Something smells fishy about Montana Elk Hunt..

[tjones]

I got a bridge Sytes,,,you buying?

 

[Wolf Murder]

Close... very close. If you have to many in there it get's confused though... You do it twice if you want to get crazy though like this :



I do think hitting a Running wolf is hard to do... (Just guessing here, no first hand knowlege ) So that might be the reason for only one dead wolf. I'm guessing had they shot into the ground the wolf would have scattered just the same and shooting one.

Damn! I still didn't get it. Maybe this time. Yeah, running dogs are hard to hit. I just hit the quote button at the bottom, but obviously that hasn't been working for me

Perfect weather up here for hunting - I'm getting out Fri - Sun. Hopefully have something down cause Mama's been lonely on the weekends

 

[Gerald Martin]

Don't blame the wolves for the failures of Wyoming's Welfare Ranchers

Jose, point taken. But as it stands W.W. R's aren't killing elk 24/7 and increasing in numbers. You obviously dont like W.W. R's and I don't like what wolves are doing to our game numbers. I'm all for whatever it takes for there to be a legal season on wolves but until that happens through legal procedures the wolf population is growing and the elk population is diminishing in areas where elk and wolves share habitat.

Gerald, remember a Montana warden won't be the one "throwing the book" at a wolf shooter, there will be a Federal investigator, a Federal prosecutor and a Federal judge, all well up the food chain of a Montana warden.

Tjones, I hear you there, however before there is a trial the normal course of events is a hunter/concerned citizen sees a violation, calls the warden and the investigation begins, hopefully ending in a conviction and penalties for the poacher. If I stumble over the carcass of a deer or elk I'm pretty sure has been poached, I'm calling 800-TipMont pronto. If I stumble over the carcass of a dead wolf, I'm thinking "Good job boys, I hope there's several more dead in the bushes," and continuing my hunt.

As an interesting anecdote, I noticed that last year when we had a season every time hunters had an encounter with wolves, whether they killed one or not the news got around the local grapevine. "So and so saw a wolf up So and So Canyon but before they could get a shot it got away." This year I haven't heard of anyone actually seeing anything but wolf tracks in the areas they hunt. There aren't many stories of wolf sightings among the people who were talking about seeing wolves last year.
Also the couple of cases of illegal wolf kills in the region last year, quickly made it on the front page of the local paper. This year I don't recall there being any stories about dead wolves other than the one that got hit on the road outside of town. Are people not seeing any wolves this year or is something else happening? Just sayin.....

 

[shoots-straight]

We didn't reach our quota - so - live up to your screen name and quit shooting crooked:

2009 Quota - 75, 2009 wolves killed by hunters - 72. http://billingsgazette.com/news/sta...cle_ebeb462e-d332-11de-a394-001cc4c03286.html

In what post did I ever mention scare tactics, right wing politicians, etc? All I said was that if I was in their shoes I would have exterminated the entire pack.

And yes, I am also a sportsman, who actually cares about the future of hunting for my children, grandchildren and great grandchildren. I suggest you start caring also before it's too late. I've never told any red riding hood stories so once again - maybe you should get the facts straight?

In context you said:

I know when we could hunt them we didn't even reach our quota

I assume that meant we (hunters) couldn't even kill enough wolves to reach the quota. We reached the 72 in 3 weeks. What 3 wolves considering their running in herds? What's your point there? I do shoot straight, and I don't use BS to make a point.

You also said:

I hope you enjoy your hunting because your great grandkids won't if the govt keeps it up. Oh, so they killed a couple of wolves because they are preying on livestock. Why do you think they are preying on livestock anyways? They've killed off most of the game. Sounds like you need to pull your head out of your ass too.

36 of 44 HD in the state are over objectives according to the EMP. If your statement isn't Right wing politics I don't know what is.

Sportsman abide by the rules and regulations. Poachers don't.

 

[Wolf Murder]

In context you said: I assume that meant we (hunters) couldn't even kill enough wolves to reach the quota. We reached the 72 in 3 weeks. What 3 wolves considering their running in herds? What's your point there? I do shoot straight, and I don't use BS to make a point.

You also said:
36 of 44 HD in the state are over objectives according to the EMP. If your statement isn't Right wing politics I don't know what is.

Sportsman abide by the rules and regulations. Poachers don't.

I tell you what shoots-straight: When we're in heaven looking down on our poor grandchildren, I will bitch slap you back to earth so they can kick your ass since they aren't allowed to hunt or own guns. And, if I'm wrong - you can bitch slap me back to earth My statements have nothing to do with politics? I just want to help in the preservation of our hunting heritage. We have to slow down the exponential growth in wolves. I'm also curious where you got your data? (36 of 44 HD)

 

[shoots-straight]

I tell you what shoots-straight: When we're in heaven looking down on our poor grandchildren, I will bitch slap you back to earth so they can kick your ass since they aren't allowed to hunt or own guns. And, if I'm wrong - you can bitch slap me back to earth My statements have nothing to do with politics? I just want to help in the preservation of our hunting heritage. We have to slow down the exponential growth in wolves. I'm also curious where you got your data? (36 of 44 HD)

You can find my info on the Fish and game web page.

If our childerens Grand children aren't allowed to hunt, it won't be because of the wolf, or any other predator. FACT. I'll need a picture of you so I know who to "BItch Slap"

If your not playing politics then what's up with this quote? Now the wolf is responsible for our guns being taken away. I thought Obama was doing that.

If you want to preserve hunting, then join a "SPORTSMANS" club and get involved, but be ready to ditch the right wing political BS.

 

[shoots-straight]

The (36 of 44) came from the 2008 numbers. I just checked their web. they have it broke down by each individual hunting district and the new numbers have been posted. Their are 161 individual districts. The 44 were EMP areas. We are Under objective in 32 of 161 HD's as of 2010 numbers. That's still only 20% of the entire state.

http://fwpiis.mt.gov/content/getItem.aspx?id=46892

 

[Wolf Murder]

You can find my info on the Fish and game web page.

If our childerens Grand children aren't allowed to hunt, it won't be because of the wolf, or any other predator. FACT. I'll need a picture of you so I know who to "BItch Slap"

If your not playing politics then what's up with this quote? Now the wolf is responsible for our guns being taken away. I thought Obama was doing that.

If you want to preserve hunting, then join a "SPORTSMANS" club and get involved, but be ready to ditch the right wing political BS.

Naw, I think I'd rather put some lead through their guts. A lot more fun. Besides, what do you have against right wing people anyways? I take it you lean to the left. Couldn't be a straight shooter then

Here's my pic - how bout yours? I should hopefully have a better one after this weekend.

 

[Wolf Murder]

The (36 of 44) came from the 2008 numbers. I just checked the their web. they have it broke down by each individual hunting district and the new numbers have been posted. Their are 161 individual districts. The 44 were EMP areas. We are Under objective in 32 of 161 HD's as of 2010 numbers. That's still 20% of the region.

http://fwpiis.mt.gov/content/getItem.aspx?id=46892

Thanks for the info. I guess that's good to know

 

[shoots-straight]

This years archery bull. The last ones the wolves left to live I killed.

I have more fear from right wing wackos than I do from the left wing ones,( they actually scare me way more than a pack of wolves do). Packing their pistols on their hips because they can. The left wingers, just sit around eating tofu singing Kum bi yah. I believe I'm politically in the middle of this mess. Leaning no direction in particular.

I"m 6' 208lbs, Im 49 years old, and been a General Contractor for 20 + years, in construction for 33. I hunt more than 80 days a year, trap another 25 or so. I have 2 animals in Boone and Crocket. I have been married for 27 years, with 3 fully grown children. If you need more info, I'll be happy to give it too you.

 

[Wolf Murder]

This years archery bull. The last ones the wolves left to live I killed.

I have more fear from right wing wackos than I do from the left wing ones,( they actually scare me way more than a pack of wolves do). Packing their pistols on their hips because they can. The left wingers, just sit around eating tofu singing Kum bi yah. I believe I'm politically in the middle of this mess. Leaning no direction in particular.

I"m 6' 208lbs, Im 49 years old, and been a General Contractor for 20 + years, in construction for 33. I hunt more than 80 days a year, trap another 25 or so. I have 2 animals is Boone and Crocket. I have been married for 27 years, with 3 fully grown children. If you need more info, I'll be happy to give it too you.

Well, that's sure a nice bull. Congrats. And the last one left! Man you got lucky. I like your analysis of right and left wing wackos. I love packing a pistol when I'm in the woods, but not around town.

I'm 5'8", 160 lbs, 30 years old, and I work for a large, multi-state company in accounting.

I am jealous that you get to hunt more than 80 days and trap for 25. Good for you. No B&C's yet. I've been married for 12 years, with two children still giving us laughs. Oh, and I love to kill wolves

Don't forget the left wingers are the ones who will ensure your grandchildren no longer have guns someday - probably not in our lifetime. Only the criminals will have them then.

Best of luck to you the rest of the season.

 

[JoseCuervo]

For those fabricating a story beyond the actual info... any reliable sources / info to refute to info as provided by the Warden and the men?

• Do you really think it is "actual info" and "reliable sources / info" that the horse had "large fiery eyes"?
• Do you really think it is "actual info" and "reliable sources / info" that the "silent" wolf was also "violent" despite NEVER touching the hunter or touching the elk?
• Do you really think it is "actual info" and "reliable sources / info" that "God saved" them on their hunt?

I suppose once the USFWS finalize their investigation... I believe we will have a decent picture of the situation and if it turns out they are not charged for killing an ES wolf, hopefully those throwing out these fictional additions will move to support your fellow hunter (30 years of hunting)... as if this was a neighbor or friend... or heck, maybe yourself...

What fictional additions are you worrying about? The "large fiery eyes"? That "God saved" them? Or some of the other nonsense in their statements? If the guys wanted to "be innocent" they would have stated "there is a dead wolf 20 yards from where I shot with a bullet in his chest exiting his butt" and we would all agree that the drama queen and his buddy were afraid. But when he states that the wolves were up in the timber and a "lone wolf" howled and then the other wolves howled and it was "eerie" so they started randomly shooting all over the hill side, then there story starts to "smell a bit fishy".

To get back to the facts... This was a SOLO hunter who went on a day hunt / hike and found himself successful with a nice bull. He packed out what was practical and often solo packed first... evening setting solo... he calls his friend who brings out his horses to assist in packing the rest of the 3-400 lbs
the next morning and arrive early afternoon... they eat after their ride and prep the meat further for packing it out... wolves surround and the event as they describe occurred.

You are now making up facts, the wolves did not "surround" them. And you seem to leave out the FACT that He did not carefully take care of the meat, resulting in the loss of 100% of the meat (that is a FACT). How often is the head packed out first in Montana? Where is the tag if you haul the head out first? Do you leave it on the meat or do you have it attached to the antlers?

You want to talk about hanging meat... or whatever, sure... hind sight 20/20. The guy found he hit gold... maybe forgot to bring rope... maybe hunting this area many times and not having the type of UNMANAGED wolf issue that has excelled... hit a reality point on this successful hunt... and lesson learned... Bah, who knows - knowing the events of this incident... sure any Arm chair Quarterback can CALL "He should have..." all they want... Hind sight 20/20.

Again, why make up "facts"? If he was unprepared to deal with the meat, which he was, then just point out that he was unprepared. Don't make excuses about nonsense of forgetting a rope. And why try and excuse his wanton waste of meat with "UNMANAGED wolf issue" when the one shooter of the elk even states that he has seen wolves 60% of the time he has been hunting.

On another note, I am very [angry]. I lost all my hard-earned elk meat to a pack of damned wolves. I feel fortunate and blessed by God to have gotten out of there with my life, my friend’s life and [the] horses’ lives. I’ve been out in the mountains five times in a week and have seen wolves on three of those times, including this attack.

Was he that ignorant to the fact that there were wolves that might eat elk in that area? And it was in Grizzly country too. To somehow make excuses for him is incredulous.

SHould a solo hunter EVER hunt solo? what about safety... if one broke a leg and came close to dieing... people here may suggest "No one should hunt solo..." Bah - "what if" this to death... though come on guys... You are a hunter... we are hunters... how about supporting your fellow seasoned hunter UNLESS adverse investigation reveals something other than the info as provided.

How many things do you want to be paranoid of when you hunt? You now think somehow the guy was brave and needs support because he hunted solo and didn't break his leg? How can you call him a "seasoned hunter" when, thru his own actions, he wasted an entire friggin' elk, except for the Antlers that he was able to save and take back to town? If a guy like that wants "support" from "sportsmen" then he should be prepared to take care of the meat after he kills an elk and not hold news conferences or issues statements about horses with "large fiery eyes" and "violent" wolves who never bit anything that he was aware of.

Sure, he should not hunt solo... I should not hunt solo... He should have hung his meat... I should always hang my meat... Griz area or not... Black bears are present... mountain lions are present... coyotes are present... for ANYONE who has left elk on the ground to return later - are you not being a model hunter by not hanging meat ALL THE TIME??? Are you recklessly leaving meat to be ravaged by other wildlife because YOU are too lazy to hang your meat??? No. it is using your past experience of the area... it is using the setting to define your actions... evening hit... you planned on a day hunt - though BOOM - there you are face to face with a great bull... DO YOU PASS UP to be a model sportsmanlike hunter because you know the night is an hour away... and if you do shoot you have a few hours of work ahead of you??? Maybe you will pass on a bull... I'll shoot and do the best I am able with my current surroundings.

Yep, I have passed up all sorts of opportunities to kill animals when I knew I was not going to be able to deal with the meat. In hot weather in early October, I have pulled up camp after the first animal was killed and driven home to take care of the meat so that there would not be any waste due to the heat. I have passed on animals in Alaska that I couldn't deal with before the plane came and picked us up. Just because you see a bull elk does not mean you have a right/obligation to put holes in it if you are unable to deal with the meat. Have you ever looked across a canyon and had to watch an animal walk that you wouldn't have been able to retrieve for one reason or another? Your "I'll shoot and do the best I am able" attitude might get you into trouble someday.

What I am getting at is... hind sight is always 20/20... anyone can "what if" something to death... Though if this was a fellow hunter you personally knew... I DOUBT you would go to such extremes of adding fictional content. SUPPORT YOUR FELLOW VETERAN HUNTER of 30 years... as YOU would want to be supported...

Why should we support these two guys? They are making all hunters look like wingnut, anti-wolf hating, meat wasting, .44 Mag-a-blazing looney tunes with their news conference. These are the types of guys that DON'T deserve support.

As for the comments regarding humans should not fear a pack of wolves... I offer this... though, as we know - those who want to believe what they want - most likely will NOT watch these news clips. OR if they do - they will offer fictional additions to these incidents as well.

What else scares you besides a "pack of wolves"? How many hunters in Montana have been killed THIS year by OTHER HUNTERS? How many hunters in Montana have been killed in the last 15 YEARS by "packs of wolves"?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Hmm according to Saveourelk.com wolves like to chase little kids being pulled on a sled behind a quad. Man that site is something. They also mention a teacher that was killed by a pack of wolves...I seem to remember that being true, but not completely sure.

The looney-tune from the saveourelk.com website is the guy currently fighting poaching charges for killing an elk out of season.....

A felony charge was dismissed Wednesday against an accused elk poacher after a Blaine County judge determined that the Idaho Department of Fish and Game bungled an evidence test crucial to the case.

Tony Mayer, a 59-year-old Twin Falls man and the founder of the anti-wolf website SaveElk.com, still faces three misdemeanor game charges for allegedly killing a bull elk out of season last year in the Alturas Lake area of northern Blaine County.

While Magistrate Court Judge R. Ted Israel dismissed a felony count of unlawful killing of a trophy bull elk, he found during a preliminary hearing that Mayer illegally killed the animal.
"Clearly, if you add up the days from the defendant's story, then he killed the elk out of season," Israel said at the conclusion of the hearing in Hailey.

A preliminary hearing is a judicial procedure wherein a magistrate court judge determines if sufficient evidence exists to transfer a felony case to district court for further prosecution. Misdemeanor charges are not considered during a preliminary hearing, and Mayer is still charged with misdemeanor counts of hunting without an elk tag, hunting without an archery permit and unlawful possession of protected wildlife.

Israel scheduled a pretrial conference on the misdemeanor charges for Nov. 15. Mayer has pleaded not guilty to all three charges.

Israel dismissed the felony charge "without prejudice," which means that the Blaine County Prosecuting Attorney's Office has the option to refile the charge. Deputy Prosecuting Attorney Matt Fredback said Thursday that "we plan to refile."

Israel said he dismissed the charge because Fish and Game conducted an "invalid test" to determine if the elk was truly of trophy status.

In Idaho, the difference between illegally killing a trophy elk as opposed to a regular elk is the difference between a felony and a misdemeanor.

Trophy status is determined by the size and symmetry of the antlers, which is determined by official measurements using the "Boone and Crockett" measurement standards.
Israel determined that the test was invalid because Boone and Crockett standards require a 60-day drying period at room temperature to allow for fluid loss, a process referred to as shrinkage. Testimony at Wednesday's hearing showed that Fish and Game kept the antlers in a freezer storage locker and that the antlers were only kept at room temperature for three days prior to the test.

 

[JoseCuervo]

When we're in heaven looking down on our poor grandchildren, I will bitch slap you back to earth so they can kick your ass since they aren't allowed to hunt or own guns.

Let me guess, you are a member of the NRA, watch Fox News, and sleep with a Nite-Lite on beside your bed.....

 

[Sytes]

I know I have said it once before...














Great bull and the story of your success ~ that one is worth every penny! No reason to disbelieve it either, Shoots-Straight.

 

[tjones]

100 posts and 2000 views,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, come on baby!!

 

[Ben Lamb]

100 posts and 2000 views,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, come on baby!!

I support this effort.

 

[TheTone]

Jose,

Just so you know Mayer's felony was re-filed when the elk was rescored and still over the trophy threshold.

 

[Wolf Murder]

Let me guess, you are a member of the NRA, watch Fox News, and sleep with a Nite-Lite on beside your bed.....

Nope, not a member of any organization, occasionally watch FOX News, and don't sleep with a night light on.

Let me guess on you now: You are a member of the ACLU, watch gay midget porn, and you sleep with wolves?

 

[Ben Lamb]

I slept with a wolf once, in college. I was drunk and she had an amazing tail. Turns out all I got out of the deal was some fleas, and a little tapeworm.