AR 15 and 10 type rifles

[Deleted member 28227]

I will have to say that one difference between an AR and a mini-14 is that, while I'm sure some will chime in about how accurate and consistent their mini-14 is, I've never been around one that would shoot like a nicely tuned AR as far as consistent repeatable accuracy. I've had both, and find the AR more useful for my shooting needs, but I do recognize that it does attract a crowd that doesn't see in it the same utility that I do.

My point is more that people who have a ruger mini 14, know about AR's and choose a ruger over an AR for a reason, I'm not sure what reason they just did. The city boys playing with their toys at the range don't know Ruger makes a rifle in 5.56.

That fact doesn't mean that someone like you shouldn't be able to own one, or that there aren't utilitarian reasons for doing so... but I think we have to be honest about reality.

 

[bushman13]

Considering the A.R. is most of what the media talks about when discussing gun control, for the last 25 years, I find that statement hard to believe. The statistics are very clear on the percentage of "active shooters" using A.R.'s or to the % of gun deaths in general. They are not statistically insignificant, but very low.

When comparing statistics to media coverage, one would have to conclude the removal of A.R's to be a ploy.

To be honest I'm not sure I've heard that in the media... I have't had cable news since highschool, the only time I watch Fox, MSNBC, CNN, is when I'm sitting in an airport lounge flying somewhere. My comment is based on my anecdotal experience at gun ranges, hunting, and having knowledge of the weapons used at high profile shootings. No idea if it could be substantiated, by statistics...

 

[RockinU]

My point is more that people who have a ruger mini 14, know about AR's and choose a ruger over an AR for a reason, I'm not sure what reason they just did. The city boys playing with their toys at the range don't know Ruger makes a rifle in 5.56.

That fact doesn't mean that someone like you shouldn't be able to own one, or that there aren't utilitarian reasons for doing so... but I think we have to be honest about reality.

I agree. And I will also say (and I'm sure that this will cause a lot of gasping and teeth gnashing), that if I thought for a minute, that giving up my AR would solve some larger violence epidemic, or end mass shooting, or even curtail the call for further gun restrictions, I'd give it up. Not as an act of surrendering any right, but simply because for my utilitarian purposes, I have other guns that can do what it does pretty close to as well. As it stands though, I don't think giving it up would do any of those things, and I still think it's ridiculous of the gun control crowd to focus so much attention on the AR when far far more gun deaths every year are attributed to pistols.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I agree. And I will also say (and I'm sure that this will cause a lot of gasping and teeth gnashing), that if I thought for a minute, that giving up my AR would solve some larger violence epidemic, or end mass shooting, or even curtail the call for further gun restrictions, I'd give it up. Not as an act of surrendering any right, but simply because for my utilitarian purposes, I have other guns that can do what it does pretty close to as well. As it stands though, I don't think giving it up would do any of those things, and I still think it's ridiculous of the gun control crowd to focus so much attention on the AR when far far more gun deaths every year are attributed to pistols.

I agree.

and to play devils advocate to my own argument, say you make everything but hunting rifles + shotguns illegal, put in gun licenses et. etc. and then you still have people shooting up school's with ARs what did you achieve. I think you could lower rates of shootings with legislation, but it wouldn't get close to eliminating them. Should you completely remove rights just for a 10-20% reduction...

 

[Straight Arrow]

Great discussion with valid points. But all I hear is "Do NOTHING!" or you will take someone's "right".

Why cannot a right be protected with oversight to not abuse that right? Driving on public highways remains a valid analogy. The right is granted depending on adherence to safe driving rules, responsibility for safe condition of vehicle, not infringing on other drivers' rights, demonstrating safe driving skills through an exam both written and practical, and maintaining a current license and ID. That said, the number of abusers and resultant highway accidents and fatalities is appalling because of the ever continuing faction of stupid irresponsible people. (Ya just can't fix stupid!) But without general adherence to the oversight requirements, I assert that the situation would be much worse. I would support similar oversight and enforcement for firearms' ownership and usage. I oppose the "slippery slope", "you're taking my rights!", so "Do NOTHING!" non-remedy.

 

[Sytes]

This is more for the banter of the internet world though, active shooter school settings... Seems shotguns are frequently utilized.
Anti gun people pander to the magazine size, qty of rounds within a mag, etc... the amount of reloads for a shotgun in those settings *should be enough to discount that argument though it's a brick wall regardless the side of the debate one stands.

 

[Gr8bawana]

Here is my idea. Yes I know it will not stop future mass shooting but it may make a difference.
AR/AK type weapons should be regulated just like fully automatic machine guns. Anyone who can pass a background check and wants to pay the $200 yearly tax would be able to legally keep one.
I guarantee you would eliminate a very large potion of these clowns, like this one who think they're barney bad-@$$ just because they have one to spray bullets all over the desert.
I for one have no use or need for one so I really don't care if someone's "right" might be infringed if it could make a difference.

 

[Cogreeny]

“Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” Benjamin Franklin

 

[Deleted member 28227]

“Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” Benjamin Franklin

"Dammit governor who cares if the Penn's are going to kick you out of office, if you don't tax them to raise money for the army there won't be an army and Indians are going to burn down the whole colony"- B. Franklin...

But yeah... carrying rifles into starbucks...

 

[Cogreeny]

So what you’re saying is you dislike Benjamin Franklin one of our greatest founding fathers?

 

[Sytes]

Starbucks has the right to refuse firearms w/in their buildings. IF that's a Starbucks, staged, or another business.

I saw women with vaginas on their heads... Making a statement, I hope.

 

[antelopedundee]

Saying a semi auto rifle is worthless without a high capacity mag is news to me. Same for semi auto shotguns? How about pistols?

Dig deeper my friends

The high capacity magazine is useless without a rifle to go with it.

 

[VikingsGuy]

So what you’re saying is you dislike Benjamin Franklin one of our greatest founding fathers?

No - he is pointing out the actual context for the quote you chose. Franklin was not encouraging people to protect their liberty from their government, he was encouraging legislators and the governor to raise property taxes - despite pushback from the Penns.

 

[Sytes]

No - he is pointing out the actual context for the quote you chose. Franklin was not encouraging people to protect their liberty from their government, he was encouraging legislators and the governor to raise property taxes - despite pushback from the Penns.

While that was the *general content, we're missing a portion of his intent for taxing...

The French Indian war was upon us and for the collective security of America, it was necessary to collect the tax.

As quoted, it is 100% applicable.

 

[Cogreeny]

No - he is pointing out the actual context for the quote you chose. Franklin was not encouraging people to protect their liberty from their government, he was encouraging legislators and the governor to raise property taxes - despite pushback from the Penns.

No - he is pointing out the actual context for the quote you chose. Franklin was not encouraging people to protect their liberty from their government, he was encouraging legislators and the governor to raise property taxes - despite pushback from the Penns.

I did not know that. Learn something new everyday. I think it still makes sense in the point I was trying to make

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I did not know that. Learn something new everyday. I think it still makes sense in the point I was trying to make

Given that more Americans died from firearms last year than were killed in the revolutionary war, including those killed by disease and starvation during the winter, I’m not sure if anything the founding fathers said or wrote is relevant.

The one relevant thing our founding fathers did do was to make our constitution a living document, each generation has the ability to think for themselves.

 

[Cogreeny]

Given that more Americans died from firearms last year than were killed in the reveloutionary war, including those killed by disease and starvation during the winter, I’m not sure if anything the founding said or wrote fathers is relevant.

The one relevant thing our founding fathers did do was to make our constitution a living document, each generation has the ability to think for themselves.

Can you give me the numbers that were killed with other “weapons” such as hammers, knives etc.? I really don’t know, I suspect more than firearms and I suspect your numbers include suicides which is a large number the liberal statistics like to include.

 

[Cogreeny]

Can you give me the numbers that were killed with other “weapons” such as hammers, knives etc.? I really don’t know, I suspect more than firearms and I suspect your numbers include suicides which is a large number the liberal statistics like to include.

I also wonder when the left deems your bolt action rifle a “sniper” rifle and it’s a danger to society what will you do then? I’m just assuming you own a bolt gun

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Can you give me the numbers that were killed with other “weapons” such as hammers, knives etc.? I really don’t know, I suspect more than firearms and I suspect your numbers include suicides which is a large number the liberal statistics like to include.

 

[Cogreeny]

I’m just asking a simple question man not trying to be a dickhead