Gunshow Loophole

[sweetnectar]

27 people died last week. 20 of them were children in kindergarten and first grade. If you think for a minute that won't severely influence laws and policy we're all living in a fantasy land.

Were the kids huddled in in the corner when the murderer opened up on them? Did the stupid policy of having the kids huddle in a corner cost an additional life? Did a no weapons policy at the school cost an additional life? Did the gunshow loophole cost an additional life?...if no then why are you using this tragedy to push more gun control?

Closing the loophole reminds me of prohibition. People just got their booze other ways. Badguys will just get their guns other ways. Goodguys will be effected though.

Ben, I thought you promised in other treads that Obama and your fellow democrats were in no way going to infringe on our gun rights. Can you still make that promise?

 

[cowboy]

I will make a little prediction - we may not like it but the tide has turned. The gun show loop hole will be closed, AR's, AK's etc will be a thing of the past, and 20-30 mags are done for. That will be the start - who knows where it will end.

The politician's of this country will do something that we will not like and our illustrious NRA's solution is to put a cop in every school.

Billings, Mt. Has a population of approx. 100,000 and our local police chief said on the news tonight he would need another 35 policemen if this went into law/effect. In the meantime we're cutting school budgets, our schools need 35 million for repairs/updates and we can't pass a mill levy to save our soul.

This ain't going to be pretty when the smoke clears. Grab you buns boys - it's coming.

 

[WT_in_MT]

Billings, Mt. Has a population of approx. 100,000 and our local police chief said on the news tonight he would need another 35 policemen if this went into law/effect. In the meantime we're cutting school budgets, our schools need 35 million for repairs/updates and we can't pass a mill levy to save our soul.

Yet we can "afford" roughly $35,000,000 in tax dollars for a new baseball park, library, and park district. But at least those who never plan on giving up their unemployment benefits will have a nice place to eat the Ding Dongs and Ho Hos they bought with SNAP.

There's a couple hints in there on how we can afford it, if that's what's deemed necessary. I ain't saying that armed personnel is good or bad, just that it's a crock o' crap that some folks are throwing up the automatic affordability line of defense. There may be other valid reasons why not to do it, but not enough tax dollars ain't one of them. I realize you're reiterating what's been said in the media cowboy, so don't take this as pointed at you.

 

[Southwind]

Does absolutley nothing to save anybody!!!! You can let them chip away at your rights and say "Oh, I can live without that" until it's more and more and you just surrendered your rights.

Short of wholesale confiscation which would only effect law abidding citizens these measures do nothing!

What would have done something was a firearm in the hands of one of the teachers.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Does absolutley nothing to save anybody!!!! You can let them chip away at your rights and say "Oh, I can live without that" until it's more and more and you just surrendered your rights.

Short of wholesale confiscation which would only effect law abidding citizens these measures do nothing!

What would have done something was a firearm in the hands of one of the teachers.

Why limit guns for the teachers? Guns for every kindergartner is the obvious solution. ! Our founding fathers said nothing about a minimum age to be in a well regulated militia.

More guns is the answer to guns in schools.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I bought a Glock and an AR15 with a stack of high-capacity magazines back at the last "ban". I honestly can't remember when and to who I sold them to.

 

[Southwind]

Why limit guns for the teachers? Guns for every kindergartner is the obvious solution. ! Our founding fathers said nothing about a minimum age to be in a well regulated militia.

More guns is the answer to guns in schools.

but that would mean you could be armed and society could not survive that mistake

Besides you should know the the 2nd ammendment doesn't grant any rights but rather says that right that already exist shall not be infringed

 

[Ben Lamb]

Were the kids huddled in in the corner when the murderer opened up on them? Did the stupid policy of having the kids huddle in a corner cost an additional life? Did a no weapons policy at the school cost an additional life? Did the gunshow loophole cost an additional life?...if no then why are you using this tragedy to push more gun control?

Closing the loophole reminds me of prohibition. People just got their booze other ways. Badguys will just get their guns other ways. Goodguys will be effected though.

Ben, I thought you promised in other treads that Obama and your fellow democrats were in no way going to infringe on our gun rights. Can you still make that promise?

Closing the loophole does not infringe on your right to own a gun in any shape or form.

To be clear, I do not support an AWB. It's feel good legislation that won't reduce violent crime. I can't control national politics and I can't control votes so no I can't make that promise just like you can't promise your fellow republicans won't come after our access.

Sandy Hook radically altered the conversation about guns. If you want to wallow in the typical party bs then fine, but while you're in the mud with the other pigs, others will e working to steer the conversation away from confiscation and towards common sense solutions.

 

[JoseCuervo]

but that would mean you could be armed and society could not survive that mistake

Besides you should know the the 2nd ammendment doesn't grant any rights but rather says that right that already exist shall not be infringed

It actually says nothing of the sort, but keep repeating it and maybe you will believe it.

 

[Straight Arrow]

Amendment II: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

The Second Amendment does not apply to actions of states, only to the federal government. That's why gun control laws vary widely among all the states.

The courts have allowed the federal government to set some limits on rights of owners, sellers, and manufacturers of firearms, while not infringing on the basic right to keep and bear arms.

 

[schmalts]

Amendment II: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

The Second Amendment does not apply to actions of states, only to the federal government. That's why gun control laws vary widely among all the states.

The courts have allowed the federal government to set some limits on rights of owners, sellers, and manufacturers of firearms, while not infringing on the basic right to keep and bear arms.

Recent court rulings have also limited the state's right to limit those rights. The way our courts look at the second amenndment changes with the judges

 

[bigeasygator]

a person should not have to wait more than 5 to 10 minutes,to purchase a firearm,and if a nutjob runs into a person that allready has his or her firearm in there hand,the odds are good the nut job will be gone,and if a person wants to own a fully automatic ma duce,he should be able to,now a fully automatic weapon,a person should have to go through a background check. and no i do not think a law abiding person who sells a fire arm privatly should have to do a background check

5 to 10 minutes? No one needs a gun that fast. If the spelling and the grammar weren't enough, anyone advocating putting guns into the hands of the mentally ill I can't take seriously.

It's these kind of comments and viewpoints that make me favor more gun control, and if this is what the mainstream media takes as the viewpoint of gun owners, it's gonna cost us all our gun rights. Constitutional amendments have been repealed before. These kind of opinions are only slightly worse than mass shootings as it pertains to the public opinion on gun rights.

 

[Elkmagnet]

.

Sandy Hook radically altered the conversation about guns. If you want to wallow in the typical party bs then fine, but while you're in the mud with the other pigs, others will e working to steer the conversation away from confiscation and towards common sense solutions.

I like the idea of steering the conversation towards a common sense solution but we all know common sense will have nothing to do with it, its going to be purely emotion based.

(But What about the children)

Yeah well what about the children? If I want my children to grow up in Australia, Russia or any other country with stupidity/emotion based gun control ill move there. I'd like my kids to grow up in America.

 

[Elkmagnet]

Why do people keep thinking this magical "answer" exists.

The truth is crap like this always will happen.
We might as well be searching for a law to save kids from hurricanes.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Why do people keep thinking this magical "answer" exists.

The truth is crap like this always will happen.
We might as well be searching for a law to save kids from hurricanes.

We actually do spend quite a bit of money on NOAA and studying and predicting hurricanes in order to keep kids (and adults) safe. But, that is one of those discretionary spending items Wayne LaPierre would cut so we can put armed guards in every classroom.

 

[Elkmagnet]

Can we make it illegal for hurricanes to have wind over 10 miles an hour? Maybe that'll help.

 

[Southwind]

It actually says nothing of the sort, but keep repeating it and maybe you will believe it.

It's o.k. for you to believe it doesn't Jose I understand your condition.

 

[MattK]

Southwind- you are wrong...plain and simple. The US Constitution most certainly over-rules state law. If a state law is deemed UN-constitutional the US Supreme court will over-rule that law. Just as state constitutions over-rule city/county law. Look at the last US Supreme court ruling on gun control...it says the DC law (a state law) was unconstitutional...the law is no longer valid. The only reason many state laws exist is because they are not challenged all the way to the Supreme Court. In fact it was 70 years between the Supreme court hearing a case addressing the scope of the 2nd amendment.