WildWill
Well-known member
Don't tell but he's getting a 10/22 for Christmas. He's out grown his orginal 22 he got at 5.I cannot argue. I recall a time when i could not draw the bow I shoot today
At that age I prefers the .22
Finally some good news
- Thread starter rogerthat
- Start date
NEWHunter
Well-known member
Maybe in a different thread. Not this one. This thing has been a dumpster fire from the start. I’ve used compounds and crossbows extensively and hunted with multiple disabled folks going back decades. I’ve seen many of the challenges they face. I don’t think there’s many on this thread can match my experience level here.
I’ve made posts based on all that experience - most here disagree with my position. I’ve tried to provide thoughtful perspective on this thread. Nobody has asked me a question to better understand why I’m so firmly in favor of these opportunities and why I’m so disappointed by what happened in AZ. Most want to argue and disagree rather than understand.
Per the first post, disabled hunters will no longer be able to hunt with a crossbow in Arizona. Somebody literally just posted that there wasn’t any lost opportunity here. I would have to be some kind of stupid to try and convince/argue with that kind of special.
As a lifelong hunter, I’m truly embarrassed by this thread.
P.S. I’m not a fan of the way Wisconsin currently allows everyone to use a crossbow.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Couple things to consider, the first being the original intent of archery seasons.
There is a reason why it was allowed in the first place, mainly because it was supposed to be a more challenging way to hunt. Because of the challenge with becoming efficient/effective with equipment combined with the challenge of having to get close, SPECIAL seasons were adopted. Read again, SPECIAL archery only seasons. Meaning if you weren't willing to practice a lot, be willing to get close, and couldn't use the legal archery equipment...archery was not for you. In other words, you either cut the mustard or you hunt during rifle season.
The reason the lines are blurring and you're arguing your case is because archery equipment has advanced from having no impact to game and the overall experience, to having a very significant impact.
If there was no such thing as a crossbow, how would a disabled person participate with a recurve or longbow in a special archery season?
They wouldn't, they would have to use a rifle. Same as those unwilling or unable to master the primitive equipment that archery seasons were originally adopted for.
Make no mistake, archery hunting has veered way out in the weeds to original intent. I agree with others that the jump from recurves and longbows to compounds was a bigger difference than a modern compound to crossbow.
That said, I don't blame any state for trying to move archery back to its original intent. Yeah, it excludes some handicapped people from archery hunting, but to say it takes them out of hunting or the opportunity to hunt is absolutely horseshit.
It does no such thing, that's what all weapon seasons are for.
Also, you seem to be wanting others to clean up the abusers and those gaming the systems, but you haven't mentioned anything you've done to address it.
I'm all about giving handicapped folks opportunities, but not if helping a handful of people is going to compromise opportunities for everyone else.
Like I said, I'm much more inclined to identify those people that truly are handicapped and focusing on helping them specifically, rather than broad brush approaches that allow massive abuses that impact opportunities for everyone and the wildlife in a negative way.
Nick87
Well-known member
Are you embarrassed by the amount of "hunters" who use not much less than a hang nail to abuse the system originally designed for truly disabled people? I certainly am.
Mallardsx2
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 4, 2015
- Messages
- 2,761
My stance on crossguns hasn’t changed. Ever. And it never will.
Before crossbows were legal in Pennsylvania, it was actually ridiculously easy for somebody to go to the doctor and say their shoulder was hurting and get a note to be able to use a crossbow. It was being abused rampantly across the state. I think that’s why the state finally just threw their hands up and said here you go, now all of you babies can participate…
Now 75% of “bow hunters” are hunting with a crossbow and buck harvest with “Archery tackle” has quadrupled.
Crossbows have ruined the intent of archery in that state and many others. I watched it all unfold. It still sickens me.
I would love to see crossbows banned in all archery seasons for everyone and I mean everyone. If you can’t draw a bow, hunt the gun season and if you can’t shoot a gun, maybe hunting just isn’t for you.
Before crossbows were legal in Pennsylvania, it was actually ridiculously easy for somebody to go to the doctor and say their shoulder was hurting and get a note to be able to use a crossbow. It was being abused rampantly across the state. I think that’s why the state finally just threw their hands up and said here you go, now all of you babies can participate…
Now 75% of “bow hunters” are hunting with a crossbow and buck harvest with “Archery tackle” has quadrupled.
Crossbows have ruined the intent of archery in that state and many others. I watched it all unfold. It still sickens me.
I would love to see crossbows banned in all archery seasons for everyone and I mean everyone. If you can’t draw a bow, hunt the gun season and if you can’t shoot a gun, maybe hunting just isn’t for you.
we need to do what’s right and a have a Middle Ages themed season where crossbows are legal. Maybe it should be during calving season so the deer and elk are easier to hit. Bludgeoning weapons are legal too but of period appropriate cloths must be worn.
SaskHunter
Well-known member
Your argument is about quantity, not quality, of opportunities when there already are opportunities. You want disabled people to have MORE opportunities than they already have, such as gun seasons or designated crossbow seasons.
You can understand someone's perspective and still completely disagree with them. People need to be empathetic, not emotional about issues. Life isn't fair; some people are born with different abilities; some can hike 16 miles deep in the mountains and pack an elk out on their backs, some were born without the ability to walk. The person who can hike farther and harder will simply have more opportunities than the person who is bound to a wheelchair.
As long as the disabled, old, poor, weak, etc, have a reasonable opportunity to hunt, what is the problem? Why so gung-ho about disabled people hunting with crossbows when the majority of Provinces and States have plenty of regular gun or crossbow opportunities?
Archery seasons are designed to be harder with lower success rates. I also don't buy the argument that just about anyone can pick up a compound bow and be killers out to 100 yards. Are compound bows better than recurves? Off course they are, but that is completely separate issue. Most of us spend dozens of hours flinging arrows at targets to maybe get a shot at a 40 yard deer. Just not everyone has the time, abilities or skills to do that. Ever missed an opportunity at a deer because you had to take the safety off your rifle or crossbow? I sure haven't! How many opportunities have I missed at animals because I couldn't draw my bow back? A crap ton! What about range? Crossbows have a longer range than the average bow hunter's. Again, how many animals have been beyond my personal max rang, that would be dead with a crossbow? Tons and I guarantee you I would fill my archery mule deer tag every year, on big deer if I were able to crossbow hunt them! But I digress, we're arguing over already existing opportunities anyway.
The fact that someone doesn't agree with you, and continuously gives you reasons why, doesn't mean they lack empathy or are an embarrassment to the hunting community. Get over yourself and that high crossbow perch you're on!
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Archer86
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- Joined
- Apr 18, 2022
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- 291
I'd only this same logic could be applied to nr hunters......you have plenty of opportunities in your home state stay home
SaskHunter
Well-known member
No one here is arguing for relaxed NR regulations, that would put them ahead of Rs.
BuzzH
Well-known member
I think a vast majority do, or at least spend a majority of their time hunting their home states.
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