Rule may ban off-trail ATV riding

[Ten Bears]

Hey IT, how come you didn't post this one too?
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Roger Phillips
The Idaho Statesman

Officials are proposing to end off-road and off-trail travel for ATVs, motorcycles and four-wheel-drives on 524,000 acres of land in the Boise National Forest in an effort to stop new “user-created” trails from being formed. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> ATVs also spread noxious weeds when seeds get stuck to their tires. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know of any seeds that are capable of getting stuck in an ATV's tires.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Most ATV riders wouldn´t be affected by the proposed rule because they are “very trail oriented,” said Mountain Home District Ranger Larry Tripp.

“I would attribute 90 percent of this issue to occurrences during big game seasons,” he said.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Traveling off designated routes already is illegal in most of the forest, Tripp said. The new rule would end it in the remaining areas where the Forest Service discourages, but still allows it.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Can you say no enfarcement is the problem????? <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Tripp said that the proliferation of ATVs was a big factor in the proposal. Idaho had 68,500 registered ATVs and motorcycles in 2002, double the number five years prior and a 10-fold increase since 1987. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> What's 10% of that? <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> The Forest Service would continue to allow travel on “clearly established, user-created routes,” even if they are not part of the designated trail system, Tripp said. The Forest Service intends to look at some of those routes for possible closure in the future, he said.

The Pocatello-based recreation access advocacy group Blue Ribbon Coalition supports the proposal, executive director Bill Dart said.

“What we´ve seen in the last decade is a whole new wave of cross-country travel, especially during hunting season, and we´re not supportive of that,” Dart said.

The coalition encourages travel only on designated trails, except in special cases, such as sand dunes.

Caldwell hunter Richard Renstrom, who uses a motorcycle to get to his hunting areas, said he always stays on trails and thinks others should, too.

“I think every responsible motorcycle or ATV user in the mountains is upset by what these bad ATV users are doing,” he said.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
BRC at work

http://www.idahostatesman.com/Features/IdahoOutdoors/story.asp?ID=59593

 

[Oak]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Traveling off designated routes already is illegal in most of the forest, Tripp said. The new rule would end it in the remaining areas where the Forest Service discourages, but still allows it.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I don't see where "enfarcement" is the problem here. Enfarce what? It's legal now (amazingly), and they're going to make it illegal.

Oak

 

[Ten Bears]

Because if they'd "enfarce" it, it wouldn't have gotten to be such a problem.

If they make it illegal, they need to enfarce it, or they're just wasting time.

 

[RockyDog]

I dont care what it takes! Just get the bastard machines off some of the trails. Anywhere they go is soon lined with 4' tall knapweed and any bulls or bucks older than 3 or 4 years are weeded are gone.

 

[Oak]

If it's not illegal, there's nothing to enforce! You're not making a whole lot of sense, TB.

Oak

 

[1_pointer]

Motor vehichles are one of the most proficient means of spreading noxious weeds. The seed heads do get caught up in the machines or the mud. Look at most any distribution map of a noxious weeds and you'll see that they almost always follow roads/trails.

All cross-country travel is now illegal of USFS land in UT!

Why is it a big deal whether or not it is illegal or enforced if the education program by BRC is working??

Once illegal I hope to hell they enforce it like mad!

10% = 6850

 

[RockyDog]

" I don't know of any seeds that are capable of getting stuck in an ATV's tires. "


Thanks for that one. Im putting that on my list of stoopidest things ive ever heard said.

 

[Hangar18]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> The Pocatello-based recreation access advocacy group Blue Ribbon Coalition supports the proposal, executive director Bill Dart said.

“What we´ve seen in the last decade is a whole new wave of cross-country travel, especially during hunting season, and we´re not supportive of that,” Dart said.

The coalition encourages travel only on designated trails, except in special cases, such as sand dunes. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where are all the fat-ass comments?

I guess the next thing to do is declare the BRC anti-hunting.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Hanger, You're right. I think we've seen anti-- hunting comments from the BRC before. They always blame it on the hunters!

I hope no hunters are dumb enough to support the BRC!

Ten, Just when I'm starting to think you can't say anything dumber!

" I don't know of any seeds that are capable of getting stuck in an ATV's tires. "

Try not to let your mind wander...

It is too small and fragile to be out by itself.

 

[Troy Jones]

I don't own or use an ATV, and I'm not real wild about them either. Just wanted to state that invasive plants are not just carried by vehicles, they are also spread extensively by wildlife and water also. So what we need to do next is to take out the wildlife and dam all the creeks, streams and rivers.

 

[Ithaca 37]

And what about all those darn birds carrying seeds around??

Well, we can't outlaw birds and we can't outlaw wildlife. We can't outlaw flowing water. Let's outlaw ATVs. That seems to be the one problem we can do something about!

 

[RockyDog]

Troy, that may be true to a small extent. But ive yet to see a game trail lined with 4' old-growth knapweed the way our FatBoy trails are over here in western montana.

 

[Troy Jones]

It's a serious problem that is just being realized to the extent of the severity. Camping gear, boot laces, dogs, tainted crop and home use seeds, are other methods. Heck, some nurseries sell listed plants as ornamentals, such as some thistles and salt cedar (tamarac). Spotted knapweed, leafy spurge and salt cedar are our local serious concerns.

 

[Ten Bears]

OAK, I think you missed this part: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Traveling off designated routes already is illegal in most of the forest, Tripp said. The new rule would end it in the remaining areas where the Forest Service discourages, but still allows it.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
It's put up time:
Which noxious weeds have seeds capable of getting stuck in ATV tires??? Put up the list or shut up. Most ATV's have large lug, chevroned, or knobby tires designed to be mud free. I can see seeds and seed heads stuck in the undercariage, but not the tires. So, for those who would step forward, and make statements (RD, IT)......

put up the list. Remember, the quote from the article was: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> ATVs also spread noxious weeds when seeds get stuck to their tires. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are any of the weeds capable of passing through the digestive tract of a horse, or being spread by backpackers???

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-29-2004 09:32: Message edited by: Ten Bears ]</font>

 

[RockyDog]

TB, holy cow you are thick.

"ATVs also spread noxious weeds when seeds get stuck to their tires."

Are you gonna argue that ATVs dont spread weeds? Then you better have every forest service EIS and Resource Management Plan written in the last 10 years revised based on your new and intelligent beliefs.

do you know what "TO" means? I suppose you coat your tires with Pam and they never carry weeds. Anyways, a 4 µgm cheatgrass seedhead will stick into a rubber tire if constructed of vulcanized rubber from guatemela and carry it a distance of up to 5 miles if speeds are not in excess of 20 mph. This of course assumes that wheels are of standard size and humidity is less than 10% and the tires are not coated with Pam or other non-stick surfacing. The seed may also just possibly stick in all the mud and gunk on your tire and undercarriage and spread it over the 20 or 30 miles you can cover in a day on a fatboy machine. Im sure in your mind thats equivalent to how much is on a hiker's boot or whats stuck to a hummingbirds wings, or a horse fed on weed-free certified hay. Keep grasping, its fun to watch!

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-29-2004 11:15: Message edited by: RockyDog ]</font>

 

[Ten Bears]

Gotta source?
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>... a 4 µgm cheatgrass seedhead will stick into a rubber tire if constructed of vulcanized rubber from guatemela and carry it a distance of up to 5 miles if speeds are not in excess of 20 mph. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm not debating the seeds that get caught up on the undercariage. I just question the statement: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> ATVs also spread noxious weeds when seeds get stuck to their tires. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

[RockyDog]

Chemical Rubber Company Handbook, 1973. (CRC 1973)

Let me drive this home, go back and read the article you posted and you will see that it says the seeds stick "TO" the tires not "INTO" them.

Regardless, ive seen cheatgrass seeds stuck IN a rubber tire, but never anything else.

 

[Troy Jones]

puncture vine and sand burr seed will stick into tires.

 

[Oak]

TB, I guess you're thicker than I gave you credit for. Go back and look at all the quotes you posted. Which one of them, above your "enforcement is the problem" remark, says that there's a problem on lands where it's already illegal?? That's right, none of them. All they're talking about is the places where it's currently LEGAL to ride off trail. If it's LEGAL, there's nothing to enforce...so they are making it ILLEGAL so that they can start ENFORCING it.

Oak

 

[Ten Bears]

OAK, How would you suppose riding was discouraged????