Poor ATVers...

[BuzzH]

Looks like the ATVers are crying in their 40 oz bottles of Old English...

Maybe instead of an "after the fact" rally, they should have been busy during the planning process...

More banning of ATV's...YEAH BABY, YEAH!

Group rallies against Gallatin off-road proposal
Associated Press

BOZEMAN -- A group of bikers, snowmobilers and all-terrain vehicle riders is fighting a proposal by the Gallatin National Forest to close significant areas to motor vehicles.

The forest wants to ban snowmobiles from 356,000 of its 1.8 million acres under a revised travel plan due out in January. Motorcycle trails would fall by about 50 percent and ATV trails by 40 percent.

The plan also calls for 34,000 fewer off-trail acres for horseback riders in alpine areas of the Beartooth Plateau, and a drop in off-road access for mountain bikers.


A weekend rally against the proposal by Citizens for Balanced Use, a new group formed by motorized use advocate Kerry White, drew more than 200 people, including several local and county officials.

Many carried signs reading "Don't Lock Us Out," "No More Closure," and "No Compromise. We Want to Keep What We Already Have."

"You've been threatened to be locked out," Bozeman city commissioner Jeff Krauss told the crowd. "I guarantee the city commission does not support anything but full access to the national forest."

Krauss vowed to ask Mayor Andrew Cetraro and fellow commissioner Lee Hietala to write letters calling on the U.S. Forest Service to keep its lands open to motorized users.

White said he formed the group because "there needs to be some balance."

But some environmental groups believe the existing balance already favors motorized users.

Most non-wilderness trails in the Gallatin are open to motorized vehicles, and plenty will stay that way if the travel plan is adopted, said Alex Phillips, an organizer in Bozeman for the Montana Wilderness Association.

Just 4 percent of forest visitors report using motorcycles and ATVs, while less than 10 percent snowmobile, she said.

"You can hear them from miles away," said Phillips, who added that protecting the forest's wildlife and natural resources were also important concerns.

Forest Supervisor Becki Heath was expected to select a final plan sometime next year.

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

Buzz ,
Wouldn't this be a ban on hunting as well ?
As we've heard earlier , if you can't drive an ATV to your downed animal it will have to be left to rot , thereby risking " wanton waste " charges !

 

[ringer]

Buzz-I have been pokin' the bear on this topic but if they close it that's that. Funny thing is they are willing to close it off and still pay to create a drop off area for mountain bikers. I live right on a preserve where 7 new homes were burned to the ground and when they finally caught the guy it was a greenie biker who hated building up where he rode. I hike the trails and hate to see those doctors and lawyers with little helmets rattling by me and I gotta move for them. Either way if you think the closures are good for hunting how will you get in to the 360000 acres and how does the animal meat get out? Sounds like no pickups allowed either.

 

[Whiskers]

Ringer, how will you get into the 360,000 acres......WALK.

 

[ringer]

Whiskers-I am not familiar with the area so can you walk into the whole area to hunt or will they allow vehicle travel to get into the interior? I know you can walk in maybe 5 miles but no way will you get an elk out that far without ruining some of it. Or can you walk in 50 miles and get your animal out? Unless they allow some road travel this would do the same as outlawing hunting on some major acreage. I know you think hiking in is possible on all land and vehicles are flat bad but at least tell me how this will help hunting?

 

[Whiskers]

Ringer, you don't know what I think! I don't think all vehicles are bad! I do beleive that too many people, have to ride to close to hunting areas, drag too much stuff in, and leave too much trash behind. That they have to run 50 mph, leave big ruts that create unnatural runoffs. If people would use their head while riding back in, it would be one thing, but they don't. It doesn't sound to me like they are outlawing hunting, it will just make it a little more difficult to get to. Which will make it a better hunting area for those willing to expend the energy.
ATV's are pretty much outlawed in our state on public ground, but they are out there all over the place even tho there is a $1,000 fine and possible confiscation of the ATV. There are only so many rangers, and they know it. Nothing like hiking back a mile or so to your favorite stand, keeping noise and scent to a minimum, and have a couple of quads following each other come burnin thru. You know why this is such a hot issue? The way ATV'rs act out there....not all but a good many. They bring this on themselves.

 

[1_pointer]

Ringer- I haven't seen a map, but depending on the shape of the area one may not be more than 5 miles for a large portion of the 360,000 acres (think long and skinny or an area with many fingers). I can't tell from the article either if the 360K acres is in one contiguous piece. If you have 6 areas at 60K acres with a high boundary/total acreage ratio you may not be very far from a road. If it was circular that would be different. Also, all but 34,000ac would be open to horseback riding. If that acreage is spread out there may be very little that isn't open to horses and the rest could be hiked to.

 

[BuzzH]

Ringer,

You cant be serious that a person cant move an elk more than 5 miles without "wasting" it...are you? HAHAHA

If I limited myself to only 5 miles I'd never kill an elk in Wyoming or Montana, nor would a large portion of other serious hunters in those states.

I like these big areas where no vehicle access is allowed, it seperates the hacks from the serious hunters...and those that are willing to put in some effort are rewarded with a great experience and usually a mature animal.

ATV's suck.

 

[BigHornRam]

Pointer,

This is BIG Country and steep to boot. The off trail horse closure is in the alpine Beartooth Wilderness. Must be having problems with the horse hunters tearing up the countryside with their nags. I don't know the specifics of the new proposals for the Gallatin, so I won't comment whether or not they are reasonable. I do know Bozeman has a growing population of unreasonable enviro kooks and that is the main reason I moved from there. Many of the new comers are not keen on hunting either. That could be the next form of forest recreation on the list to ban. All those noisey rifles shooting all the time, and what if they actually kill something?

Can anyone find a link to Tom Brokaw's spat with the neighboring ranch in the Boulder River area? There was a good article in this mornings Missoulian, but unfortunately it is not on their web site.

 

[MarvB]

This was the one a while back from the Billings Gazette:

link

 

[ringer]

OK you guys are right and are the most studly hunters there are. And I am sure that the 360000 acres is a long strip you can walk across easily and I am sure Buzz can walk an elk out 5 miles in a single trip. Or how many trips does it take for you to get an elk out? At least 3? Thats 30 miles of hiking half with a load. You guys are funny. I am also sure that 90% of the hunters have horses and mules. Or maybe Buzz and the boys just want the hunting elite with a lot of dough to be able to access public land. I bet you wear your bike helmets while you hunt and they are painted in realtree.

 

[MattK]

Ringer- We got four elk out in Montana this year. Not one of the elk was closer than 4 miles from our vehicle. One was brought out whole (approximately 4 1/2 miles). The others were quartered and either put on a game cart or a pack frame. This also goes for at least 5 white-tail deer. There were 5 deer and 1 elk taken out within 9 days of one another. It is not only possible but we've done this for the last 3 years. It is a lot of work but it's an even trade for the great hunting that the area has created since the road closures.

Get some boots and you could do it also.

 

[BigHornRam]

Marv,

Thanks for the link. Plenty to think about.

At what point does all of these restrictions cross the line? Doesn't look like the Buzz/Matt crowd are to concerned about restricting horses to trails in the N. F.. What if off trail hiking was the next thing to be restricted? Would this cross the line?

 

[BuzzH]

Ringer,

Just because you CHOOSE not to hunt any further from a vehicle than you can throw a rock, thats not my problem.

But, that doesnt mean that others arent more than willing to walk and work their butts off to take some quality game. You dont have to be rich or own horses to do it either.

The mule deer I killed this year was pure agony, very steep country and back in a long way. I killed the deer at 6:45 p.m. my buddy Doug and I reached our camp at 1:00 a.m. with the boned meat, cape, and antlers in our packs. The next day we hiked the 3 miles back to the vehicle with the deer and our camp. I'll be honest, its a lot of weight to pack and its not the most fun part of the hunting experience, but its what you have to do if you want quality bucks and bulls.

The problem with most hunters is that they're capable of a lot more than they think they are...the weakest part of the human body is the mind, it gives out way sooner than your legs or lungs...and it shows on a regular basis. Just because the ATVers are a bunch of mental midgets, who fear sweating as much as walking, doesnt mean you need a road every 1/4 mile.

"Thats too far...thats too much work...I'm not in good enough shape...it isnt worth it...the meat will spoil...they're locking me out... blah blah blah."

What a crock of shit...just because you cant hack it, dont run down those that can.

 

[JoseCuervo]

I know you can walk in maybe 5 miles but no way will you get an elk out that far without ruining some of it. .... Unless they allow some road travel this would do the same as outlawing hunting on some major acreage.

Ringer,
Are you really that lazy or are you that stupid??? |oo

For the rest of you, that want to understand the maps and such, it is Alternate 7
http://www.fs.fed.us/r1/gallatin/?page=/projects/travel_planning

Still LMAO off over Ringer thinking you have to be able to shoot from a road, or you can't hunt the area.

 

[Ten Bears]

Whata crock o'crappolla BUZZ.

EG,I can't get the image to download. Could you verify that it (their site) is working?

 

[BuzzH]

Ten beers,

Whats o'crappolla, care to explain???

Is it your fear of leaving the atv or that you're a mental midget???

 

[Ten Bears]

It's the brown material that is slowly replacing the grey material that rests in the void between your ears, and spews out of your mouth when you open it.

 

[1_pointer]

BHR- Thanks for the info. Like I said I don't know anything about that country.

It's hard to tell on the map, but it looks like it to me that I was correct in assuming that the closed areas aren't one large contiguous block.

 

[cjcj]

Ringer- We got four elk out in Montana this year. Not one of the elk was closer than 4 miles from our vehicle. One was brought out whole (approximately 4 1/2 miles). The others were quartered and either put on a game cart or a pack frame. This also goes for at least 5 white-tail deer. There were 5 deer and 1 elk taken out within 9 days of one another. It is not only possible but we've done this for the last 3 years. It is a lot of work but it's an even trade for the great hunting that the area has created since the road closures.

Get some boots and you could do it also.

I call BULLSHIT on bringing out the "WHOLE" elk 41/2 miles Matt unless this was an extremley small cow..or you had a bunch of people even at that..i say total Bullshit! i used to bench 400lbs and squat 600lbs and run ten miles easy... and even in those days i could not Drag an "average" cow elk more than a hundred yards on flat ground.... who do you think your fooling?