New Mexico - Terk Overturned

[noharleyyet]

Price creep, quota creep, point creep....the Mountain Jam Nirvana Blues.

Get with it Nebraska, you're not gouging enough.

 

[sagebrush]

You guys that are pushing for the elimination of landowner vouchers better be careful what you wish for. About 90% of the antelope in NM live on private property. The only reason any of those tags go into the public draw is because the landowner is issued vouchers for the majority of the tags on his property. Same is true to a lesser degree with elk tags. Elimination of landowner vouchers will reduce hunter opportunity for both resident and non-resident alike.

Sucks they may change the rules after your money has been sent regarding the Terk decision, but in all reality, you had very little chance of drawing a tag to begin with and NMGFD was going to be holding your money anyway. By the way, it is held in trust in a non-interest bearing account.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

You guys that are pushing for the elimination of landowner vouchers better be careful what you wish for. About 90% of the antelope in NM live on private property. The only reason any of those tags go into the public draw is because the landowner is issued vouchers for the majority of the tags on his property. Same is true to a lesser degree with elk tags. Elimination of landowner vouchers will reduce hunter opportunity for both resident and non-resident alike.

Sucks they may change the rules after your money has been sent regarding the Terk decision, but in all reality, you had very little chance of drawing a tag to begin with and NMGFD was going to be holding your money anyway. By the way, it is held in trust in a non-interest bearing account.

***Will have to disagree with you on both those statements, especially the latter! NRs had the same chance at tags for those three animals that the injunction covered and now there aren't more than 2 or 3 total tags under the 6% NR DIY cap that will even be available. I'd have been ticked if I was a NM resident too when 15 of the 16 tags for sheep in 2012 went to NRs. This change in the rules will immediately more than make up for that though and even more so in the future!

 

[nmtaxi]

Sagebrush, the landowner system needs some serious fixing. For example, the smallest "ranch" in unit 15 (a primo elk unit) that qualifies for a unit wide bull elk tag is 1 acre. That's 1 acre. I do think that landowners need incentive to manage the wildlife. We live in a desert where water is scarce, and thank god there are ranchers bringing water to these areas. But there is some real abuse of the system.
That being said, I've hunted antelope twice in Wyoming, and killed two bucks on private property. Neither time did I have to pay the landowner, or even meet him for that matter.

 

[nmelktrout]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE, MARCH 26 2014:

APPLICANTS FOR BIGHORN SHEEP, ORYX AND IBEX HUNTING LICENSES ELIGIBLE FOR FULL REFUNDS

SANTA FE – Hunters who applied for bighorn sheep, oryx or ibex licenses for the 2014-15 seasons and are unsuccessful in the drawings will be eligible for full refunds of application fees and license fees, the Department of Game and Fish announced Wednesday.

Application fees normally are nonrefundable whether a license applicant is successful or not. This year’s departure from that practice is in response to Monday’s ruling in U.S. District Court that vacated a 1977 injunction that prohibited the Department from applying preferential quotas that benefitted state residents in drawings for bighorn sheep, oryx and ibex licenses. The injunction allowed nonresidents to enjoy the same odds as residents when applying for those species.

Because of Monday’s ruling, the Department will begin applying the same quotas this year to bighorn sheep, oryx and ibex applications as it applies to deer, elk, pronghorn antelope and Barbary sheep. According to those quotas, 84 percent of licenses are allocated to New Mexico residents, 6 percent are allocated to nonresidents, and 10 percent are allocated to applicants – residents and nonresidents – who use New Mexico outfitters.

Applicants for bighorn sheep, oryx and ibex who choose not to participate in the new quota system must delete their applications by April 18. Applications can be deleted through online accounts or by telephone toll-free, (888) 268-6866.

“The Department determined that it will be most equitable to refund the normally nonrefundable application fees to applicants who are unsuccessful or who choose to withdraw their application due to changes resulting from the recent court decision, and to comply immediately with state law,” Department General Counsel Allison Marks said.

Because the option to apply with outfitters was not offered on this year’s application forms, hunters who would like to designate a valid outfitter will be able to do so and join the 10 percent license allocation pool. To add a New Mexico outfitter to an application, the applicant will be required to call the Department and provide the application number, customer identification number and the outfitter number no later than April 18.

The court ruling prompted the Department to delay this year’s drawing by approximately one week. Drawing results will be available no later than April 30.

For more information about the drawing, refunds and the application process, please call the Department toll-free, (888) 268-6866.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I agree. Not sure how they can make these rule changes for this year.
Buzz, I agree with you whole heartedly. The NMWF has taken up some good fights, but the landowner tag issue is one they don't want to touch. And in the end, takes away far more tags from residents than anything else. They current split, along with the outfitter welfare tags is pretty much embarrassing.

Politics is the art of the possible. NMWF is working towards that end, based on convo's I've had with their past ED. I think their new ED has the same kind of fire to get this done, but I wouldn't look at what they're doing and think they're just getting the low hanging fruit. This helps set precedent and helps towards the longer campaign.

 

[Ben Lamb]

FYI:

http://www.wildlife.state.nm.us/pub...yx-Ibex-Hunting-Licenses-Refund-Eligible.html

 

[LopeHunter]

***Will have to disagree with you on both those statements, especially the latter! NRs had the same chance at tags for those three animals that the injunction covered and now there aren't more than 2 or 3 total tags under the 6% NR DIY cap that will even be available. I'd have been ticked if I was a NM resident too when 15 of the 16 tags for sheep in 2012 went to NRs. This change in the rules will immediately more than make up for that though and even more so in the future!

Can someone explain how NM residents were not applying for sheep tags in numbers that would allow them to get a big chunk of the tags? Costs me $Thousands to apply yet cost a NR Resident $Hundreds. Were there 15x as many NR willing to lay $1000s on the line compared to R at $100s? A normal reaction to a lower price is increased demand but seems NM hunters were not into sheep hunting all that much.

 

[BuzzH]

Politics is the art of the possible. NMWF is working towards that end, based on convo's I've had with their past ED. I think their new ED has the same kind of fire to get this done, but I wouldn't look at what they're doing and think they're just getting the low hanging fruit. This helps set precedent and helps towards the longer campaign.

Ben...all I know is NM Residents havent done jack chit to help out NR hunters. SB196 wasnt what I'd call NR friendly legislation...neither was this.

New Mexico is going to have to start walking the walk before they see another dime of this NR's money.

I think the only "longer campaign" is trying to figure out how to get more tags for Residents...period. I havent heard so much as a whimper from the residents in regard to the LO or OF tags. Funny....in a bad way.

 

[nmelktrout]

Even better.... par for the course...
(888) 248-6866.
REVISED: CORRECTED PHONE NUMBER
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE, MARCH 26 2014:

APPLICANTS FOR BIGHORN SHEEP, ORYX AND IBEX HUNTING LICENSES ELIGIBLE FOR FULL REFUNDS.....

 

[nmtaxi]

There were slightly more NR applying than residents. Last year 8027 R and 8584 NR. I does seem shocking, doesn't it? So, with almost a 50/50 split, NR came out on top big for desert bighorn for years. I can't help but think every sheep guy in the country puts in for NM since they had equal shot at a tag, and had the chance to draw every year since there is no point system, plus some pretty darn good trophy potential.
With ibex, residents nearly double NR, but still only half as many that apply for sheep.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Ben...all I know is NM Residents havent done jack chit to help out NR hunters. SB196 wasnt what I'd call NR friendly legislation...neither was this.

New Mexico is going to have to start walking the walk before they see another dime of this NR's money.

I think the only "longer campaign" is trying to figure out how to get more tags for Residents...period. I havent heard so much as a whimper from the residents in regard to the LO or OF tags. Funny....in a bad way.

Call 'em. Ask what the plan is. If they don't have one, then I'll join you in not putting in for NM.

 

[BuzzH]

I will call...and then I'm going to take a good look at their "track record" in regard to how they've decided to treat NR's.

Let me ask you Ben, do you think they've done a good job in regard to how they treat NR hunters in NM?

Action is where its at...and they havent shown me anything positive.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I will call...and then I'm going to take a good look at their "track record" in regard to how they've decided to treat NR's.

Let me ask you Ben, do you think they've done a good job in regard to how they treat NR hunters in NM?

Action is where its at...and they havent shown me anything positive.

I think NM is messed up 6 ways to sunday and it takes a helluva effort to get anything positive done. You are absolutely right about set asides and their affect on R vs NR allocation. I also know that the politics of NM is such that getting a bill passed to undo the damage that has been done is easier said than done.

So I'm probably more lenient towards NMWF than you. No group is perfect, but knowing their past ED, and where they came from under his leadership, I'd not hesitate to throw in woth them on an issue we both believed in.

 

[WapitiBob]

Personally, I don't care much for NMWF.
Regarding sheep draw tags and their disbursement, I have the odds back to 2002 and 2012 was a freak incident. Discounting last year, the draw has mirrored the res/nr pools fairly close with the exception of 2 years. One favored residents the other favored nr. Over time it hasn't really favored one side from what I saw.

 

[npaden]

Just to make sure before I apply for my refund. There is currently a ZERO percent chance that I would be able to draw a sheep tag other than a ewe in either the outfitter pool or the nonguided nonresident pool. Right?

I've applied for some tags with some pretty long odds before, but last I checked, ZERO is pretty bad.

 

[WapitiBob]

Wait a few days if you can. Some are trying to determine the rounding procedure and that could make one or two ram tags available. It would be the guided side.

 

[schmalts]

NM has no intention of refunding any money until after the drawing from the phone conversation I just had with them.
So I immediately called my credit card company and its a slam dunk..already done. Just tell them the merchant sent you a letter telling you the description and availability of the product has drastically changed. I told her they had intension to refund me but not until june and she laughed.

 

[Zach]

NM is a screwed up state, not just when it comes to hunting.

 

[nmtaxi]

... yeah, but it's getting better now that all the pot smokers are moving to Colorado.