Montana mule deer rant

[OpenCountry]

Said he spent 12 days in deer camp, sometimes you gotta just be okay with not punching a tag.

This 100%. Unfortunately that’s not what 90% of residents and nonresidents are ok with. Gotta punch that tag no matter what.

 

[The Hedgehog]

This 100%. Unfortunately that’s not what 90% of residents and nonresidents are ok with. Gotta punch that tag no matter what.

There’s something exciting about making a stalk, getting in range, taking an animal and all that goes with bringing one home. Can’t fault anybody for wanting to enjoy that part of a hunt. You CAN fault the FWP for giving out so many licenses, and seasons through November.

 

[OpenCountry]

There’s something exciting about making a stalk, getting in range, taking an animal and all that goes with bringing one home. Can’t fault anybody for wanting to enjoy that part of a hunt. You CAN fault the FWP for giving out so many licenses, and seasons through November.

Unfortunately it isn’t to exciting when you know the numbers are crap and all you're doing is adding to it. Just my opinion and attitude towards deer hunting over the last 5 or 6 years. However the faster this thing crashes the faster (hopefully) change will come.

I do agree with you on faulting FWP on continuing down our path with the rut hunt and all of the doe tags given out.

 

[SAJ-99]

From the AHM I posted earlier. I wonder how these numbers will change with the new survey. I guess we should be happy they at least they decided to do a new survey. Once every 35 years seems a little lazy.

A 1988 survey of deer hunters found that Montana deer hunters could be categorized into four groups: generalists-enthusiasts (27%), meat hunters (36%), generalists- meat hunters (14%), and trophy hunters (23%; Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks 1988). In addition, the survey found a general high level of statewide satisfaction (88%) of deer management with more opposition to further restricted seasons than support (59% oppose, 27% support and 14% were indifferent related to season restrictions focused on managing for ‘big bucks’) (MT Fish, Wildlife & Parks 1988).

 

[The Hedgehog]

Unfortunately it isn’t to exciting when you know the numbers are crap and all you're doing is adding to it.

I’m sure you’d agree what’s exciting to you might not be exciting to others also.

 

[Perlodid]

Our biologist told me that there is no proof that rut hunting effects age structure. I didn’t have much to say after that

Can't have proof if you don't collect any data

 

[rogerthat]

“They will recover quick. This is nothing to worry about. We have been here before. Long term we are on a great trajectory.” Fwp Wildlife Bio to me when raising concerns.

 

[EYJONAS!]

“They will recover quick. This is nothing to worry about. We have been here before. Long term we are on a great trajectory.” Fwp Wildlife Bio to me when raising concerns.

Sooooo does one even need a education for this profession or what?

 

[rogerthat]

Maybe something positive will come from the awefulness of this year. Even if it was ending doe harvest on public lands in eastern montana I would take that. Or if fwp actually made an effort to understand where the harvest and hunter effort is actually occurring across the state.

After discussing mule deer with a bunch of agency personnel this year, one thing was crystal clear to me, fwp has no clue what they are doing in regards to mule deer management. They have gotten by with the same season structure for so long, they just cross their fingers and repeat the same talking points from the 80s.

 

[Cah89]

Unfortunately most game management is reactive instead of proactive. Is Montana led by an elected commission like many other game agencies? In my experience, the commission can have a lot (too much) say in game management.

 

[DFS]

I’m a sucker for punishment. I couldn’t sleep in I had to give it one last go. I went to a spot with low deer numbers which historically means low deer hunters. Peaked the ridge and saw a small buck chasing a doe. Looked below me and saw two hunters looked like a father and a son. Glassed again and saw a decent buck. Father and son see me kick it into high gear. I’m digging my spotting scope out and BAM!! The decent buck is dead. Oh the memories made. This year I have realized I’m too old and out of shape to shoot a deer. Rut and die!!

 

[DFS]

Montana is not going to change a thing. This is the best year of hunting we will see. Quality of hunt is gone. Deer are gone. It’s going to get worse.

 

[JT88]

I'm afraid Doug is right. I've been pondering this issue for a few years now and talking to a lot of people from all over the state. The mule deer problem is not going away. I'm afraid it's the perfect storm and it's been brewing for years. Mule deer are unique and don't just bounce back like whitetails can and do. Between low deer numbers, ridiculous overharvest, an excess of coyotes and cats in the areas I've hunted, years of drought, and what looks like a real MT winter this year I'm afraid it's going to be a wasteland for the foreseeable future. The real question is when will hunters and FWP wake up? It's already too late. The question is whether we will implement real mule deer management in the future

 

[FREAK]

What are the odds he’s actually going to take that to a taxidermist to have it mounted?

Regardless of the circumstances and precision details - that post is telling of hunting, the state of Montana mule deer, and the volumes of “followers”.

#selective?

For the record - if I had a deer license and that very buck would have shown itself to me this week while I was hunting with my son, it would probably have been shot by either of us and we’d have been very happy. Times have changed.

To me I’d love to see these social media “influencers” post something along the lines of “I spent 12 days looking for a deer in some of the best deer country in Montana. The best I could turn up was a 150” deer. For such an exceptional year of weather and conditions for deer hunting this was a depressing sight to see. Montana FWP needs to do better if we want our deer to survive.”

 

[antlerradar]

From the AHM I posted earlier. I wonder how these numbers will change with the new survey. I guess we should be happy they at least they decided to do a new survey. Once every 35 years seems a little lazy.

A 1988 survey of deer hunters found that Montana deer hunters could be categorized into four groups: generalists-enthusiasts (27%), meat hunters (36%), generalists- meat hunters (14%), and trophy hunters (23%; Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks 1988). In addition, the survey found a general high level of statewide satisfaction (88%) of deer management with more opposition to further restricted seasons than support (59% oppose, 27% support and 14% were indifferent related to season restrictions focused on managing for ‘big bucks’) (MT Fish, Wildlife & Parks 1988).

I was one of the 27 percent, I have more with me now.

 

[DFS]

I'm afraid Doug is right. I've been pondering this issue for a few years now and talking to a lot of people from all over the state. The mule deer problem is not going away. I'm afraid it's the perfect storm and it's been brewing for years. Mule deer are unique and don't just bounce back like whitetails can and do. Between low deer numbers, ridiculous overharvest, an excess of coyotes and cats in the areas I've hunted, years of drought, and what looks like a real MT winter this year I'm afraid it's going to be a wasteland for the foreseeable future. The real question is when will hunters and FWP wake up? It's already too late. The question is whether we will implement real mule deer management in the future

Simply won’t happen. Their counts are “good” hunter satisfaction is good. When a game agency won’t admit they have a problem good luck on improving it. Even if it’s crystal clear to the people that actually have interest.

 

[bayoublaster7527]

To me I’d love to see these social media “influencers” post something along the lines of “I spent 12 days looking for a deer in some of the best deer country in Montana. The best I could turn up was a 150” deer. For such an exceptional year of weather and conditions for deer hunting this was a depressing sight to see. Montana FWP needs to do better if we want our deer to survive.”

That’s hilarious! How would that help the shamelessly self-promoting insta famous quasi celebrity hunting bros sell their sick flat bill merch and collect more sponsorships? Randy and Rinella seem like the only ones remotely in it for wildlife……

 

[rogerthat]

I’m a sucker for punishment. I couldn’t sleep in I had to give it one last go. I went to a spot with low deer numbers which historically means low deer hunters. Peaked the ridge and saw a small buck chasing a doe. Looked below me and saw two hunters looked like a father and a son. Glassed again and saw a decent buck. Father and son see me kick it into high gear. I’m digging my spotting scope out and BAM!! The decent buck is dead. Oh the memories made. This year I have realized I’m too old and out of shape to shoot a deer. Rut and die!!

It’s combat out there man! Sounds like you lost!

 

[JT88]

What was the situation with ND and why they put a hault on their mule deer hunting opportunities and what does it look like now compared to what it was?

Sounds like they needed to bring the mule deer back from the brink?

Now there's limited opportunities to hunt them but, there is still a decent chance if you are a res?

I know a few buddies that have done the NR archery option.

And no, i don't want to hear that ND doesn't have good mule deer cause that's bullshit.

I grew up there til I was 14. ND Game and Fish does a hell of a job with deer management. When I was a kid, numbers were way up. You could draw a buck tag almost every year. Bad winterkill and disease hit and numbers dropped drastically. They recognized this immediately and adjusted for it. Numbers are coming back slowly but still not what they used to be.

It's not rocket science. They just manage the herd by region and the public is either smart enough to see the bigger picture or not.

Imagine buying a tag and not seeing a deer to shoot. How great is the opportunity then?

 

[EYJONAS!]

I grew up there til I was 14. ND Game and Fish does a hell of a job with deer management. When I was a kid, numbers were way up. You could draw a buck tag almost every year. Bad winterkill and disease hit and numbers dropped drastically. They recognized this immediately and adjusted for it. Numbers are coming back slowly but still not what they used to be.

It's not rocket science. They just manage the herd by region and the public is either smart enough to see the bigger picture or not.

Imagine buying a tag and not seeing a deer to shoot. How great is the opportunity then?

Well isn't that just a novel idea. Thank you for the back story.