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dukes_daddy, perhaps you should study the true history and facts behind the War of Northern Aggression. If you will, you'll find that in 1856, when Andrew Jackson was POTUS and John C. Calhoun was VP (both of them born in SC, and Calhoun still living and previously representing the state) secession was threatened over the tariffs and unfair taxes pushed on the cotton farmers by the Northern political powers. Southern growers were prohibited from selling cotton directly to European nations and were forced to sell it directly to Northern cotton brokers. These brokers were able to extort high tariffs and taxes from the growers through the forced monopoly created by the Federal government. It was Andrew Jackson who at the time threatened to send Union troops into his own birth state to enforce the Federal laws that were crippling Southern commerce.

When SC did secede, Fort Sumter, which belonged to the state of SC was invaded and taken over, illegally by Lincoln's orders, and thus the war was begun. The institution of slavery was already dying out in the South due to the invention of the cotton gin and other farm implements. Many of the slave holders were already granting acts of manumission to many of their slaves, and also giving them portions of land to live on and farm as share croppers prior to the war. Take into account the fact that most of the freed slaves assumed the last names of their former owners as an indication of how there was a bond and a relationship between master and slave. Also, remember that there was not a single Southern ship owner who ever transported a slave to the shores of this nation. That ignominious job was completely done by Dutch, English and Northern ship owners who first bought the slaves from the native African chiefs who sold many of their conquered enemies and their own people into slavery. Also take note that when Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation, the act did not extend to the Northern states that still had slave owners; but only to the Confederate states that at the time were not a portion of the Union. Actual abolition of slavery wasn't mandated until Andrew Johnson assumed the Presidency after Lincoln was assassinated and during Reconstruction.

Historians have studied the South and prior to the revisionist history that is being taught today, the conclusion is that if Lincoln had just left the South alone, slavery would have gone the way of the dodo bird, simply due to the economics of the time. Also remember that less than 1% of the Southern whites actually owned slaves in the first place. It's a fact that Harriet Beecher Stowe, stirred the abolitionist movement with her fictional novel "Uncle Tom's Cabin", it's also fact that she never set foot below the Mason-Dixon Line and had no personal knowledge of what actually was the truth about slavery in the South. The entire abolitionist movement was financed and supported by those same individuals who were making money hand over fist to exploit the cotton markets of Europe and deprive the Southern growers of huge portions of the profits........profits that not only were cut, but then heavily taxed as well!

For those individuals who actually believe that slave owners mistreated their slaves is ludicrous and unfounded. Just as a farmer today wouldn't abuse his $100,000.00 tractor, the slave owners didn't abuse their property that in antebellum times cost approximately the same as today's dollars! It's also fact that in the rare instances when plantation owners discovered that one of their overseers did mistreat any slaves, those overseers ( who in many instances were Northerners hired by the owners and even in some instances former slaves who had been freed) those overseers were terminated for mistreatment. (Again, even in Stowe's book, Simon Legree was a yankee overseer hired by the plantation owner.)

The simple fact is that people today can't grasp the concept of what life was truly like in the deep South, prior to the invasion by Union forces. Slavery as it was practiced wasn't the evil institution that it's been portrayed, and unfortunately today's modern slavery issues don't even get discussed in the media or any of the social commentaries that are prevalent in today's modern world.

When images of fascism are linked to the old South and to political conservatism, you are acting like the Harriet Beecher Stowe of the 1800's in perpetuating a false and misleading image in order to promote an anti-socialism agenda. Tea party adherents are actually anti-fascists if you get down to the facts and the issues they represent. Any other misrepresentation is the act of someone who is blinded by the Obama liberalism and the blatant socialism that is destroying the fabric of this nation today.

BTW, please provide evidence that any tea party protest or actions have in any way, shape, or form, created any situation of conflict and disruption of civil order. I believe you have the tea party confused with the occupy movement which is at the least a communist organization and at the most, the largest civil conflict inducing event of the last 40 or 50 years.
 
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I'm sure in the 30's when the government banned automatic weapons some relative of yours was moaning "maybelle they are gonna take my shotgun and we won't be able to hunt squirrels". Well you still have your shotgun. Get over the fear.

Please tell me the reference to "a couple of guys on ar15 did in Colorado" is not respect for the people who killed innocents with assault weapons?

Machine guns weren't banned in the 30's. the NFA was enacted putting a $200 tax on transfers at that time.

A couple of guys on ar15.com started the recall and booted a couple key legislators in CO recently.
 
dukes_daddy, I forgot to tackle another one of your comments where you said "people who killed innocents with assault weapons". To my knowledge, there haven't been any individuals killed by assault weapons in this country, since the government began regulating private ownership of machine guns. As a matter of fact, the last instance I can locate in history of any mass murder using an actual assault weapon in the US, was the St. Valentine's Day Massacre.
 
Didn't say the confederacy was fascist. Tea party is with their zealist views to create conflict and disrupt civil order.

QUOTE]

Please expand. How is it you see a bunch of Vets with Constitution believing politicians march to a monument that was closed for pure BS reasons....and pull down the barricades and throw them on the lawn of the WH fascist or zealist?
Do you think we need bigger Government? maybe they should take over all 401K's too? (Pelosi mentioned that) they did so well with SS. How about taking over all mail and parcel deliveries? The post office is so great at that. How about taking over our health care? yea they do so great with that already lets let them handle the rest. Take over all private schools because they are so crappy compared to public, take over all roads because townships can't even manage that. Lets let them do exactly what wars were fought to keep them from doing.... Let them grow bigger and bigger and lets see what other country we look just like and see what our tax rate will be.

The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101
 
The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101

You have an interesting point of view I will give you that.:rolleyes:
Some would see it as it takes two to tango. Some would also think to blame a group who wants our government to adhere to basic economics and accounting as being a little out touch with the real problem.
So you see no problem with our debt, deficit, and abuse to social programs? No problem with government taking more and more control of our everyday lives? No problem with seeing the USA become more like the "other" countries with ultra high taxes because no one is held accountable for poor choices?
I don't stick to a party line, but the tea party is the last party I would blame anything on, unless you call trying to hold the government accountable as sabotage
"The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101"
So the tea party created our massive debt and deficit? Wow... again
 
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dukes_daddy said"The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101."

Then would you please explain how all of the national parks, monuments, federal agencies, etc. managed to have customized printed notices within the first 8 hours of the shutdown? It would appear to anyone who has an inkling of the GAO's contracting provisions that there isn't any way those printing jobs could have been put out for bids, bids reviewed and awarded, companies acquire the materials and get the signage printed, processed, and shipped to the government and then the said government ship those customized signs to every location across the country......all within the same 8 hour time frame!!!!!! To any logical individual, with the slightest knowledge of how government contracts work; on top of the efficiencies of the US Postal Service, this was an impossibility. Therefore; logic suggests that Obama and the Democrats already had a plan in place to force the shutdown and thus were prepared ahead of time.

BTW, no marches were responsible for any shutdowns; but Obama's insistence that he would not negotiate with Congressional Republicans over any cut backs in Federal spending (ie, social programs, social aid to foreign countries, and of course the failed AHCA) is in fact the reason for the recent shutdown.

I'm afraid you need to wake up from your Obama induced coma and face the realities of the situation and admit the failures of your leader are the reasons behind the problems of the nation.

Also, I'm still waiting for an answer to my previous question about deaths created by "assault weapons".
 
dukes_daddy said"The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101."

Then would you please explain how all of the national parks, monuments, federal agencies, etc. managed to have customized printed notices within the first 8 hours of the shutdown? It would appear to anyone who has an inkling of the GAO's contracting provisions that there isn't any way those printing jobs could have been put out for bids, bids reviewed and awarded, companies acquire the materials and get the signage printed, processed, and shipped to the government and then the said government ship those customized signs to every location across the country......all within the same 8 hour time frame!!!!!! To any logical individual, with the slightest knowledge of how government contracts work; on top of the efficiencies of the US Postal Service, this was an impossibility. Therefore; logic suggests that Obama and the Democrats already had a plan in place to force the shutdown and thus were prepared ahead of time.

BTW, no marches were responsible for any shutdowns; but Obama's insistence that he would not negotiate with Congressional Republicans over any cut backs in Federal spending (ie, social programs, social aid to foreign countries, and of course the failed AHCA) is in fact the reason for the recent shutdown.

I'm afraid you need to wake up from your Obama induced coma and face the realities of the situation and admit the failures of your leader are the reasons behind the problems of the nation.

Also, I'm still waiting for an answer to my previous question about deaths created by "assault weapons".
I'd be quite surprised of those notices were printed on a contract. The ones I hung up were printed on the same printer I use every day...
 
1_pointer, even the nice laminated signs? Not to mention the fact that all of the Federal WMAs and National Forest sites had notices on the internet that they were closed on top of having the laminated, weather proof signs available that were posted at gates, and boat ramps? There's no way possible that every location across the country could have printed and posted those signs within the 8 hour window; yet, there they were!
 
Don't know about them as I haven't seen any. I only commented on my doub that it was a contract and what we did in the office I work in. FWIW, we have a laminator in the printing room as well...

The website portion was done as to the shutdown plan of each agency. Yes, there's a written plan for shutting it down and it was in place alot longer than 8 hours prior to shut down.
 
dukes_daddy said"The people leading the march are the ones who closed down the government. Again they create problems and then rally. Fascism 101."

Then would you please explain how all of the national parks, monuments, federal agencies, etc. managed to have customized printed notices within the first 8 hours of the shutdown? It would appear to anyone who has an inkling of the GAO's contracting provisions that there isn't any way those printing jobs could have been put out for bids, bids reviewed and awarded, companies acquire the materials and get the signage printed, processed, and shipped to the government and then the said government ship those customized signs to every location across the country......all within the same 8 hour time frame!!!!!! To any logical individual, with the slightest knowledge of how government contracts work; on top of the efficiencies of the US Postal Service, this was an impossibility. Therefore; logic suggests that Obama and the Democrats already had a plan in place to force the shutdown and thus were prepared ahead of time.

If I'd only thought to invest in tin foil futures before Obama was elected I could afford to hunt every day for the rest of my life. :D
 
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