Montana FWP pheasant scam

[BuzzH]

Special funding program for the State prison at a cool million a year....nice work GG! Director Hank is living up to his reputation of a right proper lap dog.

Montana hunters: Pheasant stocking hurts youth and birds

Against the will of many Montana hunters, the 2021 Legislature passed House Bill 637, a hodgepodge of items proposed by the FWP Directors Office, that included spending about $1 million on a pheasant stocking program.

missoulacurrent.com

 

[rogerthat]

 

[RobertD]

Writer didn't hold back. Good read.

All those pen birds do is feed coyotes. Anyone with even an ounce of sense knows that.

 

[rogerthat]

Not quite enough info in the article but it appears the cost per bird could be pretty hefty. Expensive coyote bait.

 

[CPAjeff]

Yikes - MT is sound more like UT by the day!

UT has been doing this type of “release” for years and, obviously, it’s an epic failure!!

 

[rogerthat]

Yikes - MT is sound more like UT by the day!

UT has been doing this type of “release” for years and, obviously, it’s an epic failure!!

Honestly the script is flipping. Utah is starting to put in place some common sense reforms and laws. Montana is going the other way. Montards!! I think I’m coining that

 

[406dn]

Yeah, this is a total waste of money and effort.

Also, having novice hunters shooting at poor flying birds is a bad recipe.

Many years ago now, I volunteered to participate in a youth pheasant hunt put on by the local Pheasant's Forever chapter. Never again. Most of the birds could not get more that a few feet off the ground. Most of the shots the young hunters were offered were not safe. But a young hunter hoping to kill their first bird...many of those shots were taken. It was a small miracle no one got shot. I know my dog nearly was.

Recruiting new hunters is a challenge. I think a better way is to do what was done a while ago. That is to push the opening date for non resident pheasant hunters to one week after the opener for residents. That would reduce the crowds considerably in the better pheasant areas. That would allow a father and son, uncle and niece, whoever, to get a first crack at wild birds that are as easy as they ever will be.

 

[Southern Elk]

Nothing sporting about hunting kick and shoot birds.

 

[rogerthat]

How about we let the little crappers do it the hard way? In my opinion making it easy for kids gives them false expectations which is more negative than positive. Is there any proof all these “kiddie subsidies” in hunting actually convert life long hunters?

 

[woods89]

I grew up hunting wild birds in western KS. This seems like a really bad and distasteful idea.

 

[JLS]

Just like trout ponds…

 

[rwc101]

Shot pen raised birds a friend bought to "train" his GSP. Really just putting them out of their misery.

 

[MTTW]

The one thing MTFWP has figured out is how to raise predators.

 

[OntarioHunter]

Hank Worst-tech is full of crap when he says there's no proof this will fail. Talk to any management person in any state where they have had programs for put and take pheasant stocking. 80% of the birds are dead within two weeks even if the season isn't open. So states like Iowa don't dump the birds out till the night before season opens. And hunters' dogs catch more of them than are shot.

Half of the Bedoin Refuge in Malta doesn't open till the first week in December and it's exclusively for kids the first couple of days. Several years I have hung around to hunt it (I'm often not back here till just after Thanksgiving). I don't see any activity at all on that half. Back in the days before the GOP did away with the sign in book, it was easy to tell there were no hunters on that end ... or anywhere else on the refuge. I don't stay that long any more. Not since refuge management totally destroyed the habitat on that end.

This is simply a way for the state to grab federal money to pay for Montana's prison system. I see no merit in training prisoners how to raise pheasants. It's not a viable vocation on the outside. Wasting their time and taxpayers' money. A lose lose situation all the way around.

 

[Gellar]

Good plan, poor execution.

Having worked with prisoners in a work release program before I will say many inmates are very skilled and passionate about their job or task they are given. The programs like this give the prisoners something to look forward to and they often find new passions that keep them out of jail after release. They are likely not getting more than a few dollars per day, that goes to their restitution for the work they do.

I also put on a youth pheasant hunt every year, using pen raised pheasants. The first couple of years volunteers would plant the birds a few hours before the hunters and dogs would arrive. Often times the birds would be within a few feet of where they were planted. Just like in the article they would not fly. I have never witnessed a ground sluicing by the kids, but the pheasant would at times fly very low making it unsafe for the dog and handlers. We began using pheasant launchers, basically a spring loaded sling that catapults the pheasant upward into the air much more realistically of a wild pheasant. The hunter, mentor, and dog walk through the field and come to launcher. The dog goes on point and the bird is released. If the kids weren’t told before hand what was going to happen they probably would not know the pheasant was in a launcher and catapulted into flight.

Without using pen raised birds we could not guarantee the kids would see a pheasant, let alone get a shot at a bird. And the reality of any pen raised bird whether it’s a pheasant, turkey, chicken or what not is their plumage is not going to be as pretty as a wild bird.

The kids realize they are shooting pen raised birds, and I have never had one kid complain that they are. In fact, it’s the opposite they are ecstatic that they have been given the opportunity to work with a well trained dog and a mentor.

 

[texwest44]

We began using pheasant launchers, basically a spring loaded sling that catapults the pheasant upward into the air

PULL!!

 

[BAKPAKR]

West Virginia just released 12,000 bobwhite quail. They probably won’t be here next year but I sure would like to be able to hear them.

 

[BuzzH]

Good plan, poor execution.

Having worked with prisoners in a work release program before I will say many inmates are very skilled and passionate about their job or task they are given. The programs like this give the prisoners something to look forward to and they often find new passions that keep them out of jail after release. They are likely not getting more than a few dollars per day, that goes to their restitution for the work they do.

I also put on a youth pheasant hunt every year, using pen raised pheasants. The first couple of years volunteers would plant the birds a few hours before the hunters and dogs would arrive. Often times the birds would be within a few feet of where they were planted. Just like in the article they would not fly. I have never witnessed a ground sluicing by the kids, but the pheasant would at times fly very low making it unsafe for the dog and handlers. We began using pheasant launchers, basically a spring loaded sling that catapults the pheasant upward into the air much more realistically of a wild pheasant. The hunter, mentor, and dog walk through the field and come to launcher. The dog goes on point and the bird is released. If the kids weren’t told before hand what was going to happen they probably would not know the pheasant was in a launcher and catapulted into flight.

Without using pen raised birds we could not guarantee the kids would see a pheasant, let alone get a shot at a bird. And the reality of any pen raised bird whether it’s a pheasant, turkey, chicken or what not is their plumage is not going to be as pretty as a wild bird.

The kids realize they are shooting pen raised birds, and I have never had one kid complain that they are. In fact, it’s the opposite they are ecstatic that they have been given the opportunity to work with a well trained dog and a mentor.

Funding prisons shouldn't come from sportsmen's dollars...that's absurd and I don't care how much "good" it does for inmates.

They can make license plates and bake cookies on general fund money.

How anyone could think catapulted birds is ok is another real head scratcher.

Why not just a clay pigeon at that point? Catapult a packaged tyson chicken for that matter. Way cheaper and no plucking required.

We wonder why hunting is tanking?

 

[OntarioHunter]

Good plan, poor execution.

Having worked with prisoners in a work release program before I will say many inmates are very skilled and passionate about their job or task they are given. The programs like this give the prisoners something to look forward to and they often find new passions that keep them out of jail after release. They are likely not getting more than a few dollars per day, that goes to their restitution for the work they do.

I also put on a youth pheasant hunt every year, using pen raised pheasants. The first couple of years volunteers would plant the birds a few hours before the hunters and dogs would arrive. Often times the birds would be within a few feet of where they were planted. Just like in the article they would not fly. I have never witnessed a ground sluicing by the kids, but the pheasant would at times fly very low making it unsafe for the dog and handlers. We began using pheasant launchers, basically a spring loaded sling that catapults the pheasant upward into the air much more realistically of a wild pheasant. The hunter, mentor, and dog walk through the field and come to launcher. The dog goes on point and the bird is released. If the kids weren’t told before hand what was going to happen they probably would not know the pheasant was in a launcher and catapulted into flight.

Without using pen raised birds we could not guarantee the kids would see a pheasant, let alone get a shot at a bird. And the reality of any pen raised bird whether it’s a pheasant, turkey, chicken or what not is their plumage is not going to be as pretty as a wild bird.

The kids realize they are shooting pen raised birds, and I have never had one kid complain that they are. In fact, it’s the opposite they are ecstatic that they have been given the opportunity to work with a well trained dog and a mentor.

Launching pheasants for kids to shoot? Really? Why not put a hotdog stand out there for them too. Better make sure there's data available for their games.

Prisoners can be a lot more passionate about their work if they know it's not stupid useless make work bullshit. Just as well have them making license plates or postal bags. Lots of jobs for that on the outside after they are paroled. Pffft!

One of the better programs at Deer Lodge is horsehair weaving. Those guys make fabulous tack and horse accessories and the stuff goes for very high prices. Not sure it's something that easily translates into a civilian job but they are learning to make a hands on craft pay ... and pay well. That can be translated to anything from plumbing to carpentry.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Without using pen raised birds we could not guarantee the kids would see a pheasant

Is that a problem?

I’m struggling with the idea of guaranteeing success? Doesn’t this set the precedent that a “successful” hunt is one where you get something.

Kinda dovetails with the bizzare, my opinion, of reserving premium tags for kids in some states.

To a 10 year old- “Welcome to hunting, it’s all about killing shit, and the best things to kill have huge racks. All other aspects are unimportant.”

Personally, I enjoy wandering around the mountains with a super low shot to day ratio, some folks like feeder hunting in Texas… to each their own.