Removing Doug Sayer from Wild Sheep Foundation for Idaho political strong-arming

tjones said:
.

If Sayer stays on with the WSF will you continue to support them?
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The Idaho Wildlife Federation is the group who is making these claims against Sayer. If they are anything like the National Wildlife Federation, they are partisan indeed. So politics may be playing some hand in this "scandal". After reading the O P's link to the IWF story, it seems a little overblown IMO.
 
The Post Register in Idaho Falls ran a story on the issue, and I think a key point is being missed here...the emails in which Sayer is pushing for a change in the commission came after a public opinion survey where 80% of hunters who commented did not want to issue more auction tags, so IDFG stopped pursuing the issue. I think this article sheds a little more light on the stink behind what is going on...may be politcally biased, but definitely gives more information and context about the issue. http://www.postregister.com/article...0/18/emails-game-management-muddied-politics#
 
BigHornRam said:
The Idaho Wildlife Federation is the group who is making these claims against Sayer. If they are anything like the National Wildlife Federation, they are partisan indeed. So politics may be playing some hand in this "scandal". After reading the O P's link to the IWF story, it seems a little overblown IMO.
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Great, but that doesn't answer my question.
 
BigHornRam said:
Dude, You really don't have clue about what your talking about.
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Show me the money trail. I'd love to see the size of the clue you have.

$3M of the $4.3m of the funds they claim to have raised is from auction tag sales made by affiliate groups, but they claim it none the less. Not saying they kept it, but their claiming it. So yeah 75% of the money they raise is from auction. Considering they get admin fees, and can keep anywhere from 5-30% of those sales, I would say its their cash cow, no?
 
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BuzzH said:
Depends on the tag, and depends on the State where they tags come from.

In Wyoming, its 10% to the seller for Gov. tags (except bison which are 30% to seller). In the case of commissioners tags (deer, elk, or antelope), 100% goes to the group that sells the tag.
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Correct. I was making assumptions based on Idaho's percentage pay out.

The total amount received is a percentage of the 3 million in auction tag sales.
 
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BigHornRam said:
The Idaho Wildlife Federation is the group who is making these claims against Sayer. If they are anything like the National Wildlife Federation, they are partisan indeed. So politics may be playing some hand in this "scandal". After reading the O P's link to the IWF story, it seems a little overblown IMO.
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How is it overblown?
 
So I just received an email response from Gray Thorton, CEO of the Wild Sheep Foundation. His response is attached below. Basically, WSF is going to do nothing. They say that Doug Sayer was simply engaging in the democratic process by contacting an elected official. Before reading on, I want to make it crystal clear that I am not attacking Mr. Thorton personally. I heard him on Randy's podcast and was very impressed and that fact that he has Randy's endorsement goes a long way in my book. However, I think he and the rest of the WSF acted spinelessly by not publicly disapproving of this behavior. WSF is simply hiding behind "an individual's right to engage in the Democratic process". Of course someone can contact their governor or any other elected official.

It all boils down to this in my opinion. WSF, Mr. Sayer and Mr. Thorton all know that states, such as Idaho, established Fish & Game commissions to avoid this exact type of situation of having a powerful person sculpt the wildlife policies of a state. Mr. Sayer attempted to circumvent/change the Fish & Game commission for personal benefit, that is plainly obvious. By not admitting that, WSF and anybody supporting Sayer and his actions are showing great disrespect to the sportsmen's community as a whole. We are intelligent enough to realize when we are getting screwed.

Here are the flaws in the WSF logic that Sayer was simply acting as normal citizen engaging in the democratic process.
1. Fish and Game commissions were basically established so that wildlife management would NOT be influenced by individuals and politics. The purpose of a commission is to have a balanced and well informed group decide on issues regarding wildlife. Mr. Sayer and Mr. Thorton obviously both know this. Because Mr. Sayer knew that the commission did not agree with this ideas, he simply tried to circumvent the normal democratic process for wildlife management by asking the Governor for a favor.
2. In 2010, Mr. Sayer was part of hiring a lobbyist to pass legislation that increases the Idaho legislature authority over auction tags. Once again, an obvious act of circumventing the normal democratic process of wildlife management.
3. The WSF stance makes it sound like Mr. Sayer simply wrote the governor a letter stating he was unhappy about a situation. The reality is that Sayer is a big donor and he made specific requests, asking the Governor to remove 4 people from their jobs. (granted 2 of these jobs are voluntary, unpaid positions). Sayer went on to say he could recommend 2 specific replacements for the commissioner positions. How many "regular Joes" would have the audacity to think the Governor would read their letter and follow through on removing 2 commissioners without getting public input? Sayer knows he is a "whale" and can sway the Governor.


WSF Response.JPG
 
I still think this is a case of "Them's with the gold makes the rules". Mr Sayer should resign his officer position with the WSF, so there will be NO misunderstandings as to who represents what. GJ
 
BigHornRam said:
I agree with Gray. Sayer voiced his personal opinions. Just like you all do here all the time. Get over it.
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Everyone has the right to voice their personal opinion, and everyone can get fired for doing so as well. I'm not required to retain an employee that conducts themselves in a manner that reflects poorly on my business. The membership of WSF are the ones that Sayer works for. Pretty arrogant for you to tell the membership to "get over it."
 
I can hear, in my mind, Dr. "Red" Duke saying" If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, and swims like a duck. It's a duck. I miss "Red". He was a past FNAWS president and regular B&C president. G J
 
Oak said:
Everyone has the right to voice their personal opinion, and everyone can get fired for doing so as well. I'm not required to retain an employee that conducts themselves in a manner that reflects poorly on my business. The membership of WSF are the ones that Sayer works for. Pretty arrogant for you to tell the membership to "get over it."
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"Get over it" was directed towards Tony, Terry. He's not a member. Neither is Bambi. Maybe you can point out to him where his facts are skewed and his bias is showing.

Do you think this issue merits quitting WSF over? I sure don't. And IMO the overwhelming majority of the membership will see this the same way Gray does. If you see it differently, that's fine too. At least you participate in Wild Sheep conservation.
 
I've been president of several not for profit boards. Perception always beats reality, hands down. Mr Sayer is the point man for our brand(WSF). If the perception is that of a mayor Daley, using his position to frustrate real conservationists for his own ends, it reflects on the whole organization and our affiliates. He should resign his officer position, now. He can run again for the board and if he can make his case to the membership be reelected. GJ
 
huntid73 said:
The sad part is, I really enjoyed listening to Gary Thornton on Randy's podcast, and this issue came out a little over a week ago, I'm hoping that it doesn't mar how people will look at organizations like the Wild Sheep Foundation or the Mule Deer Foundation etc...
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The Mule Deer Foundation? They are thick as thieves with Don Peay and SFW. Any good they do is marred by that in my opinion.
 
BigHornRam said:
Dude, You really don't have clue about what your talking about.
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Neither do you with the Sayer situation, yet here you are defending him. The sportsmen and women of idaho spoke very clearly on what they wanted, and circumvented it to get commission members appointed that would fall in line with his, and SFW's, desires. Yes, he is a WSF chair, but to think he isn't in lock step with the idiots on their southern border would be very naive.
 
BigHornRam said:
I agree with Gray. Sayer voiced his personal opinions. Just like you all do here all the time. Get over it.
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Seriously? Good grief, are you on WSF payroll? I've lost all respect for WSF and how they run things if they don't distance themselves from this douche. You hold enough sway to get in the ear of the governor? I bet you don't. You have names in mind he would approve if you mentioned them to him? Again, I bet not, but, here you are, champion of the elite, deep pocket "conservationists" . Take your own advice, get over it.
 
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