My circle of friends is the wrong crowd to ask. If I can think of one that would be offended, I'll show it to them and get their reaction. So if we should be concerned about this derby and oppose it as hunters, where should we stop? Trophy hunting is a contest. mtmuley
Predator Contest?
- Thread starter shoots-straight
- Start date
noharleyyet
Well-known member
Heaven forbid one of those 'well spoken' kooks stumble across Boone & Crockett's Trophy Watch.
RobertR
Member
Don't shrug this off and make a joke of this because these poaple are out to stop legal hunting in some shape or form. This is becoming serious on what you say and the pictures you post (including me)
http://www.localnews8.com/news/salm...ntest/-/308662/23616330/-/lin9re/-/index.html
http://www.thewildlifenews.com/2013...f-and-coyote-killing-contest-on-public-lands/
http://missoulian.com/news/local/ju...cle_e9ff2070-6e69-11e3-9a05-0019bb2963f4.html
http://www.localnews8.com/news/salm...ntest/-/308662/23616330/-/lin9re/-/index.html
http://www.thewildlifenews.com/2013...f-and-coyote-killing-contest-on-public-lands/
http://missoulian.com/news/local/ju...cle_e9ff2070-6e69-11e3-9a05-0019bb2963f4.html
jryoung
Well-known member
Shoots is speaking the gospel here. 12% of Americans hunt, somewhere around the same percentage point are opposed to hunting. It's that massive swath in the middle that needs to see us uphold the values that we preach. For if they turn against us the antis win.
This contest has nothing to do with management. Wildlife Services is plenty happy to.come in and handle that...or ID fish and game already has with the trapper they hired...but that isn't about managing wolves so much as it is managing the vocal locals.
We reap what we sow.
This contest has nothing to do with management. Wildlife Services is plenty happy to.come in and handle that...or ID fish and game already has with the trapper they hired...but that isn't about managing wolves so much as it is managing the vocal locals.
We reap what we sow.
shoots-straight
Well-known member
Some get it, some don't. 
muley chaser
New member
I don't see the big deal with this. I have friends that live up in Council ID, Which is 60 miles from Riggins. There elk herds around council are taking a beating and ranchers are losing thousands of dollars a year because of the wolves. They defiantly need to be thinned out some.
shoots-straight
Well-known member
cantgetdrawn
New member
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2013
- Messages
- 76
Looks like it will take place as scheduled. Good luck to all the participants.
http://missoulian.com/news/local/ju...cle_4b53d502-6f21-11e3-ae62-001a4bcf887a.html
http://missoulian.com/news/local/ju...cle_4b53d502-6f21-11e3-ae62-001a4bcf887a.html
jryoung
Well-known member
Nice editorial post from the Idaho Conservation League...the appear to be speaking from the radical middle...a virtual desert in modern political issues.
News stories are ricocheting across the country about Salmon's "Wolf Derby," which, beginning this weekend, offers cash prizes for the biggest killed wolf. Many have scratched their heads at this unintended marketing of Idaho to the rest of the nation.
What has even more folks scratching their heads is the Idaho Department of Fish and Game's hiring of a professional trapper to eradicate two wolf packs deep in the Frank Church-River of No Return Wilderness and the Forest Service's permission to host the trapper in a U.S. Forest Service cabin.
Proponents of the Wolf Derby in Salmon aren't shy about the purpose of their event. Fish and Game and the Forest Service seem to be trying to slip their event under the radar.
Wolf issues in Idaho can be pretty emotional. Many of us who care deeply about Idaho's outdoors are reluctant to wade into such a polarized topic. Scientists talk about carrying capacity for wildlife. There is also a social carrying capacity for critters like wolves, finding a level of protection that Idaho citizens will support. The Idaho Conservation League supports state management of wolves because we believe that finding the social balance requires state leadership. ICL supports a hunting season for wolves, but ICL also supports the role wolves play in the backcountry. Wolves are part of Idaho's outdoors.
It is one thing to have sportsmen control numbers of this big game species. It is another to hire an exterminator to eradicate entire packs deep in the largest protected wilderness in the lower 48 states. If wolves can't live in relative peace in one of the nation's premier wilderness landscapes, where can they? What kind of precedent does this set for more accessible areas?
Fish and Game recently hosted a wildlife summit in which the key message was that Idaho's wildlife belongs to all of us. A summit conclusion was that both sportsmen and wildlife enthusiasts have an important voice and that together we should support wildlife management efforts. This action deep in the wilderness suggests certain interests have a lot more power than others.
The Forest Service and Fish and Game regularly use each other's facilities, but the Forest Service Manual directs the agency to consider how this use will impact wilderness characteristics: "Discourage measures for direct control (other than normal harvest) of wildlife and fish populations; ... consider the benefits of a predator species in the ecosystem before approving control actions." (Forest Service Manual 2320).
To be fair, Fish and Game is responsible for wildlife management. Cow elk numbers in the Middle Fork Zone are down, and wolves have undoubtedly played a role. When faced with complex issues such as this, both the Forest Service and Fish and Game must use the best available science and seek input from the public. This eradication effort was approved without public review. And the elk management and predator control plans that Fish and Game are using to justify these efforts are still in their draft forms.
Fish and Game and the Forest Service should suspend this operation and involve the public in an open and transparent discussion. The Idaho Conservation League is taking steps to facilitate this.
These lands and wildlife belong to all of us. The Idaho Department of Fish and Game and the U.S. Forest Service can do better. Wilderness and wildlife management can coexist but this takes forethought, care and an informed citizenry.
Rick Johnson is executive director of the Idaho Conservation League
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2013/12/28/2946582/this-weekends-wolf-hunt-defies.html
News stories are ricocheting across the country about Salmon's "Wolf Derby," which, beginning this weekend, offers cash prizes for the biggest killed wolf. Many have scratched their heads at this unintended marketing of Idaho to the rest of the nation.
What has even more folks scratching their heads is the Idaho Department of Fish and Game's hiring of a professional trapper to eradicate two wolf packs deep in the Frank Church-River of No Return Wilderness and the Forest Service's permission to host the trapper in a U.S. Forest Service cabin.
Proponents of the Wolf Derby in Salmon aren't shy about the purpose of their event. Fish and Game and the Forest Service seem to be trying to slip their event under the radar.
Wolf issues in Idaho can be pretty emotional. Many of us who care deeply about Idaho's outdoors are reluctant to wade into such a polarized topic. Scientists talk about carrying capacity for wildlife. There is also a social carrying capacity for critters like wolves, finding a level of protection that Idaho citizens will support. The Idaho Conservation League supports state management of wolves because we believe that finding the social balance requires state leadership. ICL supports a hunting season for wolves, but ICL also supports the role wolves play in the backcountry. Wolves are part of Idaho's outdoors.
It is one thing to have sportsmen control numbers of this big game species. It is another to hire an exterminator to eradicate entire packs deep in the largest protected wilderness in the lower 48 states. If wolves can't live in relative peace in one of the nation's premier wilderness landscapes, where can they? What kind of precedent does this set for more accessible areas?
Fish and Game recently hosted a wildlife summit in which the key message was that Idaho's wildlife belongs to all of us. A summit conclusion was that both sportsmen and wildlife enthusiasts have an important voice and that together we should support wildlife management efforts. This action deep in the wilderness suggests certain interests have a lot more power than others.
The Forest Service and Fish and Game regularly use each other's facilities, but the Forest Service Manual directs the agency to consider how this use will impact wilderness characteristics: "Discourage measures for direct control (other than normal harvest) of wildlife and fish populations; ... consider the benefits of a predator species in the ecosystem before approving control actions." (Forest Service Manual 2320).
To be fair, Fish and Game is responsible for wildlife management. Cow elk numbers in the Middle Fork Zone are down, and wolves have undoubtedly played a role. When faced with complex issues such as this, both the Forest Service and Fish and Game must use the best available science and seek input from the public. This eradication effort was approved without public review. And the elk management and predator control plans that Fish and Game are using to justify these efforts are still in their draft forms.
Fish and Game and the Forest Service should suspend this operation and involve the public in an open and transparent discussion. The Idaho Conservation League is taking steps to facilitate this.
These lands and wildlife belong to all of us. The Idaho Department of Fish and Game and the U.S. Forest Service can do better. Wilderness and wildlife management can coexist but this takes forethought, care and an informed citizenry.
Rick Johnson is executive director of the Idaho Conservation League
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2013/12/28/2946582/this-weekends-wolf-hunt-defies.html
Elkmagnet
Well-known member
I find it funny that people think wildlife management should be based on public opinion.
Just because most of the time it is doesn't mean it should be.
Just because most of the time it is doesn't mean it should be.
Elkmagnet
Well-known member
Thank goodness the slaughter is over, poor wolves just didn't stand a chance.
shoots-straight
Well-known member
Thats just the point. No more wolves were killed this past weekend than would have without the organized hunt contest.
This will have lasting effects to come, mark my words. If nothing else it made more money for the other side than the whole thing did for the town of Salmon.
Management has nothing to do with killing contests.
npaden
Well-known member
SS - why is this different than a fishing derby? Fish don't wear fur? Fish don't have feelings?
I have a fish in my saltwater aquarium at home that is 13 years old. It's pretty smart and will even do tricks for food.
I just can't ever figure out where the line gets drawn between cute and cuddly and no one cares at all.
Does it have to be a mammal before people care? What about a mouse killing contest? They are smart and can do tricks for sure.
I have a fish in my saltwater aquarium at home that is 13 years old. It's pretty smart and will even do tricks for food.
I just can't ever figure out where the line gets drawn between cute and cuddly and no one cares at all.
Does it have to be a mammal before people care? What about a mouse killing contest? They are smart and can do tricks for sure.
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jryoung
Well-known member
You really can't see the difference between the polarizing nature of wolves and potential backlash against hunters and fishing? Or a you just trolling for a comment (pun intended).
npaden
Well-known member
I can clearly see the polarizing nature of wolves. It seems to even affect fellow hunters who seem to hold them with some sort of reverence.
I'm just wondering where we should draw the line. Mice, Raccoon, Wild Pigs? Pigs are actually smarter than dogs supposedly, but we don't seem to have developed an affection for them.
Is it simply that dogs and cats have been domesticated and people extend their feelings from their pets toward wild canines and felines? Bears seem to be off limits too though (recent laws against hunting bears with hounds in California and no spring bear hunting in Colorado) and I don't know anyone with a pet bear.
I'm just wondering where we should draw the line. Mice, Raccoon, Wild Pigs? Pigs are actually smarter than dogs supposedly, but we don't seem to have developed an affection for them.
Is it simply that dogs and cats have been domesticated and people extend their feelings from their pets toward wild canines and felines? Bears seem to be off limits too though (recent laws against hunting bears with hounds in California and no spring bear hunting in Colorado) and I don't know anyone with a pet bear.
shoots-straight
Well-known member
To many fishing contests are repulsive too. Even though it's a contest the fish get eaten. So to many non hunters they don't feel so bad.
Coyotes, and wolves don't get eaten, and so the killing for competition is greatly frowned upon.
Here's on such site, and their comments on this very subject.
http://ecowatch.com/2013/12/19/wolf-killing-contest-disguised-family-fun/
As I have said before, It has a lot to do with perception and social acceptance.
Coyotes, and wolves don't get eaten, and so the killing for competition is greatly frowned upon.
Here's on such site, and their comments on this very subject.
http://ecowatch.com/2013/12/19/wolf-killing-contest-disguised-family-fun/
As I have said before, It has a lot to do with perception and social acceptance.
idahofishnhunt
Well-known member
Apparently some don't mind eating coyotes... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaHxYlcjICA
HighDesertSage
Well-known member
So how did they do this weekend?
jryoung
Well-known member
0 - wolves
21 - coyotes
Defenders of wildlife has not yet reported how much money they have raised.
21 - coyotes
Defenders of wildlife has not yet reported how much money they have raised.
Elkmagnet
Well-known member
haha but this was a wolf hunting contest not a killing contest.
You are now wording your replies like a bunny hugger. Trying to get emotional responses? You forgot to add what organization you are with so we know who to donate to
This contest is likely to have ramifications that I will not like. But it is not breaking any laws and I don't believe we should have any laws to stop such contests
