Nra

[Bio Bo]

You might be right on the igneous rock diet. I scholar googled "raptors lead poison rock" and got over 3,000 results. I did the same with "raptors lead poison bullet" and only got 850 or so.

I guess I got lucky when I found a golden eagle about 8 years ago. Very sick and easy to catch since he had a good deal of lead in him. Fortunately the Raptor Center in Bozeman fixed him up. He had some large peices of lead in his system, presumably from ground squirrel carcasses. That being said, I don't know how common it is, but I know it happens.

And I'm not saying it can't happen. Maybe we shouldn't leave shot ground squirrels lying around to be easy pickings. Or poisoned ones either...
But I believe we are smart enough to figure out a way to coexist in our environment. And I believe there is more damage done by industrial pollution than there will ever be from ammunition. And greed seems to keep us from adequately attacking that problem. Why shouldn't economics enter into the ammunition argument? Hell, greed's going to kill us all anyway...

 

[mtmiller]

And I'm not saying it can't happen. Maybe we shouldn't leave shot ground squirrels lying around to be easy pickings.

Just ground squirrels or all lead impacted critter parts?

I am not saying we need to get rid of all the lead in bullet components, I just wanted to point out that there has been a lot erroneous information posted in this thread. Hopefully most educate themselves before they drink the kool aid in some of these posts.

 

[mtmiller]

Axl's all-time greatest retrieve?

Naw, just me and a coat. Those talons scared the crap out of me.

 

[Bio Bo]

Just ground squirrels or all lead impacted critter parts?

I am not saying we need to get rid of all the lead in bullet components, I just wanted to point out that there has been a lot erroneous information posted in this thread. Hopefully most educate themselves before they drink the kool aid in some of these posts.

Kool-Aid? Hell, I thought it was tequila we were drinking. I guess that explains the discrepancies...

 

[noharleyyet]

He had some large peices of lead in his system, presumably from ground squirrel carcasses

....obviously weren't using nosler partitions.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Enacting laws banning lead on faulty science is in no ones best interest. . .... John

Yes, Lead is very Hazardous. .... John

Lemme see now...... First you say that ingestion of lead is "faulty science", then you declare that lead is "very Hazardous". Not even merely "Hazardous", but you declare it "very Hazardous".

Based on what science from Barstool U. did you use to make your declaration of lead's evils?

Something tells me you are at the point in life, like Cali, where you can hide your own Easter Eggs and enjoy looking for them.......

 

[shoots-straight]

Iam living proof lead is hazardous. I ingested mine from a life of eating venison. Lead tensile mustaches where fun as a kid, and I must have munched on lead paint. Ban lead save the pigeons.
I think most of our congressmen have been subjected to lead poisoning. Some others on here also.

Those of you whom can think, do so, and ponder how brilliant I would have become had I not ingested lead.

 

[jabber]

I think most of our congressmen have been subjected to lead poisoning.

Not enough.

 

[shoots-straight]

Not enough.

That would be the hot kind you speak of.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

there has been a lot erroneous information posted in this thread

You got that right, at least.

Here is what I said -

to include shotgun ammo for upland game in the lead-free regulations.

Here is what you asked -

Cali, are you telling me the lead-free shot is based on the Condor?

What lead-free shot are you talking about? For waterfowl? I never mentioned that - I talked about the proposal to ban lead shot for upland game in the condor zone.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

From Josie's post on the Barnes bullet thread :

I shoot Nosler Partitions in the .308 and Ballistic Tips in the .243 on that same case,

Way better idea to stick with Partitions. Never had to worry about them.

Both are banned in the condor zone, and he supports that ban, but he shoots lead-containing bullets. Usual hypocritical BS from him. Doesn't look like he is worreid about lead's environmental impact.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

There are thousands of turkey vultures in California - eating the same carrion as the condors. Why aren't they falling over dead or becoming extinct from ingesting all this lead supposedly in the gut piles from hunters? Or the crows or ravens?

 

[DRAFTSTUD]

He is out finding his Easter Eggs also. John:hump:

 

[mtmiller]

He is "the guy" who is leading the fight against the lead ban in California's "Condor Zone" and the tree-huggers' push to expand it to other areas and to include shotgun ammo for upland game in the lead-free regulations. (You all know how many quail gutpiles condors eat, right?)

I thought your quail gut and condor comment is silly at best and really had nothing to do with the post.

As for the bs comment I made, do you really believe the $5,000 for a copy of the report? Do you think it is not FOIA-able?

I think the guy that told you this is full of crap and you just passed it along as fact. Come on, think for yourself.

I will also dispute what the game chief said about lead poisoning condor. Do you believe he is correct? I will assume you do since you posted it. Educate yourself.

Gotta catch a train, have fun.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

will also dispute what the game chief said about lead poisoning condor.

What are you disputing? That power lines are the number one cause of death of condors? That is a fact - from the necropsies performed. Educate yourself, as you advise me to do.

The $5,000 was the copying cost. They had to fight to get it, as the FOIA request was denied by the DFG initially. They to get attorneys involved to obtain it and then pay for the copy costs. That was just one of the many reports totalling tens of thousands of pages.

I thought your quail gut and condor comment is silly at best and really had nothing to do with the post.

Yes - it is silly. But it was part of a proposal to extend/expand the lead ammo ban, and as such, is pertinent to this topic.

 

[mtmiller]

Sorry,I was referring to his statement that condors don't die from lead poisoning. Untrue.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

And I am sorry, as I see that I misquoted him - he did not dispute that lead was killing condors, just that lead poisoning was the main cause of death for them. It is not. In many cases, sadly, the condors retrieved for treatment of lead poisoning have also been shot, which further complicates treatment and recovery. DDE was more of a factor than lead poisoning, as well.

 

[Sytes]

Anyway, I found it interesting - particularly since so many on here swear that the NRA does nothing for hunters and is worthless. (Generally followed by comments about how stupid anyone who supports the NRA is...... )

The rest of the condor and lead - condor and highlines... meh. Enough mud is being thrown back and forth to simply sit and enjoy the show... Though I assume this was to get a rise of NRA pride to make the above comment? Well, here is my minny rise... I don't think I know of 1 hunter in Montana that is not an NRA member and often find as life members passed from family to family... Really? I take it that comment was more a jest?
Oh eh - Free may be a form of a word within Freedom... when speaking of FOIA... though there is most often a charge for the printing, paper.. etc. I think there are extremes spoken here of the value mentioned... though FOIA in no way exempts copies of a report from any charge.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

Sytes - several (if not many) of the members on here are anti-NRA, and at least one of them is from Montana...

 

[JoseCuervo]

Sytes - several (if not many) of the members on here are anti-NRA, and at least one of them is from Montana...

I would guess most members with a college degree issued after 1990 are not members.... The NRA caters to the unedjumacated.