Losses at the Forest Service

[El Jason]

Fair point. We had copies of the contract a few weeks ago, but they have not been executed by anyone. That certainly leaves folks who replied "resign" and were subsequently terminated before executing the contract in a pickle. Clown show.

I’ll be shocked if the courts don’t find in favor of the employees.

 

[Hunting Wife]

I’ll be shocked if the courts don’t find in favor of the employees.

At least DOJ has been gutted so I doubt they’ll have the cream of the crop defending the suit.

 

[TheTone]

I’m not so sure that anything involving signing this “contract” is black and white. One could argue they signed under duress, and I have a feeling this will be tied up in court until the cows come home.

can we take the money that is going to be used in all the litigation and payouts directly out of Trump’s executive budget and elons company contracts?

 

[jmcd]

Please share your experiences with this.

I’ve seen it all my life in private industry. Have a SO who deals with it and several friends that have left unions or union jobs entirely because of the cronyism….. I could go on and on, but it is beside the point of this thread.
Simply put I think the fear is that many if not all of those who got let go, are the ones who actually are boots on the ground doing the work that benefits us as hunters the most.
I guess I’m glad that I started packing chainsaws on my horses and 4-wheelers years ago and I’m already used to it. I’m gonna be pissed though when the shitters out in the woods are out of toilet paper…….
noxious weeds, absolutely exploding all over are my biggest fear in this

 

[Bonasababy]

You know that 3 astronauts died on an Apollo 1 test flight, right?
But yeah, let the PISSED American taxpayer get in this vehicle and light the candle.

I figure it will take 10-15 days for the phone calls to move through the political apparatus. Already calls from Farmers to reaching Congress complaining that USAID bought their goods and they have some questions. I'm sure they will be compensated, again, and you all will never hear about it because you choose not to.

Several million dollars of grain involved now reneged on..
with farmers from my state.

 

[Nick87]

I’ve seen it all my life in private industry. Have a SO who deals with it and several friends that have left unions or union jobs entirely because of the cronyism…

That's interesting, I've seen quite the opposite on the private side. No experience with public sector. I've never seen a single person leave for a non union position. I've seen an awful lot of them go the other way though. Never seen the union protect anyone who is a lazy slob either. I have seen them defend the rights of all workers the same for all of them. Cronsyism is alive and well everywhere. For example friends or family of business owners or business associates etc etc. Unions I'm engaged with are all looking to get the best pay and benefits they can for there members, you don't get that by supporting the non productive workers, you get that by promoting the hardest working and most skilled members. Ymmv.

 

[LopeHunter]

In past 30 days, Federal employee headcount down, price of eggs up, war still going. A fine start to my retirement. A bit of chaos is just what my doc ordered.

 

[Bonasababy]

In past 30 days, Federal employee headcount down, price of eggs up, war still going. A fine start to my retirement. A bit of chaos is just what my doc ordered.

Do what we did...insure you have a good hedge position in bonds.
..

 

[brownbear932008]

No one has signed the contract. They haven’t come out yet.

That was my thought to my knowledge only email responses opting in have really occurred at this point.

 

[Bullshot]

I took a lap around the rocky mountains last sept. From the great plains, to CO westslope, up through the parks, to MT, and back to the great plains.

I drove by a lot of FS camp grounds. Almost everyone had the gates closed, and signs up:

"Campground Closed"


I thought that odd during hunting season.

I am concerned about what this means for our public lands and the often very dedicated people who protect and maintain them, but have definitely been reflecting on the past 27 years of western hunting on national forest and BLM land and the fact that other than in a visitor center or headquarters, I have had low single-digits of personal interactions IN TOTAL with any FS or BLM employee in the field, and never with any that are away from a vehicle.

One LE tapped on my window to check me out while I was sleeping in CO in 1998.

Same year, 1998, a very helpful FS worker stopped and helped me with a piece of radiator hose in northern CO when I broke down.

I honestly cant recall any other specifics but will presume there HAD to be some… right?

I have literally never even seen a FS employee on a trail, off a trail, while hunting or fishing, nor while at any camp. In any given year, I have barely have seen any staff even while driving the roads.

To be fair, I have also NEVER been checked by a State GW while in the field in the west, only ONCE at a highway checkpoint in WY. Although I did share a coffee and good discussion with an off duty WY GW who was camping at a campground in Unit 7. He warned me about staying Fri/Sat and likelihood of some local methheads using the campgrounds on the weekend, which I appreciated. LOL.

Thats…. over….27… years…. (week or ten days at a time). WY, CO, ID

 

[BuzzH]

I know. That’s my point.

Well, maybe you should work for the .gov and try to negotiate that.

Probationary employees in both the private and public sector, either represented by a Union in either case, are S.O.L. if management decides to can them. Well, technically you can argue as a fed employee in front of an MSPB judge, which I did successfully for a probationary employee who was reinstated with a large cash settlement, backpay, and interest.

There are lines in the sand that Management won't negotiate on, having the ability to let an employee go on a probationary period is one those. For the record, I happen to agree with that as a Union President. Sometimes an employee is not a good fit for a position for all kinds of legitimate reasons.

But, what is going on here is wayyyy past what the intention of a probationary period was meant to be.

Its a horseshit play because the administration knows there isn't much that anyone can do about it.

Blaming this on Unions is nonsense.

 

[Treeshark]

Blaming this on Unions is nonsense.

Has the union considered going on strike?

 

[BuzzH]

Has the union considered going on strike?

WTF?

We have this letter on the wall at the national headquarters in D.C. I know a few people that should read it...just sayin'.

Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service | The American Presidency Project

www.presidency.ucsb.edu

 

[BuzzH]

lol so you can’t even strike?!

Federal unions are super dumb.

Try reading the letter, and no they're not.

You continue to show your ignorance, no shock.

 

[Treeshark]

Try reading the letter, and no they're not.

You continue to show your ignorance, no shock.

I liked that letter.

“All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service.”

So they can’t strike and can’t protect the most vulnerable employees. What purpose do they serve?

 

[BuzzH]

I liked that letter.

“All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service.”

So they can’t strike and can’t protect the most vulnerable employees. What purpose do they serve?

You should try some comprehension...

Collective bargaining happens every 4-6 years.

You should stick to things you might actually know, like perch fishing in WI.

 

[Treeshark]

Unable to strike + unable to protect the most vulnerable employees= very low leverage.

What benefit do they really even serve at that point?

 

[BuzzH]

Unable to strike + unable to protect the most vulnerable employees= low leverage.

There isn't a union on the planet that can protect probationary period employees unless they are let go for EEOC and can prove it. Which I did successfully and is very rare.

Again read the letter and try to pay attention. I can break out the crayons if you still can't comprehend.

I'll even type slower so you can keep up.

 

[ismith]

I liked that letter.

“All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service.”

So they can’t strike and can’t protect the most vulnerable employees. What purpose do they serve?

Turkeys at Thanksgiving mostly at my first Federal job. Occasionally they would have to advocate for someone who was getting a raw deal. Funny thing was most of the supervisors were former union reps and were mostly responsible for handing out the raw deals. At my second one, we barely heard a peep from them, other than to tell us they agreed with firing employees who didn't get the clot shot. So, other than the in boarding spiel, I really never talked to the union.

 

[BuzzH]

Turkeys at Thanksgiving mostly at my first Federal job. Occasionally they would have to advocate for someone who was getting a raw deal. Funny thing was most of the supervisors were former union reps and were mostly responsible for handing out the raw deals. At my second one, we barely heard a peep from them, other than to tell us they agreed with firing employees who didn't get the clot shot. So, other than the in boarding spiel, I really never talked to the union.

What were the locals and how much did you pay for dues?