Montana Mule Deer Mismanagement

[DFS]

Those numbers aren't really relevant are they? Sorry if I'm missing something.

Good point it’s close to 5k hunters total minus the quota I guess.

 

[DFS]

Roughly 4600 displaced hunters if you break it out and go off fwp data.

 

[antlerradar]

View attachment 316525View attachment 316526
Per the harvest stats nobody hunted deer in region 4 in 2022. But deer were harvested. I assume car collisions. Must have been a Covid year.
2021 not a complete clear picture but look at the hunters we have displaced even with high quotas View attachment 316527
LE here we come.

So roughly 21% of region 4 hunters are NR. If that number holds through out the region, over half the NR that hunted the new limited entry units will be looking for a different place to hunt if FWP keeps the quota at the current level of hunting pressure. Can I start to build points in region seven. I am likely going to need them in the not to distant future.

 

[Deleted member 48080]

Roughly 4600 displaced hunters if you break it out and go off fwp data.

I was just looking at those same numbers... That's a shitload of dispersed hunters. I have a feeling most will hop to the other side of the river, especially with the new road system.

I used to hunt the units going limited entry a bunch. They're great mule deer units, but were getting absolutely clobbered with pressure. At these tag numbers they'll quickly turn into phenomenal hunts.

LE is inevitable, but preventing the current rut slaughter will postpone it substantially, as well as prevent instances like the above.

 

[DFS]

I was just looking at those same numbers... That's a shitload of dispersed hunters. I have a feeling most will hop to the other side of the river, especially with the new road system.

I used to hunt the units going limited entry a bunch. They're great mule deer units, but were getting absolutely clobbered with pressure. At these tag numbers they'll quickly turn into phenomenal hunts.

LE is inevitable, but preventing the current rut slaughter will postpone it substantially, as well as prevent instances like the above.

It just seems like if we truly value our opportunity to hunt mule deer every year you have to look at changing season dates. Otherwise it is going to go LE fast. And you are correct LE is where we are headed one way or another.

 

[SwaggyD]

Am I the only one ok with LE everywhere? I don’t need to rifle hunt a forkie mule deer every year over thanksgiving. Although, after seeing @rtraverdavis and @TOGIE rutted up neck roasts meals, I kind of want to!!

 

[WanderWoman]

Roughly 4600 displaced hunters if you break it out and go off fwp data.

It depends. The breaks are highly-sought after for elk hunting and a portion of “deer” hunters (esp. residents) may be primarily elk hunting with a deer tag in their pocket. Probably not as true for the NRs in at least 410 since all of the elk tags there have the 10% cap, but the bulk of displaced hunters will still be residents. But are they truly displaced? (I.e., of the 4600 displaced hunters, how many also hunted elsewhere, like closer to home, so they just stick to hunting wherever that ‘elsewhere’ is, vs. 4600 hunters suddenly needing a new deer HD). The latest hunter preference survey suggests that NRs like R6/R7 and Rs like R3. It will be interesting to see how it plays out. FWP has been doing deer hunter effort surveys on odd years and elk hunter effort even years, which explains the 0s for hunter numbers/days in 2022. If that carries forward in 2024 then that data wouldn’t be available until 2026 (for the 2025 season). Perhaps there could be a push to try and get that for the upcoming season, given these changes.

 

[brockel]

Even if they set the quotas high, with the 10% rule, most of the NR will be moving to regions 6 and 7.

Might as well pave Old Stage road in 700. Going to be even busier than it already was

 

[antlerradar]

It depends. The breaks are highly-sought after for elk hunting and a portion of “deer” hunters (esp. residents) may be primarily elk hunting with a deer tag in their pocket. Probably not as true for the NRs in at least 410 since all of the elk tags there have the 10% cap, but the bulk of displaced hunters will still be residents. But are they truly displaced? (I.e., of the 4600 displaced hunters, how many also hunted elsewhere, like closer to home, so they just stick to hunting wherever that ‘elsewhere’ is, vs. 4600 hunters suddenly needing a new deer HD). The latest hunter preference survey suggests that NRs like R6/R7 and Rs like R3. It will be interesting to see how it plays out. FWP has been doing deer hunter effort surveys on odd years and elk hunter effort even years, which explains the 0s for hunter numbers/days in 2022. If that carries forward in 2024 then that data wouldn’t be available until 2026 (for the 2025 season). Perhaps there could be a push to try and get that for the upcoming season, given these changes.

If you hunted one weekend in 410 and one weekend in region 6 and now you hunt two in 6 you are still bumping up pressure in 6. Don't get me wrong, I am happy FWP pulled the trigger and went to LE if they felt it was needed. We just need to understand that there are consequences for other units.

 

[antlerradar]

Am I the only one ok with LE everywhere? I don’t need to rifle hunt a forkie mule deer every year over thanksgiving. Although, after seeing @rtraverdavis and @TOGIE rutted up neck roasts meals, I kind of want to!!

You are not alone. I hear LE everywhere from many people. I would like to try switching the season up first but understand the LE could well be in our future no matter what we do.

 

[WanderWoman]

If you hunt one weekend in 410 and one weekend in region 6 and now you hunt two in 6 you are still bumping up pressure in 6. Don't get me wrong, I am happy FWP pulled the trigger and went to LE if they felt it was needed. We just need to understand that there are consequences for other units.

Absolutely, I didn’t mean to play it down that the impacts would be completely cancelled out, and you provide a great point. It will be interesting to see it play out.

 

[huntin24/7]

I would prefer that we don’t have to go to LE, and instead, attempt other options first like earlier or somewhat shortened seasons to still provide people opportunity to hunt.

A major benefit of LE, if done right though, is that quotas can be more easily adjusted from year to year. I think this would be helpful in years following a hard winter or bad drought that is out of our control.

I certainly think we can and should try other options first, but I’m afraid, as other knowledgeable guys on here have mentioned, it might eventually be inevitable at the rate we’re going.

 

[TOGIE]

Am I the only one ok with LE everywhere? I don’t need to rifle hunt a forkie mule deer every year over thanksgiving. Although, after seeing @rtraverdavis and @TOGIE rutted up neck roasts meals, I kind of want to!!

we have LE everywhere, mule deer everywhere, and opportunity to hunt.... yes, every year.

and therefore, i have mule deer neck roasts every year

 

[Deleted member 48080]

Am I the only one ok with LE everywhere? I don’t need to rifle hunt a forkie mule deer every year over thanksgiving. Although, after seeing @rtraverdavis and @TOGIE rutted up neck roasts meals, I kind of want to!!

I'd be perfectly fine with it.

The way that we're going about it now will be slow and painful though, and make our hunting even worse in much of the state.

Either rip off the bandaid and make the entire state limited entry, or experiment with other mechanisms first to extend the viability of the general hunt.

 

[SwaggyD]

This is another thought I have had that I can't remember being addressed - sorry if it has. Let's mule deer gets moved from the current season to the month of October, what happens to whitetail? Can I now hunt mule deer the month of October and whitetail the month of November? Or would the plan be to pick your species?

 

[Deleted member 48080]

This is another thought I have had that I can't remember being addressed - sorry if it has. Let's mule deer gets moved from the current season to the month of October, what happens to whitetail? Can I now hunt mule deer the month of October and whitetail the month of November? Or would the plan be to pick your species?

It'd have to be pick your species at that point. And everyone I've personally talked to about it has agreed.

 

[SwaggyD]

It'd have to be pick your species at that point. And everyone I've personally talked to about it has agreed.

That was my thinking as well and I also agree.

 

[The Hedgehog]

Managing deer hunting on public land involves balancing various factors such as habitat quality, population control, hunting pressure, and wildlife conservation goals. Challenges can arise due to complex ecological dynamics, limited resources, and differing stakeholder interests. Wildlife management is a multifaceted process that requires ongoing evaluation and adaptation to ensure sustainable hunting opportunities and healthy deer populations.

 

[Dougfirtree]

Managing deer hunting on public land involves balancing various factors such as habitat quality, population control, hunting pressure, and wildlife conservation goals. Challenges can arise due to complex ecological dynamics, limited resources, and differing stakeholder interests. Wildlife management is a multifaceted process that requires ongoing evaluation and adaptation to ensure sustainable hunting opportunities and healthy deer populations.

Bouncing around Hunt Talk this evening, I just keep thinking about this...

 

[mtmuley]

Managing deer hunting on public land involves balancing various factors such as habitat quality, population control, hunting pressure, and wildlife conservation goals. Challenges can arise due to complex ecological dynamics, limited resources, and differing stakeholder interests. Wildlife management is a multifaceted process that requires ongoing evaluation and adaptation to ensure sustainable hunting opportunities and healthy deer populations.

What are your thoughts on the Great Falls McDonald's? Thanks