Traditional Cap Guns - Let's See 'em!

[CLAUSEWITZVON]

And this is my new inline muzzloader... I love it! So handsome

 

[Buckskins&BlackPowder]

 

[AKHawken]

I really like seeing all these folks hunting with traditional muzzleloading rifles...good on you. My primary hunting rifles are a pair of Track-of-the-Wolf, Bridger Hawken's, .58 cal. One restocked by John Bergmann, originally built by Dave Pope. My main rifle was originally a .54 cal but I shot it out. A couple fusil fin's, one smooth bore and one rifled .58 both made by J. Eddie Brown. I also have a fine flintlock made by Dave Person in .58 cal. Hope to see you in the woods some day.

 

[BAKPAKR]

I really like seeing all these folks hunting with traditional muzzleloading rifles...good on you. My primary hunting rifles are a pair of Track-of-the-Wolf, Bridger Hawken's, .58 cal. One restocked by John Bergmann, originally built by Dave Pope. My main rifle was originally a .54 cal but I shot it out. A couple fusil fin's, one smooth bore and one rifled .58 both made by J. Eddie Brown. I also have a fine flintlock made by Dave Person in .58 cal. Hope to see you in the woods some day.

A ram with a Hawken is pretty impressive. Congrats!

 

[shb]

I really like seeing all these folks hunting with traditional muzzleloading rifles...good on you. My primary hunting rifles are a pair of Track-of-the-Wolf, Bridger Hawken's, .58 cal. One restocked by John Bergmann, originally built by Dave Pope. My main rifle was originally a .54 cal but I shot it out. A couple fusil fin's, one smooth bore and one rifled .58 both made by J. Eddie Brown. I also have a fine flintlock made by Dave Person in .58 cal. Hope to see you in the woods some day.

I don't know which is cooler:


The bad ass rifles.

The beautiful animals, and adventures they represent.


Or, the Hatfield's & McCoy beard.






Well done!

 

[44hunter45]

I borrowed my dad’s 54 cal T/C Grey Hawk for this hunt.

View attachment 148767



Was that in Red Ives? Selway?

 

[44hunter45]

I really like seeing all these folks hunting with traditional muzzleloading rifles...good on you. My primary hunting rifles are a pair of Track-of-the-Wolf, Bridger Hawken's, .58 cal. One restocked by John Bergmann, originally built by Dave Pope. My main rifle was originally a .54 cal but I shot it out. A couple fusil fin's, one smooth bore and one rifled .58 both made by J. Eddie Brown. I also have a fine flintlock made by Dave Person in .58 cal. Hope to see you in the woods some day.

Jim,

It's so wet there I've always wondered how you keep your bores looking good. Your care regimen must be pretty strict. Do you shoot Goex or Pyrodex?

 

[BAKPAKR]

View attachment 170472

I wish Dad would have splurged on the peep sight!

 

[44hunter45]

I wish Dad would have splurged on the peep sight!

I bought it at Gart's in Lewiston. A buddy had one in .50. I figured bigger was better and went .54. I shot Power Belts for years. now I only shoot patched balls.
Bob Parker is an old friend and I've tried his traditionals, but the Red Hawk twist doesn't like them.

 

[TradeGun.62]

I don't know which is cooler:


The bad ass rifles.

The beautiful animals, and adventures they represent.


Or, the Hatfield's & McCoy beard.

I believe the correct answer is, Yes!

 

[AKHawken]

Jim,

It's so wet there I've always wondered how you keep your bores looking good. Your care regimen must be pretty strict. Do you shoot Goex or Pyrodex?

GOEX FFg. For my flinters I enlarged the flash hole to the next wire drill size and coned the face. I prime with FFg as well. FFFFg has too much surface area and turns to soup. I place a round toothpick in the flash hole and close the frizzen and break off the tooth pick. I load the rifle and put it in a wool bag. When I call or want to shoot I pull it from the bag, wipe the frizzen, pan, and flint, remove the tooth pick and prime. I'm at about 95% ignition...

 

[AKHawken]

A ram with a Hawken is pretty impressive. Congrats!

22 yards...I drew the Utah Bighorn Sheep Permit at the Western Hunting and Conservation Expo...

 

[AKHawken]

View attachment 170472

What peep sight is that?

 

[Johnny44]

I bought a Traditions Deer Hunter over the summer to use in PA for their Muzzle and late Flintlock, in addition to Ohio muzzleloader. Didn't bag anything, but man that thing is fun to shoot. Pain to clean, but a lot of fun to shoot. I didn't realize I'd need around $100+ to get all the things I needed to fire/clean it. Doesn't matter, it's just bare bones. Can't wait to take something with it.

 

[44hunter45]

What peep sight is that?

That is the one that T/C sold for the New Englander, Pa Hunter, Tree Hawk, and Grey Hawk. It looks flimsy but I've put mine through hell. The elevation allen screw kept coming loose so I replaced it with slotted machine screw and lock nut.

You have to drill and tap one hole in the tang. It nearly doubles the sight radius. When the weather is nasty or in low light, I take out the aperture and pocket it. That leaves you about a 3/16 ghost ring. The front sight is a actually a handgun fiber optic that fit my dovetail. It is more fragile than the peep. I've broken a couple.

It kind of a quirky rifle. These were produced during the "fire years" after the T/C Factory fire. I learned the hard way that the entire breach plug is NOT stainless steel during a wet fall hunt. Also that even if you bought a "stainless steel" rifle, you can still pit the bore if you don't clean it right.
The grooves are fairly shallow. I ended up going to patches because I kept stripping lead with my hot loads of pure lead conicals. It is 1-48. You end up wishing sometimes it was either faster or slower. It handles .530 balls pretty well with a lubed patch.

 

[BrentD]

That is the one that T/C sold for the New Englander, Pa Hunter, Tree Hawk, and Grey Hawk. It looks flimsy but I've put mine through hell. The elevation allen screw kept coming loose so I replaced it with slotted machine screw and lock nut.

You have to drill and tap one hole in the tang. It nearly doubles the sight radius. When the weather is nasty or in low light, I take out the aperture and pocket it. That leaves you about a 3/16 ghost ring. The front sight is a actually a handgun fiber optic that fit my dovetail. It is more fragile than the peep. I've broken a couple.

It kind of a quirky rifle. These were produced during the "fire years" after the T/C Factory fire. I learned the hard way that the entire breach plug is NOT stainless steel during a wet fall hunt. Also that even if you bought a "stainless steel" rifle, you can still pit the bore if you don't clean it right.
The grooves are fairly shallow. I ended up going to patches because I kept stripping lead with my hot loads of pure lead conicals. It is 1-48. You end up wishing sometimes it was either faster or slower. It handles .530 balls pretty well with a lubed patch.

It looks similar to this Lyman sight. Helpful to those of us with geriatric eyesight.

Your problem with stripping may be solved by using a stiff wad behind the bullet. It could be any one of a number of things, but beeswax, wax-saturated felt, thick (0.060" or more) fiber or LDPE. It could do dramatic things to accuracy - or not. But my guess is that it will help at least some.

 

[44hunter45]

It looks similar to this Lyman sight. Helpful to those of us with geriatric eyesight.

Your problem with stripping may be solved by using a stiff wad behind the bullet. It could be any one of a number of things, but beeswax, wax-saturated felt, thick (0.060" or more) fiber or LDPE. It could do dramatic things to accuracy - or not. But my guess is that it will help at least some.

Geriatric eyesight- LOL -- I'm off work a few days getting my cataracts done.

The wad thing makes sense. The Power Belts never leaded up on me. They are a harder cast and they have that stiff gas check skirt. Maybe powder coated also? At one time I bought out all the 295 Gr lead PB's I could find. They work well in the 1-48. I use a homemade leather wad when fire lapping my wheel guns. It would be easy to make them to fit the little nub on the back of the PBs

IDFG 2019-2020 Big Game pamphlet, 2nd Ed, pg 100. says:

"•Capable of being loaded only from the muzzle.
•Equipped with only open or peep sights. Scopes and any electronics are prohibited. Except hunters with a visual disability may apply for a permit to use nonmagnifying scopes. (Applications are available at Fish and Game offices.)
•Loaded only with loose black powder, loose Pyrodex, or other loose synthetic black powder. Pelletized powders are prohibited.
•Loaded with a projectile that is within .010 inch of the bore diameter. Sabots are prohibited.
•Loaded with a patched round ball or conical non-jacketed projectile comprised wholly of lead or lead alloy.
•Equipped only with a flint, percussion cap or musket cap. 209 primers are prohibited.
•Equipped with an ignition system in which any portion of the cap is exposed when the weapon is cocked and ready to fire."

Talking to the enforcement guys, some say this means no gas check of any kind, others say, "MEH"

These restrictions only apply when hunting in a "Muzzleloader only" season. In an any weapon season, use can use a New Mexico special as long as it comes in less than 16 pounds fully kitted out.

Having said all that - I'm really digging the patched ball thing. I cut my range limit from 100 to 75 for elk. I have not shot an elk with this rifle, but every deer deer I hit with it goes legs up.

I changed my zero from 4" high to dead on at 100. Definitely "Minute of Deer" at my comfortable ranges. I use a range finder with this rifle for elk, not for deer.

 

[BrentD]

Your wad needs to be a bit over groove diameter. It will seal the bore better initially and result in better obduration into the grooves of the rifling.

You could use paper wrapped projectiles, but the wad issue would still be there.

I use LDPE wads, wherever match legal, for shooting out to 1000 yds in rifles with much shallower rifling. Otherwise I use fiber gasket material or a beeswax soaked felt wad.

In my flinter, which is patched roundball only, I get some patch burn-through (always inspect your fired patches). Accuracy is only so-so when that is happening. Putting a felt wad under the patched ball also solves this problem and accuracy improves significantly.

 

[BAKPAKR]

I bought a 54 cal T/C Renegade around 1980 but sold it to my brother after shooting a whitetail. He shot a couple of elk with it. We used Maxi-Balls back then. I bought another one at an auction a couple years ago and put it away. I finally pulled it out and shot it this year, less than week before our primitive weapon season. I was pleasantly surprised at the effectiveness of a round ball on a deer.

 

[44hunter45]

Your wad needs to be a bit over groove diameter. It will seal the bore better initially and result in better obduration into the grooves of the rifling.

You could use paper wrapped projectiles, but the wad issue would still be there.

I use LDPE wads, wherever match legal, for shooting out to 1000 yds in rifles with much shallower rifling. Otherwise I use fiber gasket material or a beeswax soaked felt wad.

In my flinter, which is patched roundball only, I get some patch burn-through (always inspect your fired patches). Accuracy is only so-so when that is happening. Putting a felt wad under the patched ball also solves this problem and accuracy improves significantly.

Whenever I see pictures of your beautiful old guns I get very interested in checking out BPCR