Kenetrek Boots

Long Range Hunting

ElkStalker said:
I assume the method he failed at was harder than the method he didn't fail at.

I know you want to tell me how hard it is to take long shots. So, go ahead and knock yourself out. However, just know I do both. I have a buddy who has a huge ranch. I keep the coyotes off it for him. I take long shots doing it but I never considered it hunting. It's just killing.
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You assume quite a bit I've noticed. mtmuley
 
ElkStalker said:
Do you mean he sucked at getting close, so he took the easy way out instead of trying to get close again?
Click to expand...

So every one who has ever had a blown stalk sucks as a hunter?

Fir example, the hunter’s dial got bumped and they shot over its back at 60 yards. The animal runs and stops at 450. The hunter realizes the dial was bumped and makes the correction. Shoots and takes off the top of the heart, animal goes 30’ and dies. What a sucky hunter.....
 
Aren't there two things involved here?
1. how proficient the shooter is at executing the shot
2. how much time occurs between the decision to take the shot and impact.

You can practice all you want, but the longer that bullet is in flight the more risk that the critter will move/shift/twitch/whatever. Or you can have the perfect, close, broadside shot but if you don't know how to squeeze the trigger/hold steady/breath/etc then it doesn't matter how perfect the scenario is.

There's tons of other multiplying factors that might be effecting both of those primary components, which is where the decision making, applying those multipliers to come up with a shoot/don't shoot equation, of the shooter comes into play.
 
JeffJ said:
The caveat on that is that a rifle shot travels faster than the speed of sound, and will reach the target faster than the noise. Not the case with a bow. You also have movement from releasing the arrow that the animal may be reacting to.
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.2 seconds, I'm more interested in the reaction time of a deer. Maybe they see the muzzle flash from 200 yards away and duck your bullet? Not likely, but you never know. What I'm saying is that animals do their thing and you can't predict movement. If a deer is bedded down 1000 yards away, it likely won't go anywhere. It has 1.5 seconds from the time the bullet leaves the barrel to get up. You can predict what an animal is going to do when they're laying/standing there if you've spent any time watching them. You'd be less likely to have an animal mess up your shot from 1000 yards on a bedded animal than 20 yards away with a bow looking at you.

@ElkStalker easy now... I've seen a question, and a statement from mtmuley. No assumptions...
 
I don’t take any shots that most people would call long range. The longest shot I ever took was probably a little under 300 yards with a 300 sav. topped with a 4 power Tasco scope. That was just because my buddy bet me I couldn’t hit that deer. That was real long range for me. My focus in hunting has always been in the development of skills that allow me to get close to and kill animals. Long range shooting is a skill one could perfect for hunting I guess but just not one I ever cared to work on. What disappoints me about the sport of hunting in general is that as time goes by the need to develop hunting skill is being replaced by the ability to buy and use technology. Long range shooting now days is all about the technology. No need to learn how to judge distance and Kentucky windage is long lost skill. Your gear takes care of all that for you. Just take your readings and dial in your scope. I will never criticize anyone for taking long range shots as long as they are good at it but it just aint my cup of tea.
 
Here's how I see it. You could take a good target shooter and put him on a ridge. Let's say he never hunted in his life. There's an elk at 500yds and you tell him to shoot it. Because he has experience shooting at that distance at targets. He takes the shot and kills the elk. Does that now make him a good hunter? Does it make him a hunter at all?

Now, let's take the same guy and tell him to go in the timber and kill an elk. He can't take a shot over 50 yds which should be easy for him. Would he kill an elk? Would it be harder or easier than the long shot he took?

We all have our opinion on what makes a good hunter. I don't think it really matters what you think. Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

These kind of threads are never good for a forum. They won't solve anything and i'm surprised I posted in it. I should know better.
 
rjthehunter said:
.2 seconds, I'm more interested in the reaction time of a deer. Maybe they see the muzzle flash from 200 yards away and duck your bullet? Not likely, but you never know. What I'm saying is that animals do their thing and you can't predict movement. If a deer is bedded down 1000 yards away, it likely won't go anywhere. It has 1.5 seconds from the time the bullet leaves the barrel to get up. You can predict what an animal is going to do when they're laying/standing there if you've spent any time watching them. You'd be less likely to have an animal mess up your shot from 1000 yards on a bedded animal than 20 yards away with a bow looking at you.

@ElkStalker easy now... I've seen a question, and a statement from mtmuley. No assumptions...
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I agree, was just pointing out that equating jumping the string on a bow to a long distance rifle shot was kind of a poor analogy.
 
Anyone can point a range finder at a deer and then twist a turret to account for the range. The difficult part in making the first shot count at extended ranges is accounting for wind. You can measure wind at the shooter, but can only judge wind at the animal. If shooting across a canyon, you will have no idea what the wind is doing 1/2 way to the animal, and at 700 yards it doesn’t take much unaccounted for wind to turn a kill shot into a gut shot. If someone has the skills and self restraint to know when to not take a long shot, then I dont think it is unethical for them to take an 700 yard shot. What makes me cringe about the long range hunting trend is that the message seems to be: buy this rifle, this scope, this bullet, put it all together and you are now a sniper. Just go to a public range and watch others try and shoot targets at 600 yards and you’ll see why this trend is worrisome.
 
Pelican said:
Anyone can point a range finder at a deer and then twist a turret to account for the range. The difficult part in making the first shot count at extended ranges is accounting for wind. You can measure wind at the shooter, but can only judge wind at the animal. If shooting across a canyon, you will have no idea what the wind is doing 1/2 way to the animal, and at 700 yards it doesn’t take much unaccounted for wind to turn a kill shot into a gut shot. If someone has the skills and self restraint to know when to not take a long shot, then I dont think it is unethical for them to take an 700 yard shot. What makes me cringe about the long range hunting trend is that the message seems to be: buy this rifle, this scope, this bullet, put it all together and you are now a sniper. Just go to a public range and watch others try and shoot targets at 600 yards and you’ll see why this trend is worrisome.
Click to expand...
You can look across a canyon and tell what the wind is doing half way across... Using a higher magnification spotter or scope you can look at mirage or nearby vegetation. The mirage method is good up to about 10 mph but beyond that isn't as useful. However, winds over 10mph tend to be more consistent than winds under 10. Heavier bullets make a difference too. Wind has little affect on my .338 WM as compared to a .243. This makes it possible for wind calls to be less precise. Being newer to long range shooting, I went through learning these things and in all honesty, if you can shoot well, you can learn to shoot long range. It doesn't take a sniper to shoot 1000 yards. Beyond that is more in what sets snipers apart from civilians.
 
Maximum range for me is a constant changing variable.

At the time of the shot or planning the shot all the factors include:

wind/weather
Shooting position
Equipment
Lighting
How I am doing (fatigue and so on)
What the animal is doing

one factor that doesn’t come to mind in there is what the people on the internet are going to think...
 
BcGunworks said:
Maximum range for me is a constant changing variable.

At the time of the shot or planning the shot all the factors include:

wind/weather
Shooting position
Equipment
Lighting
How I am doing (fatigue and so on)
What the animal is doing

one factor that doesn’t come to mind in there is what the people on the internet are going to think...
Click to expand...
I think that list is pretty typical of most people. I also just have my smell test, it the situation doesn't feel right it's not happening, even if all the other factors say it's a go.
 
Addicting said:
What if you were close, blew the stalk, but then shot and killed it at “long range”. Is that more more ethical seeing you let it evade you the first time?
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Or, what if I baited it, but then shooed it away and then shot it at 900y?

What is "right/ethical/fair" varies hunter to hunter, state to state, species to species. I have no strong opinion about the "right" answer in this particular case. But I also don't think, "to each their own" at all reflects the current rules/regs of hunting on a wide variety of topics so why would it necessarily be the case in this instance?
 
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