PAGOAT
Active member
This ^^ hogs are ugly and horses are "cute" if they were wild hogs you would not hear anything about it.
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Wyoming wild horses
- Thread starter timbertrash
- Start date
1_pointer is correct. Overgrazing in any area is a function of time, not number of head. 1000 animals on 10 acres for 30 minutes can be quite effective while 5 animals on 10 acres for 6 months can be incredibly destructive. Permitted grazing on public land can be managed, now whether that management is currently effective is an entirely different discussion.
Wild horses have devastating effects on the land just because they are on it year round, and their effect on riparian areas in the fragile desert ecosystems they inhabit can/has altered the landscape in ways that we probably don't yet realize. Any group of horses, wild or domestic, will camp in an area during the heat of the summer for days and usually that area is next to water. They'll eat the same plant time and time again without regard to the recovery time that plant needs to survive.
Cattle will do the same thing, but again can be removed/fenced out of the area.
I'm sure many of you have seen a horse in an acre or less confinement that they live in year round. How much vegetation was in that confinement, and was it all the same height? Chances are it was mostly bare dirt, and what plants there were are either weeds or big coarse perennials that a horse has no interest in eating. Even if it was a 5 acre plot, there will be spots where the plants look healthy and others where there is nothing but dirt or the grass is grubbed down to almost nothing. Horses are very selective eaters, more so than cattle, sheep, or any ungulate for that matter, and they will graze a favorable plant until its gone before eating the less desirable plant that might be just inches away.
The wild horse numbers are well over the carrying capacity of most areas and that is directly leading to habitat destruction, which as we are aware is the biggest factor wildlife conservation currently and always will face.
Wild horses have devastating effects on the land just because they are on it year round, and their effect on riparian areas in the fragile desert ecosystems they inhabit can/has altered the landscape in ways that we probably don't yet realize. Any group of horses, wild or domestic, will camp in an area during the heat of the summer for days and usually that area is next to water. They'll eat the same plant time and time again without regard to the recovery time that plant needs to survive.
Cattle will do the same thing, but again can be removed/fenced out of the area.
I'm sure many of you have seen a horse in an acre or less confinement that they live in year round. How much vegetation was in that confinement, and was it all the same height? Chances are it was mostly bare dirt, and what plants there were are either weeds or big coarse perennials that a horse has no interest in eating. Even if it was a 5 acre plot, there will be spots where the plants look healthy and others where there is nothing but dirt or the grass is grubbed down to almost nothing. Horses are very selective eaters, more so than cattle, sheep, or any ungulate for that matter, and they will graze a favorable plant until its gone before eating the less desirable plant that might be just inches away.
The wild horse numbers are well over the carrying capacity of most areas and that is directly leading to habitat destruction, which as we are aware is the biggest factor wildlife conservation currently and always will face.
They are in fact feral because they are not native to north america. They were not introduced like pheasants or brown trout as a game animal they escaped from captivity as a work animal.
They were originally brought over by the Spaniards and of course some of them escaped. So yes they should be treated just like feral pigs.
BrentD
Well-known member
Actually, they are introduced, repeatedly, not just escaped. People dump horses like they dump dogs and cats. Beyond that, horses evolved on this continent originally, not that it matters to this discussion.
But for the purposes of clarity, the use of wild vs feral can be useful, not because says anything about origins, but rather because it says everything about how the populations are being maintained. The former is self-maintained, the latter is only maintained by continued escapes or dumps from domesticated sources.
That's enough grammar police for me.
But for the purposes of clarity, the use of wild vs feral can be useful, not because says anything about origins, but rather because it says everything about how the populations are being maintained. The former is self-maintained, the latter is only maintained by continued escapes or dumps from domesticated sources.
That's enough grammar police for me.
npaden
Well-known member
So feral hogs are not capable of self-maintaining their population? That's why there are millions of them in the state of Texas alone?
BrentD
Well-known member
They are wild hogs.
npaden
Well-known member
You may need to get with the folks that are putting together the dictionaries to help them get a better understanding of the words feral and wild. They don't seem to have as good of a grasp on them as you do.
While you are at it you might want to get with Texas Parks & Wildlife Department and let them know they are using the wrong terminology.
Here is their publication "The Feral Hog in Texas".
https://tpwd.texas.gov/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_bk_w7000_0195.pdf
While you are at it you might want to get with Texas Parks & Wildlife Department and let them know they are using the wrong terminology.
Here is their publication "The Feral Hog in Texas".
https://tpwd.texas.gov/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_bk_w7000_0195.pdf
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The Hedgehog
Well-known member
Need something like this, except with wild mustangs. The Nuge and Pigman did an episode. 
[video=youtube_share;DOmvNHiw]https://youtu.be/DOmvNHiw[/video]
[video=youtube_share;D
OmvNHiw]https://youtu.be/DOmvNHiw[/video]You are 100% wrong. Are you trying to tell us that feral pigs and horses are being dumped by the thousands every year? I wonder where you're getting your incorrect information?
BrentD
Well-known member
In fact, that is exactly what I DID NOT say.
My understanding on the distinction between wild (but non-native) and feral is this:
Feral: This species has been domesticated by man, but the feral individuals have escaped or been introduced into the wild and are able to sustain their numbers (e.g., hogs, horses, ...maybe pigeons?)
Wild (but non-native): They are a wild animal in their home range, but have been introduced to places they aren't native and are able to sustain their numbers without further augmentation (e.g., starlings, common carp, barbary sheep in the US).
So I guess I see feral as a subset of wild -- i.e., all feral animals are wild, but not all wild animals are feral.
Discuss.
Feral: This species has been domesticated by man, but the feral individuals have escaped or been introduced into the wild and are able to sustain their numbers (e.g., hogs, horses, ...maybe pigeons?)
Wild (but non-native): They are a wild animal in their home range, but have been introduced to places they aren't native and are able to sustain their numbers without further augmentation (e.g., starlings, common carp, barbary sheep in the US).
So I guess I see feral as a subset of wild -- i.e., all feral animals are wild, but not all wild animals are feral.
Discuss.
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icebreaker12
Active member
No need to discuss. This should end the discussion.
bobbydean
Well-known member
Horse meat is popular in the world. Would anyone on here eat it.
I love horses, and would probably pass. Someone's suggestion to harvest the wild horses and ship to France; I could live with it. You guys in Montana or Utah could make some money!
I love horses, and would probably pass. Someone's suggestion to harvest the wild horses and ship to France; I could live with it. You guys in Montana or Utah could make some money!
icebreaker12
Active member
Most don't realize this, but Wyoming already has wolves where they have FERAL horses.
BrentD
Well-known member
Keeptrying
Active member
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2016
- Messages
- 678
If worse came to worse I would eat my horse.
bobbydean
Well-known member
I shot my horse and buried him 12 feet under. And I cried.
Survival . It is different.
Survival . It is different.
I ate horse in Iceland. They raise horses there like we raise beef. We drove over most of the island and I saw only one farm that had had cattle/ cows. But every farm had sheep and horses.
Keeptrying
Active member
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2016
- Messages
- 678
Ya, I'd be pretty tore up.
