Petroleum alternatives!

[Ithaca 37]

" A group of college students has set out on a post-finals cross-country road trip that is going to smell a lot like french fries....Vegetable oil creates less pollution than diesel fuel, said Thomas Hand, 19, who took a crash course at Middlebury in converting diesel tractor engines to run on vegetable oil..."

Every farmer in the US should be cheering these kids on! If they can do it, GM and Ford oughta be able to! And what a great market for farmers and a way to decrease our dependance on foreign and domestic oil. Would you rather use veggie oil or oil from the Alaska wildlife refuge to power your car?

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030521/ap_on_re_us/vegetable_oil_bus_3

 

[Argyle]

Biodiesel is surely an intriguing concept. It'll be interesting to learn the results of the trials / studies currently underway in Canada. I wonder whether biodiesel will be more economically feasible than ethanol has so far proven itself to be?

Montreal Biodiesel Study

Saskatoon Biodiesel Evaluation

- rgl

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-21-2003 10:32: Message edited by: Argyle ]</font>

 

[2fastnaz]

I read where they are fining people in the UK for using old fryer fat to run vehicles cause it's so much cheaper.

 

[Lostagain]

Not exactly news..... remember your history, didn't Henry Ford designed the A to run on hemp oil?
Biodeisel has been used in the city buses for quite awhile now in Missoula, some grad-students are mixing it at the UM, cost is just a little more than deisel and a little less power and a little less mpg, but I think the tradeoffs are worth it. I know the dodge cummings has had good success at a 50-50 mix while the GM 6.2 needs more of a 90-10 deisel mix. Last summer there were new ford vans traveling the country promoting this, they were running on a mix of McD oil and an additive(not sure what), they did have to add a sulphur/lead additive for lube tho.
Its a great deal if they can get folks to DEMAND it at their fuelstops.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Lost, There isn't any lead used as an anti wear additive in motor oil. It was banned by the EPA many years ago, about the time lead was taken out of gasoline and paint. Zinc (zinc dialkythiophosphate) is the metallic anti wear additive used, but that will be probably be banned soon and then the anti wear additive will probably be a form of calcium (a calcium calcinate). All motor oil comes fortified with the additives needed for it to pass the API classification tests. The mouse milk and goose juice additives sold for adding to motor oil are mostly worthless, but guys love to waste their money on that crap.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-21-2003 16:56: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>

 

[Lostagain]

Lead was an ADDITIVE to fuel, means it was added to the product. Since the clean air acts were installed, lead was no longer added. STP and others still sell a LEAD additive, mostly to old-car folks. Mostly the old rigs----60's and earlier need the lead, and the additive is lead.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-26-2003 22:25: Message edited by: Lostagain ]</font>

 

[Ithaca 37]

"Lead was outlawed as an automotive gasoline additive in this country in 1986--...."

http://www.mindfully.org/Pesticide/Lead-History.htm

Lost, Do some research! You don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Lostagain]

Post your address and I'll mail ya a case COD.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Just name the company that is selling it. Have you looked at their MSDS? Or, at least, the listed ingredients on the container?

I think you'll find the words "lead substitute"---meaning it IS NOT lead.

""STP Lead Substitute does not contain potassium, phosphorous, manganese, or sodium".

http://www.mgcars.org.uk/electrical/Lead.html

Just do a little research and find me a link to a site for any lead fuel or motor oil additive.

You can't!

Sorry, Lost, but once again you don't know what you're talking about. You think the EPA outlawed lead in fuel and then allows companies to sell a lead fuel additive?!

Here's the STP website:

"Regular use of STP® Lead Substitute helps:

Replace lead protection in unleaded gas
Prevent power loss
Protect exhaust valve seals "

http://www.stp.com/fuel_lead.html

Notice the word "SUBSTITUTE"?

I can't be bothered arguing about real basic stuff like this, Lost. Do some research and you'll find out you don't know diddly shit about fuel and motor oil additives.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-26-2003 23:40: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>

 

[Ten Bears]

LOST, wasn't it an additive to increase the burn rate (combutability)?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Lead Suprem-130 is a genuine TETRAETHYL LEAD (TEL) gasoline treatment. Since 1921, TEL has been the original additive that (1) Boosts octane numbers, (2) Eliminates engine knock, and (3) Protects valves and valve guides. Only with TEL can you expect the highest performance in these three crucial areas. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
http://www.4unique.com/fuel/lead_supreme130/lead_supreme130.htm
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> TetraBOOST is the future of leaded petrol
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> TetraBOOST is the future of leaded petrol
Need more?

 

[Ithaca 37]

Ten, Take a look at where your Tetraboost is sold! Why don't you call them up? Here's their phone #:

#44 (0)20 8870 9933 or fax on #44 (0)20 8870 7172

Does that sound like a US phone # to you?

"When Tetraethyl lead (TEL) was eliminated as a motor fuel additive in the United States, the need to replace some of its performance features, especially to protect older vehicles, was hotly debated in the oil and auto industries. "

http://www.1st-in-synthetics.com/octane_boost.htm

"In June, 1926, GM, DuPont, Standard Oil of New Jersey and their joint venture, the Ethyl Corporation, started selling leaded
gasoline again, and they continued to do so until Congress finally outlawed it completely in 1989.[5] They still sell their
brain-damaging product in third-world nations today."

http://www.monitor.net/rachel/r540.html

Ten, you and Lost are so far out of touch it's pitiful!

And to make matters worse you're trying to debate this with someone who spent 35 years in the motor oil industry!

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-27-2003 18:46: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>

 

[Ten Bears]

I believe it was you who said <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Just do a little research and find me a link to a site for any lead fuel or motor oil additive. You can't!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So I did.

Sorry tetraboost is found at:
http://www.iomo.co.uk/tetraboost/

Where do you buy Lead Supreme-130?
batterystuff.com
Order Line: 1-800-362-5397 / Tech Help: 541-582-4521 / Fax: 541-582-9178
Monday through Friday 8am to 4pm (Pacific Time)
BatteryStuff.com LLC ~ P.O. Box 1703 ~ Rogue River, OR 97537

IT, I think you inhaled way to many emmissions while working in the industry.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Ten, Your tetraboost is sold in the UK. Try buying it here in the US.

Lead Supreme 130. "100% TEL activate". This sounds like one of those fly by night companies that are always popping up in the additive industry. They usually don't last long. In this case it sounds like they've found some way to get around the lead ban at least temporarily. I think the key would be to find out what their 100% TEL activate is. It's probably some kind of chemical derivitive that's far enough from real lead that the EPA hasn't caught up with it yet.

Believe me, if there was a way to legally sell lead additives in the US all the major oil companies and additive companies like Lubrizol and Vanderbilt would be pushing it. When you see DuPont, Mobil, Chevron, BP and Shell staying away from lead additives and some little company in Rogue River, Oregon claiming they have a unique product containing lead you gotta know there's something fishy going on.

Just about every year I'd be approached by some farmer who claimed he had invented some fantastic additive for grease or oil and could make the world's best gear oil or wheel bearing grease with it.

But I knew my company and others were spending hundreds of millions every year on research and development and you couldn't just take some powdered graphite or zinc oxide and mix it up into Marvel Mystery Oil and STP with a stick and beat anything we could develop in our labs.

The farmer was always disappointed to find out he wasn't going to be able to sell his secret formula for millions of bucks.

The additive business is a disgrace to the oil industry and any reputable oil company representative will tell you that. Quit trying to find some super goose juice to improve your engine performance. You'll do just as much good and save yourself a lot of money if you piss into your crankcase.

 

[Lostagain]

whatever IT.
I have cases of liquid lead in bottles from STP for my old gas engines.
IT=== since you are so great and powerful, 35 years in the industry you must have been the one person to get the rest of the world in so much trouble over oil. thank you.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Lost, Don't let the EPA find out about any real lead additives you're in possession of!

There was plenty of trouble in the oil industry long before I was born and there will always be plenty after I'm dead. Read some of it's history. I recommend "The Seven Sisters"--- a history of the seven majors up until about twenty five years ago.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 05-27-2003 23:43: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>

 

[Ten Bears]

My point is IT, you asked for lead additive link, and even boasted that they couldn't be found. I found some for you domestic or foreign, you didn't specify. I don't use lead additives except in my old ford tractor, and I use STP substitute.