Straight Arrow
Well-known member
.... and your point regarding crossbows during the Montana Archery Season is what?
What about crossbows in Montana's archery season?
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The only reason someone should be able to use a crossbow during archery season is if they have some sort of disability that doesn't allow the to draw and hold a bowstring. Once a crossbow is cocked you can sit there and hold it forever, no movement from drawing back the bow when the animal is in range. Crossbows are just a short range rifle legal for use during archery season, just aim and shoot. Seems like an unfair advantage.
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
No. I think the crossbow during the archery season for disabled hunters was proposed during the 2011 Montana legislative session. The bill was defeated; died in House FWP committee, if correctly remembered. Ironically, the brand-new Montana hunter who wanted to use his crossbow in Montana for archery hunting was a fellow by the name of Jennings. When the bill failed, Montana Bowhunter Assn offered to assist him in getting set up with legal archery equipment modified to allow him success, even with the limitations of his disability. I do not know what resulted from that offer from MBA, who incidentally had provided similar assistance to disabled archery hunters in the past.
I guess my point is ,crossbows during archery season would be fine.It is legal here in Michigan and has not seen anything negative .
I think eventually crossbows will be legal in all states during archery season.it's coming.If nothing more than an effort to sell more tags.
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Straight Arrow
Well-known member
In your Opinion.
In my opinion .... NO. As a lifelong hunter and voter in Montana, I will continue to express my opinion in Montana concerning Montana hunting regulations. I will not express my opinion regarding Michigan laws and regulations, nor will I meddle in Michigan political affairs.
So if you hunted Michigan each year you wouldn't want a say in anything??I was totally against it in Pa but it really hasn't changed much except more participation.I don't understand not allowing disabled people not the choice.I hope one day you don't completely blow one of your arms/shoulder out where at that point you'd have to give up archery season.Right now, I can't hold my bow up yet alone keeping it steady for an ethical shot.I agree they are an easy way of archery hunting,and don't require near the amount of practice and dedication.But in my mind they do have a place for a disabled hunter
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
Even if I did it would not be my right, let alone my place to do so. The wildlife management and hunting in Michigan is entrusted to the appropriate state agency on behalf of the people of the State of Michigan.
If I hunt in Michigan, I follow the rules of the people of Michigan, If you hunt in Montana, you follow the rules of Montanans. I didn't make that up ... it's just the way it is. The issue expressed in this thread is a state issue having to do with the upcoming Montana legislative session. You may opine about it, but don't expect the same respect given to Montana folks registered to vote here.
With respect to your physical limitations, I do appreciate the concern and thus again point out the privilege in Montana to modify archery equipment for just such situations.
As an avid longtime elk hunter (with bow, rifle, camera, binoculars) and being now seventy, I put in many miles and hours, sweating and hurting somewhat to keep myself in shape to climb the slopes and put in the miles it takes to hunt. Someday I won't be able to do what I have done for years, but I certainly don't expect laws and regulations to change just to make it easier for me.
npaden
Well-known member
It is this great attitude that has nonresident hunters getting screwed in state after state across the west. The only thing that keeps any tags going to nonresidents is the fact that they have historically funded a very lopsided % of the wildlife budgets.
Residents want the $ to fund their game and fish departments but nothing else.
shoots-straight
Well-known member
Maybe if you want to discuss how NR hunters are screwed out west you should start a new thread. Keep on topic here.
Thanks!
Topgun 30-06
Active member
+1 npaden We are our own worst enemy! I also didn't realize that SS is now a MOD!!!
npaden
Well-known member
You just told the guys that are trying to discuss the topic that their opinion didn't matter because they didn't live in Montana. Why waste my time?
shoots-straight
Well-known member
Have you been drinking? I never said anything to you until this last post.
Top gun, I'm the OP and as such have certain rights to keep you on Topic so my thread doesn't get hijacked. Some forums give the OP the right for deleting any posts on their threads.
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Topgun 30-06
Active member
If that is the case, I would strongly suggest you start at page 1 and tell that to every member that posted comments that also don't appear to have anything to do with YOUR thread, like suppressors, tiger licenses, etc.
npaden
Well-known member
I'm afraid you might be the one who has been drinking. I never mentioned you had said anything to me previously. I just pointed out that you flat out told nonresidents that you didn't respect anything they had to say on the matter. I'm a nonresident so I why would I waste my time telling you my opinion on the topic? You obviously don't want to hear it and you surely don't want me to contact any Montana state legislators about it.
You've clearly stated that this is YOUR thread on a topic in YOUR state. Who cares if some of the guys posting actually hunt in that state and pay 4,000% more for their licenses than you do.
You've clearly stated that this is YOUR thread on a topic in YOUR state. Who cares if some of the guys posting actually hunt in that state and pay 4,000% more for their licenses than you do.
Dang, guys. Let's not get into the April cabin-fever-bite-heads-off mode this early in the winter. We can have these type of discussions in a civil way. If not, I can just toss the threads.
The opinions of anyone on this site are valid. If you don't want opinions, don't start threads, don't post threads, and/or don't read the threads. When you participate here, you imply you are providing or seeking opinions.
Non-resident opinions may, or may not, influence legislators of the state in question. But, we are not legislators, so tone it down on these threads.
And, I'm not convinced non-resident opinions are not listened to by legislators in many states that have a huge financial benefit from NRs hunting in their state. Part of the territory when large fee differentials exist; my home state being as far of a differential as anywhere in the west. The legislators will listen to the guys paying most the freight, whether they vote or not, whether residents like it or not. I often hear that comment from legislators, so I don't doubt they listen to NRs and realize what NRs are paying.
Anyhow, 'tis the season, and I'm not going to let it get out of hand here. Peace.
The opinions of anyone on this site are valid. If you don't want opinions, don't start threads, don't post threads, and/or don't read the threads. When you participate here, you imply you are providing or seeking opinions.
Non-resident opinions may, or may not, influence legislators of the state in question. But, we are not legislators, so tone it down on these threads.
And, I'm not convinced non-resident opinions are not listened to by legislators in many states that have a huge financial benefit from NRs hunting in their state. Part of the territory when large fee differentials exist; my home state being as far of a differential as anywhere in the west. The legislators will listen to the guys paying most the freight, whether they vote or not, whether residents like it or not. I often hear that comment from legislators, so I don't doubt they listen to NRs and realize what NRs are paying.
Anyhow, 'tis the season, and I'm not going to let it get out of hand here. Peace.
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
Good constructive perspective and valid reasons to change hunting regulations for Montana or any other state have always been welcome on this forum. However, the same old arguments regarding crossbows during the archery season are not constructive in my opinion. And they consistently are centered around the "me, me ,me" ... let's change hunting to make it easier for me, me, me! Recommendations to improve hunting ethics, wildlife management, hunting access, and other such real problems are certainly valid ... the crossbow during archer only season doesn't fit that category.
You may have picked up on my excessive Montana-boy pride, but also realize the perspective here is partly the result of NRs who come to Montana and profess to love the place and the hunting opportunity, but then abruptly turn around and strongly bloviate on about how Montana should change to be just like the place they're from and leave to hunt Montana.
You may have picked up on my excessive Montana-boy pride, but also realize the perspective here is partly the result of NRs who come to Montana and profess to love the place and the hunting opportunity, but then abruptly turn around and strongly bloviate on about how Montana should change to be just like the place they're from and leave to hunt Montana.
Topgun 30-06
Active member
And Sir, It is my opinion, as well as others on this thread, that we completely disagree with your opinion and attitude!!! As BigFin has just mentioned to you, that is our right, and I hope it will continue to be when it's kept in a civil manner the way it was before we were told to butt out!
I get all of that. Personally, I agree with the idea that state issues should be decided by those in the state. Yet, that doesn't make opinions of others any less valid, no matter where they live Even though I hunt over a dozen other states, I am pretty much of the opinion that they should do want with their state hunting regulations. That is their business. If I find it so offensive, I can spend my tag money elsewhere.
And yes, I agree that the topic of crossbows allowed/not allowed in archery season always seem to go down that same path. As it does with lighted nocks and a variety of other topics. But, that is part of the expected outcome when threads get posted about the topics.
And yes, I agree that Montanans are viewed as being as passionate and involved as we are quirky in some of our regulations. If no legislation ever changed in Montana, it would/will still be a damn good place and I suspect most non-resident would still hunt here. Given how good the opportunities currently are in MT, compared to the many other states I hunt, I advocate that legislators need to quit promoting solutions in need of a problem. We have it damn good. Legislative tinkering hardly ever does anything positive and almost always results in further division of hunters, part of what some use to their advantage.
The reason I have written here and elsewhere about the huge disparity of resident v. non-resident fees is based partly on fairness, but also due to growing weary of legislators laughing me out the door when I try to present an issue from the standpoint of a Montanan. Some use the huge res-NR disparity as their safety net as to why they should not listen to residents or why they should listen to non-residents. Our huge disparity causes us to lose credibility, whether right or wrong, among some of the legislators, even though those same legislators will vote down any/every resident fee increase proposal.
My point of the prior post is to make sure we have these discussions in a more civil manner. I'm tired of the tone that rises on all hunting forums during the winter. Maybe it is endemic to the nature of hunters in the off season. We have a lot bigger issues in front of us than some of these we squabble over.
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
Duly noted Topgun.
Your constructive opinions and valid reasons for enhancing Montana's hunting legacy through allowing crossbows to be used during the archery only season are anxiously awaited and will be welcome.
Your constructive opinions and valid reasons for enhancing Montana's hunting legacy through allowing crossbows to be used during the archery only season are anxiously awaited and will be welcome.
Topgun 30-06
Active member
Thank you, even though your tone was obviously meant to be abrasive! As other NRs are just trying to point out through actual observance of the use of crossbows that were sort of forced on us in our various states, there have been no real problems observed with their use. Yes, they are much easier to use effectively with very little practice compared to a compound or recurve from what I've heard, but they don't appear to be causing any overkill of the resource in any state that is allowing their use during the regular bow season. Many of the Midwest and Eastern states residents had this same negative reaction to their use when this has come up, but their fears and worries have really been disproved after they were allowed and now you never even hear about them because of that. I, myself, don't plan on using one in the near future, but as much as I love the outdoors I may some day when I can't use a regular bow because of age and/or and injury.
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