Private beef out of our public land.

[Elkmagnet]

Also I hope I'm not coming off in a obtuse manner I am just trying to convey my thoughts with very limited writing skills:W:

 

[Handlebar]

Invasive weeds generally come out of the range budget. Although there is a funding source that comes from timber sales but must only be used in the timber sale area.
There are many activities that is paid for profit on public lands, timber, minerals, outfitter and guiding etc. virtually al of these are limited participation, and yes you have to be born into it or make millions of dollars to get into , however there iis less than 2% of the population in agriculture to begin with.

I am fine with bison in fact I have an allotment on my district that is bison, but if you think that I fyou replace cows with bison and you won't have overgrazing or degraded water/riparian areas , I'm sorry but you are deluding yourself.

 

[MNElkNut]

Handlebar, do you have a reference for the $350 million deficit? I am really curious as I have always heard there are studies that show economic gain from public land rather than a deficit. I don't have them at my fingertips or I would post them.

 

[Elkmagnet]

.
There are many activities that is paid for profit on public lands, timber, minerals, outfitter and guiding etc. virtually al of these are limited participation, and yes you have to be born into it or make millions of dollars to get into , however there iis less than 2% of the population in agriculture to begin with.

That's why im saying there is no reason for any industry to operate at a cost to the taxpayer while they are profiting.
I feel the same about shed's (which I pick up more than my fair share of) and personally think should be illegal to sale.
Also morel's? I hear there is a market?
The bison should be reintroduced no matter the impact it's one of the greatest crimes against nature that we have been responsible for. The kicker is that we are still in a position to minimize the damages but a hand full of citizens have the power to stop it.
Of course my personal idea of how things should be is a utopian dream stated just for discussion and not my expected reality.

 

[Handlebar]

I don't have that reference handy, so I am on shakey ground there, if I remember correctly it was study done by a University of Virginia professor. I will look to see if I can find. I am certain that you are right that there is economic gain to the economy as a whole from outdoor recreation, however there is a cost to the agencies to run those programs. the same argument could be made about grazing programs or any.
For example where I work, 65 permittees run cattle on summer grass, what would be the impact if those were eliminated. Not just to the individuals but to the supporting cast not just local but within 200 miles of us. Again I am not disputing the price of the AUM fee itself. Granted this does not rise to national in scope but rather local.

elkmagnet, your point about no industry operating at a cost to the taxpayer while they are profiting is a valid one. We could look beyond natural resources and see that government has privileged many industries not just ag.

As far as reintroduction of bison.. that idea was put out there many years ago with a book called the Buffalo Commons by a husband and wife by the name Popper (?) The idea has appeal to many but in a country of 325 million I just don't see how you would do it with out forced resettlement of populations in the prairie states. Ironic that we would do that all over again. Although there are bison in Yellowstone and other areas it really is a prairie animal not a mountain one.
On a side note while I agree with you that the destruction of the vast buffalo herds was a crime. I would argue that the decimation of the millions of beaver had as much if not more impact to western landscapes than any other single thing.

 

[Carnage2011]

Invasive weeds generally come out of the range budget. Although there is a funding source that comes from timber sales but must only be used in the timber sale area.
There are many activities that is paid for profit on public lands, timber, minerals, outfitter and guiding etc. virtually al of these are limited participation, and yes you have to be born into it or make millions of dollars to get into , however there iis less than 2% of the population in agriculture to begin with.

I am fine with bison in fact I have an allotment on my district that is bison, but if you think that I fyou replace cows with bison and you won't have overgrazing or degraded water/riparian areas , I'm sorry but you are deluding yourself.

I agree 100% on the bison comment regarding overgrazing/degraded water. I hunt an area that has a bison allotment and it's an absolute disaster. I used to see many elk in there, and it was consistently a great bow hunting spot. 3 years ago the bison ranch got a new manager and he started to use the allotment....it's gone downhill and the overgrazing is absolutely awful. I've been in support of rotational grazing and responsible grazing, but that Bison allotment is the worst chunk of the mountain range.

 

[BigHornRam]

Bad news for the O P. The president is "all cattle, and no hat" according to Chuck.

https://youtu.be/FNaoQldeuJA.

Chuck, you're a meatstick!

 

[buckbull]

Also morel's? I hear there is a market?

A big market around here. Usually sell between $25 - $50 a pound.

 

[CampRipleyLF]

All in moderation, remember that public lands are managed for all and multiple uses.... Some time cattle are used to reach management goals. I've been hunting in a National Wilderness Area in Colorado once an there was cattle in a portion of the wilderness.... That was a little annoying to me but that's it