I should apologize to Randy for this

[Mallardsx2]

We have had a lot of "Gun Threats" in the school in GA lately. Even in our little rural middle school. 2 times this year kids brought guns to school.

Guess whose kids are issuing those threats and bringing guns to school. Not mine. Mine knows the consequences for doing something so idiotic. Plus, we talk to her, eat dinner together, help with homework, provide a list of chores, and do family things that provide her structure in life.

Those threats are coming from about .1% of the school's population and their parents are clearly out of control individuals. These people shouldn't have ever had children and shouldn't be allowed to be a part of society.

So, the situation is clear to me, it's the parents of those kids who are complete and utter lunatics and their kids are just following the examples of their parents. Most of them probably aren't even allowed to own guns.

Bad parents = crazy kids.
Crazy kids = bad parents.

It works both ways.

 

[BuzzH]

God has been kicked out of our country, government, schools, homes, and even many so called churches. Now we are suffering the results.
What ever happened to family prayer and Bible reading? Not only Bible reading but Bible following.
Fact: If everyone obeyed the word of God there wouldn't be much if any of the following.
Broken homes
Divorce courts
Jails, prisons, or juvenile detentions
Alcoholics Anonymous
Drug rehabs
Counseling for abused children
Fetal alcohol syndrome
Bullying
Spouse abuse or battered women's shelters
Death row
Murder trials
Drunk driver deaths
Overdoses
Security guards at schools
Home security systems
Sexually Transmitted diseases
Prostitution
Embezzlement
Etc. Etc.

Hollywood, video games, anything goes mentality has about ruined our youth.

The Golden Rule. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people which are called by my , shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, AND WILL HEAL THEIR LAND.

Psalms 9:17 The wicked shall be turned into hell, AND ALL THE NATIONS THAT FORGET GOD.

Proverbs 14:34 Rightousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.

I have received criticism and harsh insults for these kind of post on this site. So be it. I have also received supportive PM's. Either way this post is not about me it's about truth.

Right, because bible thumpers do none of those things?

IMO, if religion helps some people to stay on the straight and narrow, great.

But, there's also a deep denial from the "righteous" that forcing your beliefs on others absolutely creates resentment. I've yet to meet a thumper that didn't think they were better than everyone else, because they'll tell you so, like you just did with your sermon.

Trying to boil this problem of mass shooting down to a sermon on a building or not is ridiculous.

 

[BuzzH]

These people shouldn't have ever had children and shouldn't be allowed to be a part of society.

Good luck trying to legislate who gets to screw and own guns...

 

[TwistedSage]

I would be interested to see the stats on how many of these shooters had a father figure in there life or a shitty one for that matter.

I think that there is in general such a lack of involvement from any type of mentorship from parents/guardians. Or even thier guardians enabling their disassociation because they dont want to be involved anyhow. Thinking back on the 2 most recent or at least cases of adults shooting up elementary schools, this and Uvalde they both were living with guardians. They each had 4 or so rifles and other guns in thier bedrooms at thier parents/guardians house. 4 or 5 guns is not that easy to hide in a bedroom I mean if you poke around at all your clearly going to find guns or cases. In this case it was a 28 year old living with her parents. The ones that should be catching all of the red flags are the ones that are just letting them fly by.

I think social media, video games, the internet just makes the perfect storm for further dissasociation of reality for people that are already barely hanging on. Couple that with what's supposed to be thier support system not being there or caring to check. But it's societies problem now.

If guns weren't so easy to get would it deter these people? What measures could be taken that would not infringe on the citizens right to aquire and own guns yet deter the people who should not be owning guns but have yet to get caught up?

Required class for fire arm ownership? Proof of purchase of an approved safe?

Would this stop the lone shooter living at theirnoarents house from buying guns they shouldn't be having?

 

[The Hedgehog]

God has been kicked out of our country, government, schools, homes, and even many so called churches. Now we are suffering the results.
What ever happened to family prayer and Bible reading? Not only Bible reading but Bible following.

.... Either way this post is not about me it's about truth.

Okia archer - I'm curious regarding God as it seems you clearly know the "truth". Is it Christianity (or what flavor of it) that you propose to be the religion that should be promoted in schools, government, etc?

 

[Jamen]

Not to make this post turn religious but i agree with Buzz. Some people need religion to keep them on the straight and narrow and that's totally fine. Some do not have a good moral compas and if religion keeps them on one thats good. But to say that is what everyone needs is not realistic. We had a local priest just recently get arrested for having women perform acts on him during counseling sessions and then would make them go upstairs and confess those sins to him. And these are the people we need to look to??

Sad part is when this happens people go round and round on what to do and nothing gets done. We live in a time where our politics is the US vs. THEM mentality and we solve no issues. No one wants to listen to the other "side". I had friends absolutely astonished when i told them i vote for people from different political parties. Tunnel vision is never a good thing. I do not have the answer for this but arguing which side is right and the other wrong and not compromising will only prolong fixes and it'll happen again.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Well I don’t have the answer but I think the first step is looking into all the factors at play like Doctor Peterson does with the idea that these are people who have built up deep resentment for years and get to the point that they are willing to kill others who have the life they want

I think it is generally understood that a very very small percentage of humans (hyper-sociopaths) kill with little concern and with no apparent cause. They probably set a baseline of violence over time.

It is also understood that a much larger percentage of people are able and willing to kill others whom they are socialized to view with disdain or sub-human characteristics. The run-of-the-mill administrators and guards at Auschwitz are a classic example - normal people participating in atrocities because they had become numb to the humanity of Jews.

I do think the current political tone (on both sides) has gone to 11 when characterizing others as evil, soulless, oppressors, irredeemable, enemies of the social order, tools of the devil, enemies of the faith, destroyers of the family, and freaks. When people on the opposite side of an issue become "pieces of sh*t" rather than a person I dislike or disagree with, we move a step closer to being able to do them harm. I believe that this public tone is a real part of this complex problem.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Let me clarify. I am not saying people do not struggle with depression or anxiety. I am calling out those who use it as an excuse when they do not. Real problems and real victims need real solutions. But there had to be some reality these days. It had be one an excuse which only hurts those in need more. I am just have no sympathy for those who refuse to try and take care of themselves or lazy people.

But if you have no special training and little data on the problem, how can you judge if 10% or 20% is the right number of "real" problems? My own experiences suggest there are many more people who need professional help and don't get it than there are people who somehow "game the system" as fake victim. The professionals I have spoken with pretty consistently say the "false positives" in this field are quite low.

 

[gouch]

I think it is generally understood that a very very small percentage of humans (hyper-sociopaths) kill with little concern and with no apparent cause. They probably set a baseline of violence over time.

It is also understood that a much larger percentage of people are able and willing to kill others whom they are socialized to view with disdain or sub-human characteristics. The run-of-the-mill administrators and guards at Auschwitz are a classic example - normal people participating in atrocities because they had become numb to the humanity of Jews.

I do think the current political tone (on both sides) has gone to 11 when characterizing others as evil, soulless, oppressors, irredeemable, enemies of the social order, tools of the devil, enemies of the faith, destroyers of the family, and freaks. When people on the opposite side of an issue become "pieces of sh*t" rather than a person I dislike or disagree with, we become a step closer to being able to do them harm. I believe that this public tone is a real part of this complex problem.

I think it is a very large part of the problem and I think you can see a correlation between the rise in this political tone and the rise in gun violence. Particularly mass shootings. The problem as a whole may be so deeply seeded in our culture and national identity that nobody is willing to seriously try to fix it.

 

[VikingsGuy]

We have had a lot of "Gun Threats" in the school in GA lately. Even in our little rural middle school. 2 times this year kids brought guns to school.

Guess whose kids are issuing those threats and bringing guns to school. Not mine. Mine knows the consequences for doing something so idiotic. Plus, we talk to her, eat dinner together, help with homework, provide a list of chores, and do family things that provide her structure in life.

Those threats are coming from about .1% of the school's population and their parents are clearly out of control individuals. These people shouldn't have ever had children and shouldn't be allowed to be a part of society.

So, the situation is clear to me, it's the parents of those kids who are complete and utter lunatics and their kids are just following the examples of their parents. Most of them probably aren't even allowed to own guns.

Bad parents = crazy kids.
Crazy kids = bad parents.

It works both ways.

HT has had a number of committed (and seemingly good) parents who have bravely and humbly shared their kid's mental health crises. The problem is much more complex and much broader than your post suggests.

 

[samuel_284Win]

I don’t think you should apologize for starting this thread. I think we should talk about these things because they are an issue that isn’t just going away but we should keep it civil so it doesn’t become a problem for Randy. I’ve found Dr. Jordan Petersons research into this subject interesting.

I was going to mention Dr. Peterson's commentary on these topics. He has some thought-provoking podcasts that are worth a listen.

I don't have a good answer to any of this.
In the end, I think the cowardice, and nihilistic, hatred that the shooter has for their position in humanity results in the best solution in their mind is manifested as "I will burn the world to the ground and take as many people with me as I can because everyone else around me is responsible for my position/state of affairs in life"

I think this was one reason I was homeschooled (and no, I am not a weird homeschooler with socialization issues hahaha). Why would I want to send my child into an environment like this, primarily when you evaluate that the majority of the public probably does not hold the same moral/ethical/spiritual values as your own family?

Tactical solution: I am sure there are plenty of GWOT veterans or retired defense contractors that would love a steady job patrolling school property perimeters to prevent building entry. Win-win for everyone

 

[okie archer]

And what is your solution for anyone who is not a Christian and does not follow those same teachings?

I suppose that was my entire point. Christianity is the solution. Let's suppose the Bible was made up (obviously I don't believe that) but even if it was, if humanity followed the teachings of Jesus and the 10 commandments the majority of our problems would be solved. That can't be argued.
Thou shalt not kill. Boom no one else would be murdered. That's just one commandment.
Please consider reading the 10 commandments today. Mankind wants to be good without God. It's impossible to do so. That idea is Humanism. When we think we don't need God and we can direct our own paths, we are in error.
Man as a whole is fine with rules at work, rules in government, rules concerning wildlife, rules in college, rules in the union, rules at the bank, rules in public, neighborhood association rules, rules in sports, etc. But man wants to buck up at the idea of submitting to the rules of God. The rejection of God and his word has led us to the moral decay of our modern society. I think it's noteworthy to compare the decline of our schools since the 1962 when Madayln O'Hair fought to have prayer taken from public schools.
Sincerely, okie

 

[FairWeather]

At this point, I’ve just accepted that this is an American problem that won’t go away. I work at a college, so I keep a plate carrier in my desk.

 

[VikingsGuy]

(and no, I am not a weird homeschooler with socialization issues hahaha).

We'll be the judge of that

 

[Deleted member 28227]

 

[jlong17]

We’re a Christian nation, founded by Christian people, governed by a constitution framed by Christian principles. Don’t get upset when @okie archer suggests we return to teachings and values that has generated the greatest nation the world has ever seen. If it triggers you less, then replace “Christian” with “religious”.
John Adams said, “Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” Morality and virtue are the foundation of our republic and necessary for a society to be free.
I have many friends of different religions, and although we may disagree on who Jesus was we ALWAYS agree on the principles and virtues He taught. Call us Bible thumpers if you wish, because we all know you’ve never acted superior to anyone on here.

 

[SAJ-99]

But if you have no special training and little data on the problem, how can you judge if 10% or 20% is the right number of "real" problems? My own experiences suggest there are many more people who need professional help and don't get it than there are people who somehow "game the system" as fake victim. The professionals I have spoken with pretty consistently say the "false positives" in this field are quite low.

There are clearly not enough psychiatric professionals in this country to deal with the level of the problem. Insurance coverage of mental health issues is often not straightforward. I am at the point that I almost think this should be a mandatory class - middle school, high school?- that teaches coping mechanisms with how to deal with stress.

After reading this thread, I am pretty sure a good % of HT would think I'm a horrible parent. But as I tell my daughter when she brings up how much I suck at the job during our arguments negotiations, I say "I'm present, involved, and making an effort."

 

[jlong17]

View attachment 270331

Well it’s either gun control or influencers… which thread do you prefer lol.
Can’t wait for the winter threads to give way to actual hunting stuff

 

[geetar]

I do think the current political tone (on both sides) has gone to 11 when characterizing others as evil, soulless, oppressors, irredeemable, enemies of the social order, tools of the devil, enemies of the faith, destroyers of the family, and freaks. When people on the opposite side of an issue become "pieces of sh*t" rather than a person I dislike or disagree with, we move a step closer to being able to do them harm. I believe that this public tone is a real part of this complex problem.

I very much agree with this. I think this division only got worse during the Covid pandemic and society seemed to lose sight of the fact that it was human beings who were dying from the virus and leaving grieving families behind regardless of which political side they were on.

 

[Deleted member 18333]

There are clearly not enough psychiatric professionals in this country to deal with the level of the problem. Insurance coverage of mental health issues is often not straightforward. I am at the point that I almost think this should be a mandatory class - middle school, high school?- that teaches coping mechanisms with how to deal with stress.

Making treatment more accessible is certainly a noble endeavor, but...

Root Cause Analysis is needed. What is causing, at a minimum, 17% of teens to need professional help for mental health issues?