Montana draw

[ErictheRed]

Looks like several people are having a hard time understanding that the people who got booted out of the draw actually did nothing wrong.

Reminds me of the last national election….

 

[EYJONAS!]

It's the closest they could get to unlimited elk tags in the areas they were proposing in December...... it ain't rocket science.

 

[Nameless Range]

I will be interested to hear exactly how this happened.

I believe the ARM that allows The Director to allocate up to 10% of the quota in additional tags says that the error must be due to a third-party.

A third-party is a person or entity besides the two primarily involved in a situation. In this case, I would think FWP, its staff, and the public could not be considered third-party. I'm not a lawyer though.

If this has occurred via an honest mistake, being unintentional, whether it is through poor testing, a discrepancy between test and production environments, or a mistake in the code, as bad as it is, I think it is worth noting that of all the things our FWP has done over the last year and a half, this doesn't even break the top ten in terms of being the most damaging to the future of hunting in this state.

 

[BuzzH]

IMO, there is no way one person should have the authority to increase quota's by up to 10%.

Wyoming has a license review board, made up of several people.

 

[hearteater]

Is it just me or are Montana resident hunters the most passive, least influential group of resident hunters when it comes to their state managing wildlife and draws? It’s one thing to screw nonresidents but to watch yourself get screwed over and over seems almost masochistic.

 

[LukeDuke]

Only those who applied incorrectly are eligible for the redraw.

Yeah that was how I understood the email. My wife, who didn’t draw, asked me on the way home from church tonight, if this means she will now get a LE permit…I said, I don’t think so because we filled out your original application correctly. She didn’t swear, but I could tell she wanted to…lol.

 

[DFS]

I will be interested to here exactly how this happened.

I believe the ARM that allows The Director to allocate up to 10% of the quota in additional tags says that the error must be due to a third-party.

A third-party is a person or entity besides the two primarily involved in a situation. In this case, I would think FWP, its staff, and the public could not be considered third-party. I'm not a lawyer though.

If this has occurred via an honest mistake, being unintentional, whether it is through poor testing, a discrepancy between test and production environments, or a mistake in the code, as bad as it is, I think it is worth noting that of all the things our FWP has done over the last year and a half, this doesn't even break the top ten in terms of being the most damaging to the future of hunting in this state.

Anybody that watched the commission meeting could see the districts in question and it’s funny the districts in question got railroaded. Imo not an accident. I wish Hank well but he can’t handle the job.

 

[TheTone]

Have a director that used to be chief of licenses, pushes for all sorts of simplification to the regs, draw is apparently a complete mess and the solution sounds even worse. Just wow!

 

[Wildabeest]

She didn’t swear, but I could tell she wanted to…lol.

She must have read the “Why we can’t have nice things” thread!

 

[MTHunter1321]

I will be interested to hear exactly how this happened.

I believe the ARM that allows The Director to allocate up to 10% of the quota in additional tags says that the error must be due to a third-party.

A third-party is a person or entity besides the two primarily involved in a situation. In this case, I would think FWP, its staff, and the public could not be considered third-party. I'm not a lawyer though.

If this has occurred via an honest mistake, being unintentional, whether it is through poor testing, a discrepancy between test and production environments, or a mistake in the code, as bad as it is, I think it is worth noting that of all the things our FWP has done over the last year and a half, this doesn't even break the top ten in terms of being the most damaging to the future of hunting in this state.

I spoke to Hank on the phone tonight. According to him this is what happened….the “system” that was used during the application period is the “old system” which incorrectly allowed people to apply for more than one choice if they applied for a “first choice only” permit as their first choice. After the app period closed 4/1, and before the draw, they switched everything over to the “new system.” The new system could ID people who applied for more than one choice when they shouldn’t have and kicked them out of the draw. So basically FWP had people apply on one system and then had a more advanced system do the draw. I asked why they do that and not just either upgrade systems before the app period opened or stick with the “old” system for the whole draw process and he couldn’t really give an answer. So I think if pressed, that’s how he’s going to blame it on a “third” party.

Complete and utter failure of leadership and decision making.

 

[LukeDuke]

She must have read the “Why we can’t have nice things” thread!

My wife wouldn’t say “$h!t” if she had a mouth full of it, but when it comes to hunting, she gets a little worked up. Love that woman

 

[brockel]

Is it just me or are Montana resident hunters the most passive, least influential group of resident hunters when it comes to their state managing wildlife and draws? It’s one thing to screw nonresidents but to watch yourself get screwed over and over seems almost masochistic.

At first it hurt but I’ve become numb now

 

[NDGuy]

MT Gurus. Under the new rules, what will happen to my brother in this situation:

Last year he applied for Deer Combo with 1 point and was unsuccessful. He did not apply this year and was planning on just buying a point this summer to enter the draw next year with 2 points. Did he lose his 1 point by not applying this year? I could see both ways but I read this as he needs to skip applying in consecutive years to lose the points.

 

[MTHunter1321]

MT Gurus. Under the new rules, what will happen to my brother in this situation:

Last year he applied for Deer Combo with 1 point and was unsuccessful. He did not apply this year and was planning on just buying a point this summer to enter the draw next year with 2 points. Did he lose his 1 point by not applying this year? I could see both ways but I read this as he needs to skip applying in consecutive years to lose the points.

I don’t think so. If he doesn’t apply next year then he would lose his points

 

[DFS]

I spoke to Hank on the phone tonight. According to him this is what happened….the “system” that was used during the application period is the “old system” which incorrectly allowed people to apply for more than one choice if they applied for a “first choice only” permit as their first choice. After the app period closed 4/1, and before the draw, they switched everything over to the “new system.” The new system could ID people who applied for more than one choice when they shouldn’t have and kicked them out of the draw. So basically FWP had people apply on one system and then had a more advanced system do the draw. I asked why they do that and not just either upgrade systems before the app period opened or stick with the “old” system for the whole draw process and he couldn’t really give an answer. So I think if pressed, that’s how he’s going to blame it on a “third” party.

Complete and utter failure of leadership and decision making.

I’ve talked to Hank as well he is a straight politician he will lie straight to your face. Tell you exactly how he will make things better. Here we are. He had to do something, nothing else worked. Here we are.

 

[The Hedgehog]

Simplification

 

[tjones]

Apps were not filled out 'incorrectly' according to the rules printed in the regs book. In general, people are not dumb. If the blame was all on the applicant FWP would not be acknowledging all of this.

Actually dumb is the correct word.

FWP fielded 30,000 calls last year from hunters struggling with the difference between permits and licenses.

 

[Deleted member 16014]

I am legitimately sorry for you all but this has been fairly entertaining, in the train wreck sense.

 

[Trap]

They shouldn’t re draw applicants who didn’t apply correctly. They should have been booted out of the system. I jumped to the end of the thread but that’s what it sounds like they are doing?

 

[all ears]

Beating the horse again...they did apply correctly according to how the regs are written. Period. The applicants did nothing wrong. They are not whining because they didn't get a permit, they're upset they're application was thrown out of the draw for no valid reason. I need to be done.