Clintons plan for public lands

[James Riley]

Yet you're willing to vote for a guy who has had 4 bankruptcies, countless lawsuits and many, many ethical complaints filed against him.

Maybe. But check this out: If folks are thinking about doing that, it serves as an indictment of a failed establishment. "They" brought Trump on themselves. It's not like they haven't had forever to un-F themselves.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Maybe. But check this out: If folks are thinking about doing that, it serves as an indictment of a failed establishment. "They" brought Trump on themselves. It's not like they haven't had forever to un-F themselves.

I don't disagree. 30 yewars of anti-politics has created the mess, and created Trump.

That doesn't mean you have to vote for Cthulhu to come and wreak havoc on the world.

 

[noharleyyet]

FIFY

Best post on this thread.....

 

[James Riley]

I don't disagree. 30 yewars of anti-politics has created the mess, and created Trump.

That doesn't mean you have to vote for Cthulhu to come and wreak havoc on the world.

Cthulhu might be likened to Hitler in this exchange. But I don't think we are there yet. I have serious doubts about what I'm going to say. I could be WAY off. I admit that. But here's my gut instinct:

*IF* Trump were to be elected President of the United States, one must ask what motives would dictate his actions. I've watched the man for some time now and believe me, I see all the same dumb crap everyone else sees. Point taken. I can't think of a more ass-opposite personality from mine, and have no desire to have a beer with him. But I don't think he would be motivated by money. I don't think he would be motivated by power. I don't think he would be motivated by the limelight (I know, I know, but more on this later). I don't think he would be motivated by a desire to please people. I don't think he would be motivated to "close deals" for the sake of proving that he was a deal closer.

I think that, after the inauguration and receipt of the secrets which cause the complete change in demeanor and sunken shoulders and loss of glint-in-the-eye that we always see immediately after inauguration, and after he's had a little time alone on the shitter to think about what actually happened and that he actually got elected and now here he is; I think the only thing left will be the concept of legacy. I think, unlike many Presidents who start to worry about that in their last years, Trump will start thinking about that right away.

I think he will do something that has generally worked for him in the past and that is to delegate and manage.

In delegation he will seek the best counsel money can buy or which is voluntarily given. This does not necessarily include what the establishment thinks is best. Gravitas won't be what he's looking for. Experience (ala Hillary) will not be accepted for it's own sake. Guy's like Henry Kissenger and James Baker and Dick Cheney, et al, will be judged on how often they've been right, not on how they come across or present themselves. Trump will think long term, and seek out long term thinkers and results. He won't get wrapped up in the "realpolitik" vs empathy debate of the present.

As to management, it will be all about results. He will demand results. And don't be surprised if he constantly goes directly to the people of any given district in any given state and directly appeals to them to reign in their Congressman or Senator who might be giving him shit. He may call them out, by name, to their face, and force people to live with the results of their votes, or a failure to turn screws on elected representatives.

Why do I think Trump will err on the beneficent bend in the arc of history, and not go all Hitler on us? I don't really know. I just "feel" that he has arrived at that point in his life where the only thing that could possibly matter more to him than how he is perceived now, is how he will be perceived 100 or more years from now. He may love the limelight but when those moments on the shitter, alone, become fewer and further between, he'll tire of it. He probably already has.

I can't think of any possible motive that would appeal to the man, other than what will be thought of him by those who haven't been born yet. I don't think he gives a shit about what most people think now. Why should he? It's all so short term. So now. Invest in the future and trust in our better natures. It's not all about growth, unless that includes growing in new directions, or maybe, in some cases, growing smaller, some cases bigger, but not just growth for GNP's sake.

Here's my point in a nutshell: Once you have all that money and now you have all that power, you don't really care what people think, and you aren't seeking their approval, are you really going to be an asshole to history? I don't think so. You might be an asshole to the present, but that can just be a down payment or investment in a better future. He's got nothing else to live for.

I'm not saying he couldn't be worse than Bush Jr. but we are resilient and we managed to survive a broken world. If we can survive that, I think we can survive Trump. Trump, like Obama, will still have some fixing to do, but I think he'll be up for it.

There is a risk of Hitler or Cthulhu but I don't think we are there yet. He's not that bad. It's not like he is Bush Jr.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Yeah, you're completely wrong. But I still love you.

 

[James Riley]

Yeah, you're completely wrong. But I still love you.

I was wrong once (now twice), so I have experience. Not as much as Hillary, but experience nonetheless.

 

[Gr8bawana]

Cthulhu might be likened to Hitler in this exchange. But I don't think we are there yet. I have serious doubts about what I'm going to say. I could be WAY off. I admit that. But here's my gut instinct:

*IF* Trump were to be elected President of the United States, one must ask what motives would dictate his actions. I've watched the man for some time now and believe me, I see all the same dumb crap everyone else sees. Point taken. I can't think of a more ass-opposite personality from mine, and have no desire to have a beer with him. But I don't think he would be motivated by money. I don't think he would be motivated by power. I don't think he would be motivated by the limelight (I know, I know, but more on this later). I don't think he would be motivated by a desire to please people. I don't think he would be motivated to "close deals" for the sake of proving that he was a deal closer.
I think he will do something that has generally worked for him in the past and that is to delegate and manage.

Wow! That is some creative thinking.
Money is the only thing that motivates the Trump Troll.
As for delegate and manage we've all seen how well that has worked and led to 4 bankruptcies. Whenever he is asked about those failed ventures he says he had other people in charge and he had nothing to do with it except let them use his name. Yea. that's the kind of moron we should have running the country.
Here's another one of many reason Trump is unfit. Failing to pay businesses and people for work they have done. He knows most people simply can't afford to hire a lawyer to sue him for money owed. Another reason his is just a money grubbing scumbag.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...97274/&usg=AFQjCNHqx9Ia0aVTvqChIcVjsb0NVeXrjQ

 

[Nemont]

Cthulhu might be likened to Hitler in this exchange. But I don't think we are there yet. I have serious doubts about what I'm going to say. I could be WAY off. I admit that. But here's my gut instinct:

*IF* Trump were to be elected President of the United States, one must ask what motives would dictate his actions. I've watched the man for some time now and believe me, I see all the same dumb crap everyone else sees. Point taken. I can't think of a more ass-opposite personality from mine, and have no desire to have a beer with him. But I don't think he would be motivated by money. I don't think he would be motivated by power. I don't think he would be motivated by the limelight (I know, I know, but more on this later). I don't think he would be motivated by a desire to please people. I don't think he would be motivated to "close deals" for the sake of proving that he was a deal closer.
I think he will do something that has generally worked for him in the past and that is to delegate and manage.

Wow! That is some creative thinking.
Money is the only thing that motivates the Trump Troll.
As for delegate and manage we've all seen how well that has worked and led to 4 bankruptcies. Whenever he is asked about those failed ventures he says he had other people in charge and he had nothing to do with it except let them use his name. Yea. that's the kind of moron we should have running the country.
Here's another one of many reason Trump is unfit. Failing to pay businesses and people for work they have done. He knows most people simply can't afford to hire a lawyer to sue him for money owed. Another reason his is just a money grubbing scumbag.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...97274/&usg=AFQjCNHqx9Ia0aVTvqChIcVjsb0NVeXrjQ

I agree that Trump is a troll who isn't my choice. Can you point out what motivates Hillary and to list her of accomplishments while in public service for basically that last 25 years? Ever wonder how she went from broke in 2000 to being worth over $100 million now? Think she isn't motivated by money?

Nemont

 

[Washington Hunter]

He's been a businessman for 50 years, a few bankruptcies is just part of doing business. What has Hillary ever done in her life? How many jobs has she created?

You guys think there's ever going to be the perfect candidate with a flawless past? Give Trump a break and let him have 4 years to fix America. He certainly couldn't screw things up any worse than our current president has!

 

[JLS]

He certainly couldn't screw things up any worse than our current president has!

I wish I could buy into this statement, but I just can't.

 

[Gr8bawana]

I agree that Trump is a troll who isn't my choice. Can you point out what motivates Hillary and to list her of accomplishments while in public service for basically that last 25 years? Ever wonder how she went from broke in 2000 to being worth over $100 million now? Think she isn't motivated by money?

Nemont

I think we can all agree that there isn't a politician in office of either party that isn't in it for personal gain. They may have started out with noble intentions but in the end it's always about making money for themselves.
It's just that some will screw the country and everyone in it without any regard to the mess they will leave in their wake.

 

[Nemont]

I think we can all agree that there isn't a politician in office of either party that isn't in it for personal gain. They may have started out with noble intentions but in the end it's always about making money for themselves.
It's just that some will screw the country and everyone in it without any regard to the mess they will leave in their wake.

So no list of accomplishments upon which to run on other than she is a woman and she isn't Trump/ That is not enough of reason to cast a ballot for her. Got any proof she cares what kind of mess she would leave behind? Can you find a time when she had a choice where she made the correct choice? Start with the decision to wed Bill and go from there.


Nemont

 

[noharleyyet]

This really does prove, what I've known forever.

..and my choosing to not cast a ballot for either of 2 unqualified jackasses since I could vote, is now what many are choosing to do.

Welcome to the camp...I've been here for a long time.

Such voluminous wisdom...we are not worthy...but certainly can't say you didn't tell us.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Hmmm seems like we are getting close to, if have not already proved Godwin's rule on this thread...

 

[noharleyyet]

Reductio ad Hitlerum

 

[Gr8bawana]

He's been a businessman for 50 years, a few bankruptcies is just part of doing business. What has Hillary ever done in her life? How many jobs has she created?

You guys think there's ever going to be the perfect candidate with a flawless past? Give Trump a break and let him have 4 years to fix America. He certainly couldn't screw things up any worse than our current president has!

Fix it? Make America great again? America is not broken and American never stopped being great.
Trump is simply not an option because he would break America and we would no longer be the great nation we are and have been for over 200 years.

 

[Tradewind]

1. I am self employed, a small business owner, with employees, for over two decades. The only time I sucked the federal tit was as a Recon Team Leader in the Marine Corps.
2. Socialists don't ever run out of other people's money for the reasons I taught you but you didn't learn.
3. You missed the mark on Venezuela and their dependence on oil. It tanked but it gave. Other's didn't tank because they didn't give. When you are one trick, that can happen.
4. As to Denmark, it's not my favorite example. Please don't pretend to tell me what I think. You will be just as successful as you were in guessing about my employ. I don't know much about Denmark. Ask Jose. I'm sure he can educate you. America is my favorite example. We are socialist. Just one of the many flavors of socialism. And we were much better, and our American Dream was much more alive when our tax rates were higher, and when enlightenment was part of our self-interest. But you'd have to have studied these things to know about them.

You guessed about me. Let me guess about you: No, never mind. That's not my thing.

Guess away. I'm curious. Sorry to offend you. I like Uncle Sam's misguided Children. We'll have to agree to disagree. You can only spend what you've earned or what you have for credit. If you're prominent enuf to lhave a first world country and a good printing press you can print your way to a longer term of socialism, but at some point it will still catch you.

 

[Washington Hunter]

Yes Trump sure is an option, he's set records for the number of people voting for a Republican candidate in the primaries. And I'd say America has a lot of room for improvement. To start how about giving our citizens preference over illegal immigrants and refugees?

 

[James Riley]

Guess away. I'm curious. Sorry to offend you. I like Uncle Sam's misguided Children. We'll have to agree to disagree. You can only spend what you've earned or what you have for credit. If you're prominent enuf to lhave a first world country and a good printing press you can print your way to a longer term of socialism, but at some point it will still catch you.

You didn't offend me. You just kind of fell in with my expectations. Anyway, greed will never leave us. Never. And ALL governments tap (socialize) that greed. Some over tap it, some under tap it. But they all tap it. We are under-tapping it. But it will always be there for the tapping.

I think we are a second world country now (our health care and infrastructure suck, relative to the first world that invests in such things). But regardless, we do have the printing press and the world trades on the PetroDollar. If they switched to a PetroEuro or some other denomination (ala Iraq, Iran, North Korea) or barter (ala Venezuela), all of whom are or were on our S list simply because of that, then we'd be a third or fourth world country over night. To that extent we are a one trick pony too. Better hope our awesome military keeps them from switching.

 

[Tradewind]

Just a guess, you didn't fact check that meme you found on Facebook.

I dont do facebook, JR. The Fin's social empire is as far as I get. Actually I did fact check a good share that Item that is floating - enuf to see that the comments were reasosnably close. But as always. People do cherry pick what makes their arguemnet
Top tax rate of 51.95% which most seem to pay. Add on the 25% sales tax for most items, or what ever they call it puts you close enuf to the 81% given the add ons.
You can avoid the sales tax if you dont buy anything. Good luck with that. Gas is indeed close to $10 in the article I found.
The suicide rate varies compared to the US, but in most of the year's I found it was above.
Given that statistics lies and can certainly be manipulated, the most telling item I found was that they elected politicians more to the right in a recent election.
So apparently the voting population was unhappy in paradise