Montana FWP makes seismic shift in elk permits

[rogerthat]

i just keep wondering why is it such a big issue to kill cows on public land,,,, are there that many districts that are overpopulated on public lands,,,hell, are there any districts were there are more elk then habitat
ive hunted public land, bulls only for 40 years, ive had about a 45percnt succes rate, in 3 states, does the resource owe anyone an elk,,,,

how many cows could be taken off the wilkes land and still have plenty of elk in that unit

i dont have any answers i guess, it is quite the issue,,, at some point the resource is going to come to a level where every big game tag is through a drawing, nevada comes to mind,,,,

The not killing cows on public is in response to elk being harbored on the private lands. Obviously this isn't every unit in Montana but in units where large herds are harbored on private lands it does no good to blast all the cows on public back onto the private. It conditions them to stay off the public and stay on private lands. If we let the cows stay on public and apply more B tag and region wide cow tag pressure on private, the thought is that the problem diminishes. Make sense?

 

[300stw]

The not killing cows on public is in response to elk being harbored on the private lands. Obviously this isn't every unit in Montana but in units where large herds are harbored on private lands it does no good to blast all the cows on public back onto the private. It conditions them to stay off the public and stay on private lands. If we let the cows stay on public and apply more B tag and region wide cow tag pressure on private, the thought is that the problem diminishes. Make sense?

i must of not been clear, i wonder why so much opposition to not killing cows on public land,,, ive said over and over, why are we killing cows, and does on public lands, until the animals are destroying the very habitat they live in,,,,

 

[Ben Lamb]

i must of not been clear, i wonder why so much opposition to not killing cows on public land,,, ive said over and over, why are we killing cows, and does on public lands, until the animals are destroying the very habitat they live in,,,,

my experience only: Elk are coveted beyond the antlers. "Get yer elk" is one of the most common greetings around the west, and nobody cares if it's a cow or a bull for the most part. it's about getting your elk, and because hunting success has been declining, any elk that's legal now is one that could end up in your freezer, so changing regs even for a short while will set some folks off. Especially when we've equated long seasons with opportunity, rather than increased success.

 

[Gerald Martin]

my experience only: Elk are coveted beyond the antlers. "Get yer elk" is one of the most common greetings around the west, and nobody cares if it's a cow or a bull for the most part. it's about getting your elk, and because hunting success has been declining, any elk that's legal now is one that could end up in your freezer, so changing regs even for a short while will set some folks off. Especially when we've equated long seasons with opportunity, rather than increased success.

Just think if we could get elk management in MT to the place where “ gettin yer elk” took 5-10 days instead of 15-25.

Instead of wondering if you would be better off fishing or drinking coffee by the fireplace rather than hiking endlessly through trackless forests, you actually could be fishing or drinking coffee by the fire because you already killed an elk on public land and there were plenty left for the guys still hunting.

Can you imagine that?

 

[MTelkHuntress]

Just think if we could get elk management in MT to the place where “ gettin yer elk” took 5-10 days instead of 15-25.

Or years

Although I gotta stay, getting into good shape endlessly hiking is really fun until it's not.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Or years

Although I gotta stay, getting into good shape endlessly hiking is really fun until it's not.

For sure. Just like opportunity to search is awesome until you realize you’ve been looking through a haystack that doesn’t even have a needle in it.

 

[antlerradar]

For sure. Just like opportunity to search is awesome until you realize you’ve been looking through a haystack that doesn’t even have a needle in it.

Or you finally draw that permit it took years to get and realize landowners have been high grading the bulls for years with general tags.

 

[Brad W]

The info session was very interesting. The serious elk discussion starts around 1:10. They are already throwing out one of the major proposals on changing the limited entry to general on private because of the firestorm of public comment. If you are testifying tomorrow this is an important watch. You can see it here:

Fish & Wildlife Commission: December 13, 2021 Work Session | Montana FWP​

Informational Meeting Only! No decisions or voting will take place. No public comments will be taken.
fwp.mt.gov

 

[Gerald Martin]

Or you finally draw that permit it took years to get and realize landowners have been high grading the bulls for years with general tags.

That needle done been took out of the haystack, son.

At least there’s still a small chance to kill a B&C bull as well as a B&C muley on a combo hunt.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I sent email to all the commissioners. It was hard to not use the words f&%#k, motherf&%#k, and dumbf&%#k in my email but I actually did not go there.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I heard from somebody that spoke to a commissioner today that they are getting absolutely flooded with opposition to this.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Sounds like the commission is responding to public input.

 

[PsRpOiGrRiAtM]

I couldn't attend, and so I sent an email as well--happy they got flooded w/ correspondence and they've pulled back (at least from what I understand.)

 

[Carnage2011]

I couldn't attend, and so I sent an email as well--happy they got flooded w/ correspondence and they've pulled back (at least from what I understand.)

They didn't really pull back....just changed a couple words and ended up with virtually the same outcome.

 

[Gerald Martin]

They didn't really pull back....just changed a couple words and ended up with virtually the same outcome.

Except their unlimited opportunity comes in archery season instead of general.

 

[JLS]

i must of not been clear, i wonder why so much opposition to not killing cows on public land,,, ive said over and over, why are we killing cows, and does on public lands, until the animals are destroying the very habitat they live in,,,,

Because “I need to get my elk” is the prevailing mentality.

 

[Carnage2011]

Except their unlimited opportunity comes in archery season instead of general.

True. However, a turd is a turd.

 

[Gerald Martin]

True. However, a turd is a turd.

Unless it sticks to the wall. Then it’s a “solution” to a “problem.”

 

[antlerradar]

Unless it sticks to the wall. Then it’s a “solution” to a “problem.”

Are you saying this new proposal is slimier than the first.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Are you saying this new proposal is slimier than the first.

Ehh.. hard to say. I am okay with the unlimited cow tags on private land only in 2X over objective units.

I am not okay with unlimited archery permits or general license for archery from the unbundling of the 900 series permit.

I would have supported unbundling the 900 series into single unit permits with a high quota and first choice only.

I totally support hunting only in the unit for which the permit is valid for all special permits across the board.