Google Bot Data Mined Super-Fund Site

[Deleted member 16014]

I also have zero time and money invested in the UL's, I just want to see a profile out of genuine curiosity...

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

View attachment 198126LOL

Seems like if it was an obviously legal ram, the warden would have just said "nice ram". Saying "looks like a legal ram to me" is what a warden might say if he didn't want to deal with the ass-pain that would come with raising a stink with a celeb hunter and outfitter....

 

[TheTone]

Can you look up harvest info in Montana that includes horn length?

Also nice to see one of the FWP commissioners offering a congrats

 

[winmag]

Can you look up harvest info in Montana that includes horn length?

Yes, it’ll be published after the season. My money is on 4.5yo, 25”x12.5”.

 

[BirdManMike]

I cant imagine any of us here still being in possession of that ram after checking it in.

 

[Irrelevant]

I mean there has to be some pretty serious ramifications if it really isn't a legal ram but was allowed by FWP? Can someone call out FWP, or go take a pic of the ram in question at the taxidermist?

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

It would be interesting to see some letters to the editor in some local papers on this too....

 

[Bambistew]

Is sub-legal really even a thing in MT? Are rams ever confiscated?

 

[Deleted member 16014]

...serious ramifications...

Good one dude

 

[winmag]

Are rams ever confiscated?

Region 5 has confiscated a few

 

[Oak]

There is a lot of discretion in issuing tickets for most violations, which is good IMO. Should there be discretion for the violation of a sub-legal ram? Situations like this one make it extremely tough for the LEO if there is discretion, because the hunter blasted it all over social media before the ram was checked.

In CO, you will almost certainly get a ticket for not wearing an orange or pink hat when it is required (there are still exceptions). We also have a 1/2 curl regulation on rams, and if you shoot a ram that is less than 1/2 curl you will almost certainly be allowed to keep it. The purpose of our reg is primarily to keep hunters from inadvertently shooting ewes. So what is the purpose of the 3/4 curl reg in MT? With a quota in place, I can't imagine it's a biological purpose.

 

[Irrelevant]

In CO, you will almost certainly get a ticket for not wearing an orange or pink hat when it is required (there are still exceptions). We also have a 1/2 curl regulation on rams, and if you shoot a ram that is less than 1/2 curl you will almost certainly be allowed to keep it. The purpose of our reg is primarily to keep hunters from inadvertently shooting ewes. So what is the purpose of the 3/4 curl reg in MT? With a quota in place, I can't imagine it's a biological purpose.

But there's a difference between a special permit/tag that you draw and an unlimited hunt. Since it's quota restricted by fudging the measurements you're taking from all the other hunters the opportunity to continue their hunt.

So it's not necessarily "biological" but it's clearly in opposition to an unlimited hunt like this.

 

[Labman]

Can you look up harvest info in Montana that includes horn length?

Also nice to see one of the FWP commissioners offering a congrats

Does FWP take frontal and side pics of harvested rams like they do in other states? I am sure a public information request could get a copy of those if they do.

 

[TheTone]

I’d be curious how curl is determined, are they placed in a jig, use a straight edge or just eyeballed? I’d also doubt any warden is field checking rams by carrying around a drill and horn plugs

 

[winmag]

They are supposed to use a jig to determine 3/4 curl legality.

Therefore “looks legal to me” is total BS.

 

[MThuntr]

Dang this looks super suspicious...that one field pic definitely doesn't look legal. They definitely posed that way to remove any extra doubt. I don't care who he is and if he farts gold powder thats not a legal ram

 

[Bambistew]

There is a lot of discretion in issuing tickets for most violations, which is good IMO. Should there be discretion for the violation of a sub-legal ram? Situations like this one make it extremely tough for the LEO if there is discretion, because the hunter blasted it all over social media before the ram was checked.

In CO, you will almost certainly get a ticket for not wearing an orange or pink hat when it is required (there are still exceptions). We also have a 1/2 curl regulation on rams, and if you shoot a ram that is less than 1/2 curl you will almost certainly be allowed to keep it. The purpose of our reg is primarily to keep hunters from inadvertently shooting ewes. So what is the purpose of the 3/4 curl reg in MT? With a quota in place, I can't imagine it's a biological purpose.

They give a little leeway here, but also confiscate about 5+/-% of rams. They sort of have a jig, but more so its just an eyeball and consensus of half a dozen bios if its really close.

My guess on the UL being 3/4 curl is to maximize opportunity by pushing the harvest to a very small portion of the population. The age/size is inconsequential to the population, IMO, with a quota. Taking a young ram or two is not going to doom a population. Their odds are already stacked against them to make it to 3/4 curl. Taking those ones that are very close reduces the opportunity for others, but if they are "legal." Its just a whine-fest, and selfish hunters. Every UL could be older before its shot. Shooting 7-8yo rams? Those are youngsters. Excluding the UL, only 4 out of 31+/- sheep areas are legal ram, the rest are either sex. Those 4 have quotas of 1 or maybe 2 and really small herds. Some in the 50-70 animal range.

 

[MTGomer]

I can only speak to the Rams that myself and my friends have killed, but they just look at them. Not that ours needed a close look (arrogantly pats own back)

You can check your ram in with just about any FWP employee in the region that can give you a transportation slip. This is the requirement for meeting the legal timeline for physical inspection of horns and intact cape.
Then, you can take it to any regional headquarters to get it plugged.
Perhaps, some FW employees are able to plug mobile, but I do not know that.

No photos are taken, or if they are it is informal and not a part of the official process where those photos are archived with the plug/license number, like they are in Arizona or as I have heard in Colorado.


Biologically, this makes little difference, probably(my opinion-not a biologist). Like others mentioned it does take the ability to hunt away from others, and in this case took it away from others that looked at that ram and others like it and passed on them after determining that they were not legal rams, and even if they were, probably were not rams that those individuals would have killed to begin with.

Legal is legal and if it is, nobody can complain. My imagination just doesn’t work well enough to see that picture, and convert it to this diagram with the desired outcome.
But that might be a me problem.

 

[shines@times]

Yes, it’ll be published after the season. My money is on 4.5yo, 25”x12.5”.

I reckon we will all be watching. I'd suggest a betting pool, but I fear FWP or some other MT or federal agency would crack down on us for illegal gambling, maybe even racketeering! (I'm making the assumption that the majority of us here don't belong to the party that encouraged all the "mostly peaceful demonstrations" that took place in the wake of Floyd's death. Thus, we are targets.)

 

[EYJONAS!]

Yes, it’ll be published after the season. My money is on 4.5yo, 25”x12.5”.

That's pretty generous. Hell that's bigger than this one I think.