What has hunting become?

[Topgun 30-06]

topgun, what do you think would happen if all the outfitters in the state were shut down?

The millions of acres? Outfitters were leasing fewer acres in 2010 than were enrolled in Block Management. Approx. 6.2 M. acres leased by outfitters in 2010....and there are roughly 30 million acres of accessible public lands to hunt/fish on...along w/ the 8 million acres of BM?

Since 2010 outfitter acreage has increased, I do not know the exact numbers though.

Very simple answer---We'd all live happily ever after! Outfitters have their place, but it isn't to lock up millions of acres of private lands and charge big bucks to access it and it continues to get worse all across the country. That, in turn, is pricing a large percentage of hunters out of the game and if you say it isn't you had better start looking at the stats of the various states to see how much land we're losing to outfitter leases every year. One alone that I'm familiar with in Wyoming has over 1 million acres under lease in Wyoming and Montana. That's just one guy!!!

 

[BigRack]

Very simple answer---We'd all live happily ever after! Outfitters have their place, but it isn't to lock up millions of acres of private lands and charge big bucks to access it and it continues to get worse all across the country. That, in turn, is pricing a large percentage of hunters out of the game and if you say it isn't you had better start looking at the stats of the various states to see how much land we're losing to outfitter leases every year. One alone that I'm familiar with in Wyoming has over 1 million acres under lease in Wyoming and Montana. That's just one guy!!!

Great. Go buy some great hunting land and let us hunt on it for free.

I have never met someone who couldn't find land to hunt on for free.

 

[Eric Albus]

topgun, do you really think that the landowners would let you in for free? Do you think it is me and those of my ilk causing the problem? I have nothing to do w/ the fact that landowners would rather lease out their hunting than deal w/ the public. All of the ranches I hunt, those landowners called me....most of them on account they were tired of the sense of entitlement from the public. You could do away w/ outfitters, and the access to private land would not change an iota.

 

[BigRack]

BTW, I am not condoning what the guy did.

It happens a lot, just under the cover of "darkness."

 

[Topgun 30-06]

topgun, do you really think that the landowners would let you in for free? Do you think it is me and those of my ilk causing the problem? I have nothing to do w/ the fact that landowners would rather lease out their hunting than deal w/ the public. All of the ranches I hunt, those landowners called me....most of them on account they were tired of the sense of entitlement from the public. You could do away w/ outfitters, and the access to private land would not change an iota.

Nowhere did I say those landowners would definitely let me in for free. However, I'd bet money that it would be less for an access fee than what you charge for a guided hunt, especially if everyone stuck together and refused the high prices that are now common in most places. In fact , I have one Wyoming rancher that lets me hunt for free and the adjacent ranche only charges me $100 to hunt his place for ten days if I want to hunt it. So yes, I think outfitters are causing a lot of problems with their leases across the country and there are millions more that feel the same as I do. I have land up in northern MI that isn't posted and I have no problem if others use it when I'm not there as long as they behave themselves. I've had the property for 41 years and have not had a single problem in all that time. Your sense of entitlement statement IMHO is caused by just a few bad apples that spoil it for all of us who treat the land and owners with respect. If we policed our own better, we might not be in the shape we are today with so many landowners looking to outfitters to bail them out.

 

[Eric Albus]

thanks for the update kat

 

[shoots-straight]

]topgun, do you really think that the landowners would let you in for free[/U]? In the Root that was exactly the case. With some Joe Blow throwing around $5000 for a big one, the bar has been set.

Do you think it is me and those of my ilk causing the problem?
You and your ilk are the driving force. No doubt about it. If you take away the biggest segment of society that has a vested interest to do so then you either free up more lands to the general public or the landowners will just deal with the game themselves.

I have nothing to do w/ the fact that landowners would rather lease out their hunting than deal w/ the public. BS, See last answer.

All of the ranches I hunt, those landowners called me....most of them on account they were tired of the sense of entitlement from the public. You could do away w/ outfitters, and the access to private land would not change an iota.BS! Some may not like the main stream hunters, but like you claim all the time, you can't paint us all with one brush. That's not close to fair. Neither is the system you support.

You can claim all you want but that doesn't change reality.

BTW to claim the outfitting community is some of grand savior to the private landowners is amusing to me. One only has to Google up outfitters in your area to see how many are in trouble for illegal activity.

Good one!

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Great. Go buy some great hunting land and let us hunt on it for free.

I have never met someone who couldn't find land to hunt on for free.[/QUOTE]

That sentence makes about as much sense as you always do when you make a post, LOL! See my reply to Eric!

 

[Ben Lamb]

topgun, do you really think that the landowners would let you in for free? Do you think it is me and those of my ilk causing the problem? I have nothing to do w/ the fact that landowners would rather lease out their hunting than deal w/ the public. All of the ranches I hunt, those landowners called me....most of them on account they were tired of the sense of entitlement from the public. You could do away w/ outfitters, and the access to private land would not change an iota.

I don't care if you lease. That's a property right between a willing seller & a willing buyer, but you have advertised & sought out property to lease Eric.

 

[BigRack]

That sentence makes about as much sense as you always do when you make a post, LOL! See my reply to Eric!

It never fails that you miss my point. My point is that private land owners have the right to do what they want with their land.

Do you advertise that your land is free to hunt? I bet not.

Like I said and you confirmed, people can find land to hunt for free if they try to find it.

In ND, your land is open to public hunting UNLESS you post it.

Is Michigan the same way?

You never did answer Bambistew's question:

Why would "eating a tag" make him more of a conservationist?

Do you condone anti-hunters applying for tags just so a hunter can't get them?

 

[mtmiller]

Too funny. Waiting for more Albus spin.

 

[Eric Albus]

ben, you are right, I did lease 1 ranch in S.E. Montana from that ad on craigslst, 1 ranch solicited(thanks for keeping me honest!) BTW, I no longer lease that ranch, in the wake of 161 we were free to roam, and being the anarchist that I am...well I took advantage of an opportunity to piss the anti-outfitter folks off.

shoots....really, the most vested? Did you lose crop to elk damage AGAIN this year? Several thousand dollars worth? Have you had to fix fence, sometimes daily, to elk damage....at your own expense....the most vested? In my world the most vested has INVESTED the most of their own$$ and time......where we at now?

 

[Eric Albus]

mtmiller....where is the spin there?

 

[Topgun 30-06]

I don't care if you lease. That's a property right between a willing seller & a willing buyer, but you have advertised & sought out property to lease Eric.

Loved that ad in the link you posted Ben! He's offering "top dollar" to lease land, just as I stated these outfitters are doing to ruin it for the common man! Now he comes back and says he "only" leased one ranch because of that ad, LOL! He would have leased ten more if he had the calls and the Top Dollars to do it!!!

 

[Eric Albus]

ben, it was a "free ad"...so I did not have to pay for it...does that count?

 

[Ben Lamb]

Bubba, you have a future in politics.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

It never fails that you miss my point. My point is that private land owners have the right to do what they want with their land.

***People miss your point because your posts are stupid and nobody said they don't!

Do you advertise that your land is free to hunt? I bet not.

***Stupid question! If I said yes, what would you then say, LOL!

Like I said and you confirmed, people can find land to hunt for free if they try to find it.


***Nobody said they couldn't, but it's getting harder every year and most either say no or the land is already leased.


In ND, your land is open to public hunting UNLESS you post it.

***And your point is?

Is Michigan the same way?

NOPE, and neither are many other states!


You never did answer Bambistew's question:

***Are you keeping a scorecard?

Why would "eating a tag" make him more of a conservationist?

***It wouldn't any more than buying ads and offering a fee for someone to find him a big buck to shoot!


Do you condone anti-hunters applying for tags just so a hunter can't get them?

***As a hunter and conservationist, absolutely not. Now would you also like to know whether I wear boxers or briefs, LOL?!

 

[Eric Albus]

and they called me to lease it.....so I actually did not contact them about leasing...

 

[BigRack]

It's pretty telling you won't answer BambiStews question. I could care less that you call my posts stupid. You are the one that can't back up your posts.

The way you treat people on a message board just tells me the type of person you are off the internet.

 

[shoots-straight]

ben, you are right, I did lease 1 ranch in S.E. Montana from that ad on craigslst, 1 ranch solicited(thanks for keeping me honest!) BTW, I no longer lease that ranch, in the wake of 161 we were free to roam, and being the anarchist that I am...well I took advantage of an opportunity to piss the anti-outfitter folks off.

shoots....really, the most vested? Did you lose crop to elk damage AGAIN this year? Several thousand dollars worth? Have you had to fix fence, sometimes daily, to elk damage....at your own expense....the most vested? In my world the most vested has INVESTED the most of their own$$ and time......where we at now?

Actually I fix fence every year for a "LANDOWNER" that doesn't buy into the outfitter BS. He would rather have good ethical Resident Sportsmen hunt his place than deal with unscrupulous outfitters.

Eric, are you saying landowners look to buy lands with game on them because they like fixing fences and supplying food for that game? Maybe it's because those lands are worth more than lands without game. You think?

Outfitters, offer money to those landsowners at a higher rate, (whatever that may be) than John Q Public can. John Q would be more willing to help those landowners with fencing, and hay protection if and when John Q has the interest to invest. No?