NFL players not standing for national anthem

[COEngineer]

There is part of me that doesn't even want to write about this because it gives these spoiled brats even more attention, but I want to get some more perspective on this.

I am not a huge football fan (never bought a ticket or even a jersey) and have already been turned off by all the grand-standing and fighting on the field, which seems to have gotten worse the past few years. When I do watch, I just want to see the best athletes in the world doing amazing things, not dancing around or pushing and shoving like kids on a playground.

Anyway, now the flag is being disrespected and although I know the USA is not perfect by any means, I think it is still the best nation in the world and probably in the history of the world - I can't imagine living anywhere else.

The last thing I want to share is that I didn't even realize how upset I was until I saw a guy walking into the office with a Steelers jacket on...my gut reaction was that I wanted to spit on him (I would never do that, but that is the level of my disgust).

I am interested to hear some different view points - maybe I'm blowing this out of proportion.

 

[Speeddmn]

In before thread lock/delete...

I suggest that happens now...

By making such thread you now provide google with another choice for people who google to find said debate and that leads to a hunting forum....

now people see hunters as flag haters...

more fuel for fire...

etc...

delete this thread...

My take is simple. I get paid from Uncle Sam, I fight for peoples freedoms, if their freedom/right is to kneel during a song, so be it, I will respect the flag, my choice, my right, your choice, your right.

 

[325 WSM]

I've suffered through being a Vikings fan my whole life, They were one of the few teams that all stood for the anthem on Sunday but I'm sorry to say in this case it's guilt by association on this one. I'm done with watching that garbage, how dare you dirt bags disrespect the flag & the national anthem like that. Great people gave up their lives so scum like you can use it as your platform to scream racial inequality. Thank god for hunting seasons coming up, no need to watch a bunch of disrespectful trash on TV. My brother was almost killed in Iraq by an IED fighting for these scum bags rights to act like jack asses. There are a million different ways to protest your causes & they all picked the wrong one in my book. Thank god & our armed forces as well as my brothers in blue for the thankless jobs you do, you don't deserve this crap

 

[Southern Elk]

I don't think its wrong to discuss these things. We can act like rational adults. I used to be a huge football fan. The past couple of years I've watched less and less. We live in a great country that allows us to protest. I believe the players have every right to so. Having said that, I also have the right not to watch and that's what I plan on doing. I'm exercising my right not to watch the NFL anymore. I am so grateful for all of those who serve and have served our great country. This is my way of honoring them. And anytime the National Anthem is played I will stand at attention and my kids have been taught to do the same.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

As someone who has gone forward and fought with the flag on my sleeve; I am far more offended by people trying to suppress any American's right to free speech, than I am about someone kneeling during the National Anthem.

All the veteran's in this country volunteered, or were ordered, to go fight for their country in order to defend the constitution and the rights is affords all Americans (free speech being one of them). I did not risk my life so we could force every American to stand for the national anthem.

All that being said, I would prefer they found another, and hopefully more effective way to have a positive impact on the issues in our society. It does annoy me. However, I will defend, to my last breath if neccesary, their right to do it. The poeple I am truely disgusted with in all of this, are those that use this as one more opportunity to try and sew the seeds of division in our country. They are the true enemy of what this country, our flag, and the national anthem stand for.

Just one man's opinion.....

 

[COEngineer]

I don't think its wrong to discuss these things. We can act like rational adults. I used to be a huge football fan. The past couple of years I've watched less and less. We live in a great country that allows us to protest. I believe the players have every right to so. Having said that, I also have the right not to watch and that's what I plan on doing. I'm exercising my right not to watch the NFL anymore. I am so grateful for all of those who serve and have served our great country. This is my way of honoring them. And anytime the National Anthem is played I will stand at attention and my kids have been taught to do the same.

I agree completely. I don't think the NFL or anyone should try to stop the players from doing what they're doing. It's a free country, and they can disrespect the flag if they want. I just dislike them for doing it.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Not much off a football fan, and I haven't served our country in the armed forces. I know that the national anthem symbolizes different things to different people and therefore this topic is polarizing.

No matter what your perspective on the anthem I think it's important to think about how history views the events in this picture below. At the time the average middle-class open minded white guy typically considered these folks agitators and said they should stop stirring up trouble, that they would get rights eventually but slow was better than rapid change.

View attachment 74398

Change is uncomfortable and sometimes we need to be made uncomfortable. Gregg Popovich had a good statement about this...

http://dailycaller.com/2017/09/25/nba-coach-white-people-especially-need-to-be-made-uncomfortable/

I think the reason these individuals picked the anthem as a time to protest was due to the emotional response and controversy they knew it would generate. A major strategy in all civil rights movements from, South Africa and India to the one in our own country has been to pick locations and modes of protest that would be the most disruptive and which would illicit the greatest negative response in order to bring the the most attention to the issue at hand. Clearly protesting during the anthem has been an effective tactic.

All of this being said it is very unfortunate that in order to bring attention to their cause the NFL protesters are disrespecting another marginalized group, veterans.

 

[nidahunter]

I believe anyone has the right to protest anything thanks to all of the people who have fought to give us that freedom. I also believe there is a time and a place to do it. While you are on the field in your official capacity to play a game for the team that hired you is not the right time. Most of us would be fired if we tried to pull this on our employers dime. If you want to protest, do it on your own time. As stated above, just one man's opinion...

 

[u1299]

As someone who has gone forward and fought with the flag on my sleeve; I am far more offended by people trying to suppress any American's right to free speech, than I am about someone kneeling during the National Anthem.

All the veteran's in this country volunteered, or were ordered, to go fight for their country in order to defend the constitution and the rights is affords all Americans (free speech being one of them). I did not risk my life so we could force every American to stand for the national anthem.

All that being said, I would prefer they found another, and hopefully more effective way to have a positive impact on the issues in our society. It does annoy me. However, I will defend, to my last breath if neccesary, their right to do it. The poeple I am truely disgusted with in all of this, are those that use this as one more opportunity to try and sew the seeds of division in our country. They are the true enemy of what this country, our flag, and the national anthem stand for.

Just one man's opinion.....

I agree. There were but a handful of players kneeling which they have every damn right to do, then someone came along and made a big issue about it and the rest of the players protested (not the flag or anthem) but the POTUS, IMO...

 

[tjones]

I agree. There were but a handful of players kneeling which they have every damn right to do, then someone came along and made a big issue about it and the rest of the players protested (not the flag or anthem) but the POTUS, IMO...

This,,,,,,,,,,,

 

[Nameless Range]

I stand for the national anthem, and my children are taught to do the same. That said, to me it borders on platitude - by which I mean, any one can do it whether they believe in this country, respect our veterans, and understand our rights or not. Much like saying please, thank you, and shaking someone's hand, it's a hoop you jump through to show respect. Which is not to say those hoops aren't important, let's just not forget that that is what they are and anybody can do them despite what they stand for deep down. When a hoop isn't jumped through it can be seen as a sign of disrespect, i.e. offense. The last thing I or my family would ever want to do is offend those who have sacrificed, so we stand, and in doing so it becomes meaningful to us. I know I feel powerful emotions when I stand for the National Anthem. To each their own in terms of prioritizing that non-offense. As they say, "It's a free country." Though, you're not necessarily free when you're at work and your employer's reputation is being affected are you?

The Libertarian Economist Tyler Cowen had an interesting take on this which I sympathize with. Basically, this is the right's version of political correctness. Which I'll say again, doesn't diminish it's value. Ultimately I'll still watch a game or two a year, but the fact that hunting season overlaps with football season means football takes a back seat by default.

http://marginalrevolution.com/margi...s-nfl-tell-players-stand-national-anthem.html

 

[Idahoarcheryhunter]

Like others have said they completely do have the right to protest and I agree that we still have problems in this country that need addressed and they do have a large platform to step out on, but I wish they would find a different time to do it not during the national anthem, that being said directv is refunding Sunday ticket if any of you are interested saved me some money.

 

[ChrisC]

As someone who has gone forward and fought with the flag on my sleeve; I am far more offended by people trying to suppress any American's right to free speech, than I am about someone kneeling during the National Anthem.

All the veteran's in this country volunteered, or were ordered, to go fight for their country in order to defend the constitution and the rights is affords all Americans (free speech being one of them). I did not risk my life so we could force every American to stand for the national anthem.

All that being said, I would prefer they found another, and hopefully more effective way to have a positive impact on the issues in our society. It does annoy me. However, I will defend, to my last breath if neccesary, their right to do it. The poeple I am truely disgusted with in all of this, are those that use this as one more opportunity to try and sew the seeds of division in our country. They are the true enemy of what this country, our flag, and the national anthem stand for.

Just one man's opinion.....

Couldn't have said it better, IMO...

 

[rmauch20]

I really don't care if they stand,sit, or kneel for the national anthem. I will continue to stand. As long as they're protesting in a peaceful nonviolent matter let them have it. I think this is going to have a negative affect on the NFL but there again I don't care if they're all bankrupt tomorrow. I'm more of a college football person anyway. I have just slowly stopped watching the NFL. This year I will just turn it off for good.
And I think it's kind of ridiculous that these big tough football players got so butt hurt over the president calling them sons of bitches. Much like movie stars I don't want to hear your opinion on politics either entertain me in the movie or by playing the football game if you start to mixing the two I will just stop watching.

 

[ol_spark]

I served my country and stand for the flag. I will not watch any NFL games on TV, buy anymore tickets for grandkids to watch game and will no longer purchase any memorabilia. I will quit buying Pepsi and as many products that sponsor any of those events and that sir is my choice.

 

[Rainer]

If you don't understand why they are kneeling to begin with, you are the problem. If you are all right with neo-nazi's protesting but not minorities. You are the problem. If you think it's okay for you to protest the sale of public lands but people can't protest police brutality. You need to give your head a shake. Players didn't even come out of the locker rooms until 2009. That's when the D.O.D starting paying the NFL millions of dollars. This was to boost recruitment, this was paid military propaganda.

Disrespecting the flag and the national anthem? pssh no it isn't. Going around with a Confederate flag is disrespectful.

 

[hank4elk]

As someone who has gone forward and fought with the flag on my sleeve; I am far more offended by people trying to suppress any American's right to free speech, than I am about someone kneeling during the National Anthem.

All the veteran's in this country volunteered, or were ordered, to go fight for their country in order to defend the constitution and the rights is affords all Americans (free speech being one of them). I did not risk my life so we could force every American to stand for the national anthem.

All that being said, I would prefer they found another, and hopefully more effective way to have a positive impact on the issues in our society. It does annoy me. However, I will defend, to my last breath if neccesary, their right to do it. The poeple I am truely disgusted with in all of this, are those that use this as one more opportunity to try and sew the seeds of division in our country. They are the true enemy of what this country, our flag, and the national anthem stand for.

Just one man's opinion.....

Well said,ditto.

 

[Zach]

I agree. There were but a handful of players kneeling which they have every damn right to do, then someone came along and made a big issue about it and the rest of the players protested (not the flag or anthem) but the POTUS, IMO...

This is accurate. IMO though, the players didn't realize that what President Trump said is the sentiment felt nationwide by several folks. They may or may not care about losing fans.

They are more than welcome to do anything on the field, considering it doesn't violate their contract, but the fans have their right to react as they see fit as well.

To think this all started from the ignorance displayed by Kaepernick...

 

[Zach]

If you don't understand why they are kneeling to begin with, you are the problem. If you are all right with neo-nazi's protesting but not minorities. You are the problem. If you think it's okay for you to protest the sale of public lands but people can't protest police brutality. You need to give your head a shake. Players didn't even come out of the locker rooms until 2009. That's when the D.O.D starting paying the NFL millions of dollars. This was to boost recruitment, this was paid military propaganda.

Disrespecting the flag and the national anthem? pssh no it isn't. Going around with a Confederate flag is disrespectful.

Please explain to all us why they are taking a knee, factually.

 

[Southern Elk]

If you don't understand why they are kneeling to begin with, you are the problem. If you are all right with neo-nazi's protesting but not minorities. You are the problem. If you think it's okay for you to protest the sale of public lands but people can't protest police brutality. You need to give your head a shake. Players didn't even come out of the locker rooms until 2009. That's when the D.O.D starting paying the NFL millions of dollars. This was to boost recruitment, this was paid military propaganda.

Disrespecting the flag and the national anthem? pssh no it isn't. Going around with a Confederate flag is disrespectful.

What if I told you a person could be against these protests and against neo-nazi protests? Most people don't fall into one extreme or the other.