Wilks brothers true colors are shining through.....

[double_a85]

Well said Randy.

I found this site because I drew a LE elk tag this year, but since on this site I have learned SOO much about issues that are very important to me... issues I would never hear about in any other venue.

This topic is a perfect example--- the BLM in their press release said nothing of the CAT tracks Wingman posted, but only about the airplanes landing off the road. Without Wingmans evidence, it would be much harder to make an educated decision on this topic.

 

[Jorgy]

Just to throw my .02 in, there is a lot of Montana "policy" talk on this site, but I would say that is more indicative of some really informed and active members who are working for improved access in Montana.
Living in Colorado, I thought I was pretty informed of my own state till I started hanging out here. I've picked up a few things from guys like Oak & Big Fin (and others) that have opened my eyes that I need to put more time and effort into DOW and BLM policies.

 

[Straight Arrow]

As a multi-generational Montanan and someone who has seen many other states and what has occurred elsewhere, I am likely one who would offend roadhunter with my excessive Montana pride.
But the reality is Montana has a lot of public land, wilderness, wilderness study areas, monuments, and other treasured protected landscape that warrants continuous protection and watchful scrutiny or it will evolve as have those beautiful places in other states and become overly crowded and developed at the expense of wildlife, wild places, and hunting opportunity.

'Don't know where roadhunter is from ... only that surely he "ain't from around here", but I do know that Montanans are not going to just stand aside and let ultra-wealthy jackwagons come in, buy up access to public land and dictate the demise of the great hunting and wildlife "back from the brink" legacy so precious to Montana. If the HT dialogue offends you as we attempt to disseminate valuable information for all concerned to use in protecting and continuing this legacy, then I suggest you find another venue to follow in furthering whatever may interest you.

 

[belly-deep]

If the HT dialogue offends you as we attempt to disseminate valuable information for all concerned to use in protecting and continuing this legacy, then I suggest you find another venue to follow in furthering whatever may interest you.

(Edited by Big Fin)

Not that there's anything wrong with that...

 

[cowboy]

I think Roadhunter must have run out of gas and is pulled over sitting in a ditch as he's not responding.

I will say that he chose a perfect user name to go along with his ideology.

 

[Lawnboy]

Mountains of elk teasing the border right now. Better get back out Wingman.

 

[wingman1]

I gave it up for the year fella. How did you do over yonder?

 

[katqanna]

Just heard that one of the Central Montana Hunters got flown in for a few day hunt and picked up this morning, so hopefully we will get some more photo documentation and a report of whats going on over there.

I am finishing up the BLM FOIA if anyone has any specific points they want asked, let me know. Dont worry about what you might think is obvious, I have been in major organizational mode over here, so "obvious" could have easily slipped my brain these last few days.

 

[Jelf]

I am finishing up the BLM FOIA if anyone has any specific points they want asked, let me know.

Ask that they not send the data in a shp (shape) file.

A KML, GPX or text file is much easier for us citizens to work with.

 

[bigskyblueman]

Destruction or removal of proscribed items , and creating a hazard/ nuisance for other users.

 

[roadhunter]

'Don't know where roadhunter is from ... only that surely he "ain't from around here", but I do know that Montanans are not going to just stand aside and let ultra-wealthy jackwagons come in, buy up access to public land and dictate the demise of the great hunting and wildlife "back from the brink" legacy so precious to Montana. If the HT dialogue offends you as we attempt to disseminate valuable information for all concerned to use in protecting and continuing this legacy, then I suggest you find another venue to follow in furthering whatever may interest you.

I hate to break it to you but the ultra wealthy jackwagons you speak of have already taken over your state. Look at the drastic changes that have taken place in the last 20 years and it becomes painfully obvious that Montana has been influenced by wealthy transplants from places like Cali and Texas.

If they buy the land they should be able to do what they want with it. That is my belief and I find it strange how you act like I am some outsider because I believe in private property rights. I know you want to believe that the Wilks are guilty of all sorts of crimes but be prepared as likely little to nothing will happen to them even if they did put up a fence partially on public land.

If you want to pretend I am the strange one because I believe in private property rights and because I think the government does a poor job of managing land feel free. The real extremist in this situation are the ones running around screaming about protecting a birthrights, explaining to out kids how we sold off all public land and now have a European hunting model, how the government is trying to sell off all public land if they can, and how if states get control of the land they will immediately sell if all off and never allow public recreation again, How giving cheap federal grazing leases helps improve GDP, etc, etc... It's nothing but a bunch of exaggerated claims not based on reality meant to grab you attention.

I can assure you that as far as these specific issues go that this is an entertaining site to read for reasonable people on the outside looking in.

Carry on with your witch hunt.

 

[huntin24/7]

I don't think this is so much about property rights anymore. I, and I think I speak for most people here, have great respect for landowners and property rights. It seems more or less that the Wilkes bros. are mad that their money didnt get them their way in regards to the land swap. Now they aren't content to just have all their great land and the majority of the elk on their property. They also feel like they have to screw with the public land sportsmen to prove some juvenile point. It kind of reminds me of grade school and the old "you did this to me so now you're not invited to my birthday party". And as has already been mentioned, the bull whacker area was already accessible. It just takes more work to get there now.

 

[smarandr]

The real extremist in this situation are the ones running around screaming about protecting a birthrights, explaining to out kids how we sold off all public land and now have a European hunting model, how the government is trying to sell off all public land if they can, and how if states get control of the land they will immediately sell if all off and never allow public recreation again, How giving cheap federal grazing leases helps improve GDP, etc, etc... It's nothing but a bunch of exaggerated claims not based on reality meant to grab you attention.

For the sake of clarity, let's suppose the above is true. Are you concerned about the erosion of public access or the privatization of a public resource? Does it bother you when someone is trying to take away something that belongs to you?

Perhaps you are one of the few that has unfettered access to a private reserve that holds world class game that you can shoot from the road. But for us commoners who rely upon "our birthright" of public lands to recreate and hunt on, situations like this are of great concern. Especially when the members of your beloved tea party tirelessly advocate that this land be sold to people like the Wilkes.

 

[katqanna]

Ask that they not send the data in a shp (shape) file.

A KML, GPX or text file is much easier for us citizens to work with.

Jelf, thanks for the heads up. Sad that you have to list all these specifications (cover your ass against loopholes) when making information requests that are our right to access.

My last few APHIS brucellosis FOIA's came as 4 - 800 page pdfs in pic formats, so that you cant do a word search. I have a program that can take pdfs and separate the pages or merge them, so while it takes me a wee bit more time, the documents can be separated back out to their smaller documents. The word search was a loss, but recently someone I have worked with a few times, when I mentioned APHIS' recent maneuver, told me of an OCR program that converts it back into searchable text format. So woohoo, I feel all kinds of empowered now.

 

[roadhunter]

For the sake of clarity, let's suppose the above is true. Are you concerned about the erosion of public access or the privatization of a public resource? Does it bother you when someone is trying to take away something that belongs to you?

Perhaps you are one of the few that has unfettered access to a private reserve that holds world class game that you can shoot from the road. But for us commoners who rely upon "our birthright" of public lands to recreate and hunt on, situations like this are of great concern. Especially when the members of your beloved tea party tirelessly advocate that this land be sold to people like the Wilkes.

Putting up a fence on private land does not do any of the stuff you are claiming. People put up fences on private land all the time. Has nothing to do with erosion of public access or privatization of a public resource. Has to do with a private landowner putting up fence and building roads. Amazing how you can spin something as simple as putting t-posts in the ground and stringing up wire into taking your birthright away. Everyone is out looking up fence regulations, measuring, counting wires, looking up gps coordinates, etc... desperately trying to find something illegal about the fence they are putting up.

What land I have access to hunt has nothing to do with the discussion and everything about changing the subject to personal trash talk. Seems to be a specialty around here. If someone disagrees with your opinion simply insult their intelligence because obviously anyone with a firing brain cell should believe exactly what the extremist on Hunt Talk tell you to believe. Very entertaining to those reasonable folks outside of Montana looking in and a very predictable response for people of this kind of paranoid mindset.

I am in no way a tea party fan as you claim. Yet another assumption on your part.

Sounds to me like you are another jihad members screaming about how the public resource is being privatized and public access in being eroded and your birthright is being taken away because a landowner put up a fence on his property. Many people have fences on private property. Get over it.

 

[Cornell2012]

I see two things happening in this thread:

1.) A bunch of name calling

2.) A group of individuals trying to figure out what, if anything, the community should do about the actions of the Wilks.

This forum is here to enable this second activity.

You are free to argue as much as you'd like, but try to keep the personal attacks and name-calling out of it. We all have our own opinions, and one of mine is that it benefits everyone to have a variety of views presented. Personally attacking others that have different experiences and ideas creates an unnecessarily hostile environment, and ultimately suppresses dissenting ideas, which harms the entire community.

We try to avoid hard moderation as much as possible, so I am making a request to tone down the arguments. Be enthusiastic, but be civil about it. There is a fellow human (beyond that, a fellow hunter/outdoor enthusiast) on the other end of the line. Thanks to those of you that have remained focused on the original thread topic.

 

[smarandr]

Putting up a fence on private land does not do any of the stuff you are claiming. People put up fences on private land all the time. Has nothing to do with erosion of public access or privatization of a public resource. Has to do with a private landowner putting up fence and building roads. Amazing how you can spin something as simple as putting t-posts in the ground and stringing up wire into taking your birthright away. Everyone is out looking up fence regulations, measuring, counting wires, looking up gps coordinates, etc... desperately trying to find something illegal about the fence they are putting up.

What land I have access to hunt has nothing to do with the discussion and everything about changing the subject to personal trash talk. Seems to be a specialty around here. If someone disagrees with your opinion simply insult their intelligence because obviously anyone with a firing brain cell should believe exactly what the extremist on Hunt Talk tell you to believe. Very entertaining to those reasonable folks outside of Montana looking in and a very predictable response for people of this kind of paranoid mindset.

I am in no way a tea party fan as you claim. Yet another assumption on your part.

Sounds to me like you are another jihad members screaming about how the public resource is being privatized and public access in being eroded and your birthright is being taken away because a landowner put up a fence on his property. Many people have fences on private property. Get over it.

Ok, ok. You assume, I assume; let's get to the bottom of things here:

Are you a supporter of public lands and being able to hunt, fish, camp, or otherwise recreate on them? Forget about the Wilkes and Montana, I mean this in the most general terms possible.

Do you believe the Federal Government should own vast amount of land out west? If not how should the Federal Government divest their interest?

The jihadist in me thinks that I know the answer to these questions, but I'd like to give you the opportunity to answer them for yourself.

 

[Nameless Range]

You seem to be clueless about the issue roadhunter.

Nothing about purposefully parking a trailer in the middle of a road to prevent the public from accessing public land?
Nothing about hovering helicopters over members of the public while they are hunting on public land?
Nothing about their attempts to trade private land for public in a way that would harm the public trust?
Nothing about their website, montanapublicaccess.com, which is incredibly misleading?

Being a good neighbor matters. It matters more when you shout from the rooftops(or the internet) that you are a good neighbor, want something from the locals, and happen to be filthy rich. Money = power, and you're delusional to think otherwise, so resistance to negative effects needs to be detailed - as it is on Hunt Talk.

You either have poor reading comprehension, or have something against DIY public land hunting and those who fight to defend it, or both. The former I've seen in action, the latter seems likely.

Then again you keep using the word jihad to describe the actions of HuntTalkers, so I wouldn't rule out the fact that you're just trolling for entertainment.

 

[Nemont]

personal trash talk.

Yet another assumption on your part.

another jihad members screaming


Get over it.

Pot meet kettle.

Please find anywhere that implies or states that the Wilk's don't have a right to build a fence and road on their land.

The question was A). does it encroach on public lands B.) is it a fence designed to kill wildlife, particularly elk. If the answer to the first question is settled, then the answer to the 2nd question seems less settled and therein lies the debate. Unless you support private property owners purposely killing wildlife out of spite because they didn't get their way? I am not assuming that you do but I am projecting that as the logical conclusion of your rants, using my firing brain cells

That has zero to do with Montana, the West or anything else you are assuming about everyone who questions the Wilks. I will state here that they bought their land legally, they are entitled to do with as they want and anybody who says different doesn't is misguided. However with ownership of property comes responsibility and one of those is to no put up wildlife barriers that kill wildlife just because you can.

If you don't like it then don't click the respond button or ignore it all together and go onto the hundreds of hunting forums that are out there.


Nemont

 

[katqanna]

Some additional pics. The fence, at least in some areas is 5'3". I would love to get in there with a tape measure and fully document what is going on. Because of the width of the pics, I am just going to list the others as links below this first pic. I didnt want to edit them too small and loose clarity. You can see that bottom wire is maybe a couple inches off the ground. There is no way calves can get through or over that. The fence is not complete yet.

Wilks fence 2

Wilks fence 3

Wilks fence 4