, when, again, we never said that.

just in case you missed it, we never said that.

 

[noharleyyet]

The pols who have their aids draft/amend tax levy language answer wealth leverage'rs on the first ringtone.

 

[Deleted member 18333]

no they just use net worth growth as a means of estimating and calculating what their income tax rate might look like. since many of these guys have no income, you gotta come up with ways to estimate their income.

who said anything about taxing net worth? i didn't. SAJ didn't.

but i bet you will again try to say that we're saying we should tax their net worth and/or unrealized gains, when, again, we never said that.

just in case you missed it, we never said that.

If you are not advocating taxing net worth then I am lost as to what you are advocating for? If they had no taxable income then they should not have paid income tax. Quick math looks like many of the folks in the article paid income tax in the range of 19% - 30%. Bloomberg is the anomaly at 3%.

 

[BigHornRam]

no they just use net worth growth as a means of estimating and calculating what their income tax rate might look like. since many of these guys have no income, you gotta come up with ways to estimate their income.

who said anything about taxing net worth? i didn't. SAJ didn't.

but i bet you will again try to say that we're saying we should tax their net worth and/or unrealized gains, when, again, we never said that.

just in case you missed it, we never said that.

Good luck with you investments TOGIE. Hope they are successful and you turn into one of those "rich" guys you now despise.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

you personally are about as important to them as a crescent wrench.

Less... can't depreciate/sell/borrow against an employee

 

[TOGIE]

Good luck with you investments TOGIE. Hope they are successful and you turn into one of those "rich" guys you now despise.

i don't despise the concept of being wealthy, but i do despise a lot of wealthy people. take the esteemed fred eshelman, proud owner of elk mountain ranch and resident of north carolina.

boy, what a guy

i just don't understand why so many average americans think the wealthy are on their side. they're all mostly in bed with the politicians and we're just stuck along for the ride. the very concept of liberty means not letting the government OR the (often referred to as "their") elites have too much power.

they're duping us good.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

If you are not advocating taxing net worth then I am lost as to what you are advocating for? If they had no taxable income then they should not have paid income tax. Quick math looks like many of the folks in the article paid income tax in the range of 19% - 30%. Bloomberg is the anomaly at 3%.

"Federal Banking rule: An individual or trust may not use stock/options/etc as collateral for a loan"



I'm not a tax attorney, but I think it's pretty obvious you could change banking/finance rules so folks would have to sell stocks so that you would then be able to tax realized gains.

 

[Deleted member 18333]

"Federal Banking rule: An individual or trust may not use stock/options/etc as collateral for a loan"



I'm not a tax attorney, but I think it's pretty obvious you could change banking/finance rules so folks would have to sell stocks so that you would then be able to tax realized gains.

That's the rub? Rules sure could be changed but why?

I don't honestly believe life in America would be substantially better for Americans if the Government had more money to spend. Just as I don't think my life would be substantially better if I had more money to spend. Better allocation of existing resources sure seems like more solid footing. For both our Government and my household. However, I am 100% certain I am operating on a better foundation than our Government.

 

[Deleted member 18333]

i just don't understand why so many average americans think the wealthy are on their side. they're all mostly in bed with the politicians and we're just stuck along for the ride. the very concept of liberty means not letting the government OR the (often referred to as "their") elites have too much power.

they're duping us good.

Never thought the wealthy where on any particular side. So far this month, the only wealthy person that has pissed me off is President Biden.

 

[rogerthat]

That's the rub? Rules sure could be changed but why?

I don't honestly believe life in America would be substantially better for Americans if the Government had more money to spend. Just as I don't think my life would be substantially better if I had more money to spend. Better allocation of existing resources sure seems like more solid footing. For both our Government and my household. However, I am 100% certain I am operating on a better foundation than our Government.

Hoever it would be nice if the federal government wasn’t borrowing out wazoo every month. Privatize profits and socialize losses it’s the mantra of both parties as of late. Damn gubmint holding us all back

 

[TOGIE]

Never thought the wealthy where on any particular side. So far this month, the only wealthy person that has pissed me off is President Biden.

see that's the thing, we all want a limited executive branch and a government that can't become too powerful. we forget that a too powerful class of elites is just as dangerous.

and yet we defend them and drool over them because we all wish we were them.

 

[Deleted member 18333]

see that's the thing, we all want a limited executive branch and a government that can't become too powerful. we forget that a too powerful class of elites is just as dangerous.

and yet we defend them and drool over them because we all wish we were them.

Opinions vary I suppose but I am neither defending nor bashing wealthy elites. Their existence is a blip on my radar screen. My scorn lies with our elected officials.

BTW, using Propublicas' True Tax rate calculation I only paid a 4.9% tax last year. Does that make me an elite? If so, I think the others in that article are going to be pretty pissed off they are sharing company with me.