WY HB124 transferring preference points

[BuzzH]

Just when you think the legislative bullchit is limited to Montana...enter WYOMING:W:

HB124 would make preference points transferable to other hunters...

Real beauty of bill.

(m) The holder of any valid big game preference
10 points may, once in the holder's lifetime, apply in writing
11 to the department to transfer his currently accumulated
12 preference points for one (1) or more species to a
13 specified recipient who is an immediate family member in a
14 format as established by commission rule and regulation.
15 Any preference points transferred in accordance with the
16 provisions of this subsection shall be for the same species
17 as the preference points donated and shall be transferred
18 to a recipient with the same residency status as the
19 donating person. The preference points shall be
20 transferred by the department to the specified recipient
21 for a fee of thirty-five dollars ($35.00) per species. Any
22 preference points donated and transferred under the
23 provisions of this subsection shall not be sold, purchased,
24 traded, auctioned or offered for any monetary value and
2013 STATE OF WYOMING 13LSO-0352
5 HB0124
1 shall not be issued to, or used by, any person other than
2 the specified recipient. Preference points transferred to
3 a recipient shall be subject to all other limitations and
4 restrictions on preference points as if the recipient
5 earned the preference points as otherwise provided by law.
6 For purposes of this subsection, "immediate family member"
7 means a spouse, child or stepchild.



http://legisweb.state.wy.us/2013/Introduced/HB0124.pdf

 

[spook12]

I bet the Probate lawyers of WY. are licking their chops.

 

[blb078]

Nice so now I can have my dad, mom, and two brothers all put in for a WY pp and next year transfer them to me. I'll have a 4 point jump. But wait, I can have my brothers wives put in, transfer their points to my brothers before they transfer them to me?? I see their intention w/the bill(other than collecting a small fee) if a father/mother has gotten to the point were he/she may not be able to hunt anymore(or the other way around I guess), so they would allow the points to be transferred. But as you can see someone can easily abuse it. At least it's only once in a lifetime.

 

[cowboy]

I bet the Probate lawyers of WY. are licking their chops.

Plus any that need/want to rewrite wills. Be interesting who Dad wills his preference points to.

And I thought montana legislators had a monopoly on stupidity.

 

[WapitiBob]

Every hunter with a cpl family dogs is licking his chops. Every member of my family has points and my brother and sisterinlaw are about to.

 

[BuzzH]

State Senator Larry Hicks is the one licking his chops.

Between wanting to get rid of bighorn sheep in the Encampment river Wilderness, setting up a preference system for resident elk, deer, and antelope, and now transferring of preference points...he's becoming the most greedy and self serving son-of-bitch ever to make the legislature.

I wrongly gave him the benefit of the doubt, thinking that having a hunter in the legislature, and I'm using that term loosely with him, would be a good thing.

Should have known after what happened with my wifes antelope hunt this year...what a d-bag.

Oh, and AZ402, sorry I ever recommended that you trade information with this tool....that mistake was all mine and I'll own it.

 

[belly-deep]

I bet the Probate lawyers of WY. are licking their chops.

I bet the probate lawyers don't give damn

 

[EBOLAVIRS]

State Senator Larry Hicks is the one licking his chops.

Between wanting to get rid of bighorn sheep in the Encampment river Wilderness, setting up a preference system for resident elk, deer, and antelope, and now transferring of preference points...he's becoming the most greedy and self serving son-of-bitch ever to make the legislature.

I wrongly gave him the benefit of the doubt, thinking that having a hunter in the legislature, and I'm using that term loosely with him, would be a good thing.

Should have known after what happened with my wifes antelope hunt this year...what a d-bag.

Oh, and AZ402, sorry I ever recommended that you trade information with this tool....that mistake was all mine and I'll own it.

What did he do to your wife's hunt?

 

[BuzzH]

Not sure, but I dont think Senator Hicks will have to read between the lines...

Senator Hicks,

I'm really not sure where to start with some of the legislation you've introduced. I'll preface by saying that I was actually pretty excited to know that, what I thought was a Sportsman, was elected to the State Senate.

I figured you'd give sportsmen/women a much needed voice in the State Legislature that would help wildlife, conservation efforts, as well as sportsmen.

I was wrong...very wrong.

I have read extensively 3 bills that you're endorsing that very clearly throw Resident Hunters, Non-Resident Hunter, and Wyomings Wildlife under the bus.

I'll start with SF-0076. Its my understanding of this bill that you have asked to secure money to relocate the Encampment River Bighorn Sheep herd if any action by a federal judge or agency requires the elimination of or retirement of domestic sheep grazing in the Sierre Madre's. I find this quite unusual for many reasons. The first being that you'd put a herd of wild sheep on the chopping block for the sake of strong arming the courts as well as federal land agencies. I find it reprehensible that any state Senator would use the publics wildlife resources as a pawn in some political chess match. Rather than try to work in cooperation with Sportsmen, Ranching, and Wildlife organizations to come up with solutions to address the problems with domestic/wild sheep issues...you just choose to remove the Publics wildlife from Public lands. This is not the type of legislation that is going to endear you to the Sportsmen of Wyoming. Any legislation that has the potential to remove public wildlife from public lands is just flat wrong...no question. I really wonder what the TRUE motivation is for this legislation? Perhaps there is a reason other than political pay-back that I'm not seeing.

Next, I'll dive right into SF-0085, the preference point bill you introduced. From information I've gathered, you are making unfounded claims, stating that "a mjority of Residents want a preference point system". I'd really like to know where you're getting this information? I dont know a single hunter in Wyoming that has ever been polled or asked if they support a preference system. I can tell you from the Wyoming Hunters I know, they are much more in favor of a bonus point system than preference. You, of all people, should know the problems associated with Preference Systems. Mainly, that if a hunter isnt in on the ground floor of these systems, their odds of drawing the best permits are about zero. Another thing you havent thought of (yeah right), is the potential for abuse of preference systems. If a preference system passes, I can assure you that many Residents will be applying their neighbors, non-hunting family members, non-hunting friends, etc for preference points. They will then "piggy-back" as a party member to increase their preference point totals to draw better tags down the road. I'm quite confident that you and I both know hunters that are serious enough to do something like that (hint). This is perfect lead into your next piece of legislation you're supporting.

HB124 is a real piece of work. This is the legislation that would allow the transfer of preference points. This legislation is the EXACT type of reason why Preference Systems should not be adopted to start with. The potential for abuse with this legislation is beyond comprehension. Again, the potential for hunters applying their non-hunting family members simply to gain more points is all this will accomplish. Not only that, it devalues the points for hunters that have been applying for 17 years now and faithfully acquiring points. If a 17 point holder gives his points to another 17 point holder...then the max point pool would be 34. Further, lets say I have 13 sheep points, my wife has 13 points....she could transfer me her 13 points and now I have 26 points and jump to the head of the line over those with 17 points. This legislation is such a joke its not even funny. The only people that would have anything to gain on a system like this are people that either dont have max points or have already shot a moose or sheep and want to AGAIN jump to the front of the line. I wonder if any of your family members have sheep and moose points they'd transfer to YOU? I wonder if this passes, as well as the Preference Point bill, if your family members will have preference points they'll pass on to YOU? I've a pretty good idea...

This all leads me to believe that you have no intentions of helping wildlife or Sportsmen in Wyoming. I intend to post this email on every hunting related website on the 'net as well as share with all my friends who hunt and fish in Wyoming.

Wyomings wildlife and Sportsmen dont need the Legisature/Legislators gerry-mandering for self-serving interests, they need proper Legislation to do whats best for all Sportsmen and all Wildlife.

These 3 bills are an absolute disgrace and I'll do everything I can to see that those who are only in the Senate/House to serve their personal agenda are promptly shown the unemployment line.

I really expected better from you and I'm well beyond disappointed with the legislation you're sponsoring and endorsing.

Best,

 

[Dinkshooter]

Um yeah I wouldn't expect a contribution request letter from him any time soon!

 

[BuzzH]

No sportsmen should contribute to the Larry Hicks hunting fund...I mean campaign. Shouldnt come as any shock he's also a member of Sportsmen for Wildlife...never would have guessed that.

Oh, and if anyone else wants to let Larry know how you feel about any of these bills...by all means:

[email protected]

[email protected]

Dont hold back like I did...let him know exactly how you feel.

 

[fowladdict]

Being one of those that accrue points every year in Wy, I find this disgusting. I don't think I would have a problem with being able to transfer my tag if I draw to one of my kids when they start hunting, but it would have to mean that I still lose all of my points AND they would have to forfeit any points they may have earned.

 

[Drake4]

Thanks for the info. Buzz. I'll be sure to voice my opinion. As someone who buys WY points...this would suck.

 

[sreekers]

I will be writing him later this afternoon. I will also look up my state legislators here in RS and let them know how I feel.

Thanks for the good information Buzz.

 

[ihuntelk]

Here's my letter. I let him have it for the PP bill moreso than the transfer of points. As it stands right now, when a Non-res moves to Wyo, their points can transfer. Don't know if it will be this way for elk/deer/pronghorn but if I didn't already live in Wyoming and had elk points...............................
I cc'd a pile of Wyo folks on my email and he's heard it from a handful of them tonight as well.


Larry,

First and foremost, let me say that you are an embarrassment to the real sportsmen of Wyoming and Carbon County. I am embarrassed to say that you represent MY county.


I have been following this whole preference point shenanigan (SF85) and you are clearly the master of misrepresenting Carbon County Sportsmen with your self-serving interests. I have been to most WGFD meetings. I have commented on most changes that the Dept. has proposed. I have heard about the survey from 2008 that you are always claiming proves Wyo wants PP's. I have never had the privilege of reading the results of that survey, even though I have asked. From the WGFD personnel I have visited with, yes some higher ups in Cheyenne, that study was a very dividing document. Over 50% of Wyo opposed PP's in ANY FORM. The state was also clearly drawn down the center with the Eastern half of Wyo wanting PP's and the Western half opposing. This make sense with the land ownership patterns of Wyo. There's a reason I don't live in Torrington or Cheyenne or......... I want to hunt out my back door on public land. Front door too!


I play the application game in most the Western States - got lucky and drew 2 great tags in Idaho last year. Wyoming is hands down the best western state for resident hunters. Our PP system for moose and sheep is severely flawed and takes away opportunity for all but the top tiers.


I have 4 kids between 13 and 6 years of age. My oldest killed her first turkey at 10. She killed an elk, deer and pronghorn when she was 12. My 2nd daughter (11 years-old) killed a turkey at 9 and informed me that she's going to kill a couple elk (bull and cow), deer (muley and whitie) and 2 pronghorn bucks this fall. I sat down last night with my 3rd daughter (9 years-old) and signed her up for the Mentor program and applied for turkeys on the Greybull to go hunt the old family farm. These are wonderful opportunities. By implementing a PP system, they will have no opportunity to hunt the great areas up the Greybull with their grandpa and uncles. They love to sit around and hear "Pa" tell stories about when he was my age and got to hunt that country every year. How dare you take that opportunity away from them. Don't give me any of the 25% random draw BS either. This is clearly about a bunch of whiners who fell that they are "entitled" to something.


As a citizen of Carbon county, I am appalled that you are willing to implement legislation without EVER consulting your constituents. I don't mean you and a couple other whiners drinking beer at Drifters either. Did you ever hold a public meeting in Encampment, Saratoga, Rawlins or Baggs to seek input or do you just know what's best for us all? In my mind, you are no better than the "Executive Order" issued by Mr. Obama - who clearly knows what is best for this country.


I just took a 'straw poll' of my office that is filled with some of the most dedicated and die-hard hunters and conservationists in Carbon County. It was a resounding "HELL NO!" that were in favor of a PP system. I didn't find 1 in over 20 asked that would even entertain a PP system. Clearly, the "Snake from the Snake" is looking out for himself. I can't believe I ever entertained the idea that you would do anything less.


I won't even start in on HB 124. This is WRONG on all accounts. If I am ready to die and still haven't drawn my Wyo sheep tag (which is a real possibility) I would be appalled that I could give my points to one of my kids so they can 'leap-frog' someone else in line. My kids are entitled to many things. Jumping over someone who has the same aspirations and desire that I do is not one of them. I would be embarrassed to take that opportunity away from someone else.


With your entitlement attitude I would highly recommend that you run as a Dem next go-round. This world doesn't owe you anything. Get over yourself.


Feel free to call anytime...........


R. Cade Powell
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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[Topgun 30-06]

Bravo!!!

 

[Zim]

When I started buying points in many states back in 1996, never did I consider the attrocious games the politicians would turn it all into. Truly pathetic rape of honest sportsmen willing to support their DNR, invest and wait their turn. But now it seems everybody wants sumthin fer nuthin. Reminds me of the lazy trailer trash ex.

Here's a thread I started on the runaway circus train created by the state of Maine, where the gross point abuse drove off 50% of resident moose applicants and 37% of nonresident. A stunning 23% in the last 2 years alone! These honest sportsmen just got sick and tired of their points being trashed by politicians wanting new blood money. What a pathetic joke, and they dam well know it. In the attached article, they even admit their rape, but still refuse to make it right. They just make an adjustment to restore a portion of the point devaluation.

http://forums.bowsite.com/tf/bgforums/thread.cfm?forum=15&threadid=415833&MESSAGES=19&FF=15

This is the reason I hope New Mexico & Idaho never go to a point system of any kind. It only creates an avenue for abuse.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

I really don't know that a PP system in NM would be any worse than the set up they have right now for NRs! It's either pay a high price for a landowner tag or an outfitted hunt or pretty well forget about that state now.

 

[wyoming556]

I really don't know that a PP system in NM would be any worse than the set up they have right now for NRs! It's either pay a high price for a landowner tag or an outfitted hunt or pretty well forget about that state now.

Yep,
Transferable landowner tags can be just as bad for regular non resident and non wealthy hunters.

 

[Zim]

I really don't know that a PP system in NM would be any worse than the set up they have right now for NRs! It's either pay a high price for a landowner tag or an outfitted hunt or pretty well forget about that state now.

It would definitely make it worse than it already is. Yet another method to screw average joe's in addition to the landowner & outfitter welfare.