Is technology hurting the hunting industry?

[yotestalker]

I've been following your forum for a couple months and for the most part I'm liking what I'm reading. I would like to get your opinions on technology in hunting and how it's affecting us as hunters.
Each year new products emerge that help us see further, shoot further, remain undetected, and do it all in adverse conditions. As a hunter using these products can really help your advantage however is this all at a cost?
I like gear as much as anybody, but as technology increases is it leading us to a point where even an inexperienced hunter has an unfair advantage? A guy that has no business shooting 1000 yrds can buy a rifle ready to shoot that far out of the box. I know it isn't ethical for an inexperienced shooter to do this, but they do.
On the other hand gear sales and the hype around new technology help keep the industry alive, which we really need. But looking at the big picture are these advancements good or bad for the industry?

 

[mdunc8]

It's only just begun. Give it a few more years.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...sts-make-invisibility-cloak-breakthrough.html

 

[CabinFever]

I think its pretty sweet to be able to shoot accurately at such long distances, however I'm not personally into it. I definitely don't have as much respect for someone who calls themself a hunter but only kills animals on long range shots. I questions weather shooting an animal from over 500 yards, let alone over a half mile, involves much chase or pursuit, which I would consider to be an integral part of how I define hunting. It was staggering to see how many booths advertised 1000 yard out of the box rifles at the various shows and expos I was at this year. I was mildly disappointed to see how many people were interested in them.

There's many other aspects of technology to discuss, but it all has to be compared to how each person defines "hunting." This could be an interesting thread of people dive into it.

 

[Hooligan]

The old addage of 'just because you "can", don't mean you should'

A few years back, we had a small group of cows 200 yds up a ridge from us, and could hear the bullets wizzing over head (followed by the report of the rifle) from some jack hole trying to shoot 800+ yards across the canyon. A little less holdover and I shudder to thin what could have happened.

I havent rifle hunted much since. Sticks and strings are more fun anyhow.

 

[belly-deep]

A guy that has no business shooting 1000 yrds can buy a rifle ready to shoot that far out of the box.

There's a lot more to hitting something at 1000 yards than going out and buying the rifle.

I don't think all these "advancements" do much damage to game populations in the aggregate, in fact the best hunters I know use few of them and the worst use a ton of them.

Guess who still fills their tags every year? There are some things you just can't buy.

 

[belly-deep]

The old addage of 'just because you "can", don't mean you should'

A few years back, we had a small group of cows 200 yds up a ridge from us, and could hear the bullets wizzing over head (followed by the report of the rifle) from some jack hole trying to shoot 800+ yards across the canyon. A little less holdover and I shudder to thin what could have happened.

I havent rifle hunted much since. Sticks and strings are more fun anyhow.

Just so you know, "sticks and strings" aren't immune to yay-hoos lobbing projectiles from beyond ethical ranges either.

 

[yotestalker]

Guess who still fills their tags every year? There are some things you just can't buy.

I agree with that. There's a lot of yahoos out there.

But if we're just talking about skilled hunters. I've seen a lot of hunters become very proficient at killing trophy animals at long ranges. Mostly due to the fact that you can buy a range finder and a scope that will allow you to shoot out to 500 or 700 yrds very acurately. Years ago you just couldn't do that.

 

[shoots-straight]

Technology is having an effect. There's far more filling there tags these days than the old 10% "good Hunters" I know an area we use to go and glass for bulls, then go after them. Now there's guys stationed with all that long range gear ready to shoot long range. I don't plan to join in the reindeer games. I'll go elsewhere, it's not that important. I like to hunt, not so much into shooting.

 

[belly-deep]

I've seen a lot of hunters become very proficient at killing trophy animals at long ranges. Mostly due to the fact that you can buy a range finder and a scope that will allow you to shoot out to 500 or 700 yrds very acurately. Years ago you just couldn't do that.

The usual result is that the hunter get so enamored with his new gun and hunting style, he avoids places where he can't use them. He'll post up on some point where he can see a ton of ground...without asking the threshold question of whether he should.

Out on the plains, its probably a pretty good gig. In the mountains, its a different story. Most guys wouldn't lug a 12lb rifle with a 56mm scope up the side of the Bitterroots. Nor would they care to track an elk all day in the lodgepole.

The snipers probably kill a few critters, or at least enough for them to be happy. A few of the snipers, like our own Breaksrunner, is as deadly as the plague. But most aren't. Most are not straying far from access points and are blasting the young bucks that are too stupid to hide.

Our critters have much bigger things to worry about than the dreaded sniper-hunter.

 

[devon deer]

I'm not qualified to comment on hunting in the US because i haven't experienced it yet.
But, technology can have its draw backs in the hunting world, it makes it too easy.
I have a rangefinder, only because over here in the country i hunt in its sometimes difficult to judge the distance accurately, my scope doesn't have ballistic turrets, i dont need them.
Over here we observe and stealthily stalk the deer, observing wind direction, obstacles, and perhaps other animals that could alert the deer to our presence.
That is what its all about in my opinion, outwitting the deer, getting in as close as you can, a humane shot, and respect for the animal, plus its great adrenalin pumping stuff.
The furthest i have shot a deer is 325 yards (this was in an enclosed deer fenced 300 acre farm, fence to keep deer out but they got in when a tree came down on the fence), i think i might be able to go to 400 bit it just isnt necessary over here so i won't do it.
The closest probably 20 yards.
I have no doubt there are guys out there who can shoot out to 1000+ yards, but they are the exception and in my view have lost sight of what hunting is all about, having said that the guys hunting other 2 legged quarry in a hot dusty country need a big pat on the back!
There is nothing worse than squeezing the trigger and seeing the animal hunch up, gut shot lost animal because it was shot from too far away, not because of a failing in technology, but a failing of the guy behind the trigger.
Cheers
Richard

 

[Ten Bears]

The ability to shoot an animal at 1000 yards, and the ability to humanely kill an animal at 1000 yards are 2 different things. I'm more the traditional style muzzlestuffer type or pistol hunting type anymore, although I still have my long range WIN MOD 70 in MAG (from pre '64 - heck that things 55 years old this year).

I once came across the reamins of 15+ dead elk through out a burn that had been shot from 900 yards across the canyon. There had been a shooting bench built across the canyon from were the elk came out to water at the spring. there were 2 shooting positions at the bench, and not all of the elk were salvaged before they spoiled.

Technology, slothful portrayal of hunters, and urban developement will be the end of hunting.

 

[belly-deep]

You guys are acting like people banging away out of their ethical range is something new.

Fact is, some people shouldn't be shooting over 100 yards. This has been going on for years; technology has not suddenly made it feasible.

Very few people can dope the wind past 400-500 yards. I don't think the critters are any less safe than they ever were.

 

[noharleyyet]

Long distance shooting, as portrayed on the infomercials disguised as hunting shows, serve the sole purpose of selling gadgetry....

CDS anyone?

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

I think this definately an issue that is detrimental to the image of hunting. I personally agree with everything stated above in reference to "long-range Hunting" being unethical and really doesn't qualify as hunting to me. I have always believed that as a community of hunters we should support all types of ETHICAL hunting whether or not we personally use the method (IE: crossbows, hunting with dogs, food plots, high-fence ranches, ATVs, ect), but I believe that we would be best served if this fad went away, as it really isn't hunting. I can't understand how the long range hunter could feel anymore sense of satisfaction in shooting an elk at 1000yds than if it had just been a target on a range.

I would say for the "Hunting Industry", which I would define as equipment manufacturers, it is quite a benefit. Every year when I head west I enjoy seeing a bunch of hunters outfitted (head to toe) in the year's newest gear go home empty handed. My guess would be that these guys never got more than 1 mile from a road, when they realize they can't buy their way up a mountain at cabelas. These hunters don't bother me too much as they rarely get a chance to shoot their 1000yd rifles at anything other than a coyote or prairie dog. I particularly enjoy walking past one of these hunters on my way back to the trailhead with a pack full of meat, and bafled, they ask where I found a (insert species here). Alot of the time the response I get back when I tell them, is one of defeat, because they know they don't have the motivation to do what it takes.

 

[2rocky]

There were Unethical hunters before the long range sniper rifle hunters, tv shows, and the internet. It is just that they weren't as visible.

Poor shot placement and judgement is as old as the caveman days. Just like new cars have better brakes and blind spot detection, but auto accident rates are the same as they were 30 years ago.

Technology creates as many problems as it solves, it is just a question of whether it is a better problem to have.

 

[huntRme]

There's a lot of talk here about long-range shooting with modern center-fire rifles, but I'd like to address the subject of long-range shooting with muzzle loaders. I don't know if what I see on the TV shows is rampant across the country, but it seems to me the purpose of a muzzle loader is to duplicate a primitive hunting situation. There is nothing primitive about using a scope and other contraptions that allow the user of a primitive rifle to shoot a three-inch group at 200 yards. That's not the purpose of a primitive weapon. I hope what I'm seeing on TV is just marketing by manufactures and not what real hunters are practicing in the field. A lot of these "improvements" in muzzle-loading technology aren't even legal in the state of Oregon because they defeat the purpose of a primitive weapon. Why a hunter would drag one of these new fangled muzzle-loaders into the field to shoot a buck on the other side of a food plot, instead of just using their regular deer rifle goes beyond my understanding.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

This is no different than some states that allow a crossbow during archery season. I don't do it, but I don't doubt that there are people shooting crossbows that can very humanely kill a deer. I don't do it but if it is legal, allows for an ethical kill, and is fair chase I cannot fault it.

I don't think 200yds with a scoped ML is unreasonable in the right conditions, and it isn't anyless fair chase than rifle hunting. If the complaint is that it is easier than hunting with a smoothbore/ball and patch/flintlock, and that violates the spirit of traditional weapon hunts, you are probably right, but it is still legal(unless regulated in your state), allows for ethical kill, and still allows for fair chase. Whether it is right or not will always be a matter of personal opinion, just like using a crossbow during archery season. Heck, their are probably traditional archers out there who think I am lazy for using a compound bow with a sight. Full-disclosure: my ML has no scope, but does use 209 primers.

My primary issue with 1000yd hunting is, most poeple have no business doing it because they don't have the skill or training to effectively judge the conditions to make an ethical shot, and that in my eyes the animal doesn't have a fighting chance.

 

[1_pointer]

My primary issue with 1000yd hunting is, most poeple have no business doing it because they don't have the skill or training to effectively judge the conditions to make an ethical shot, and that in my eyes the animal doesn't have a fighting chance.

At what distance do they? Or what technology allows them to retain that "fighting chance"? That's a slippery slope...

 

[1_pointer]

There were Unethical hunters before the long range sniper rifle hunters, tv shows, and the internet.

Yep. Technology is not to blame.

 

[JoseCuervo]

There is more to technology than just the ability to make long shots and the ethics/lack of ethics associated with it.

Each person hunts for their own reasons, and, the role technology/gadgets/crap plays in a hunt is unique to each person.

I used to wait for every Cabelas catalog to show up so I could buy something, hell, I even got that big fake-leather master catalog some years. Now, I haven't ordered shit from Cabelas in many years, and, I don't buy much "technology", unless you consider the great gear from Mystery Ranch to be "technology".

My own personal awakening was one morning while getting ready to go elk hunting realising how many friggin' lanyards I had wrapped around my neck. I figured I would likely be found hung from a tree by my GPS, 2-Way Radio, Range Finder, Binoculars and who knows what ever else was vital to my hunt.

I started getting rid of a bunch of the stuff around my neck and haven't missed any of it.

I do hunt with a guy who lives in a big city, urban environment and I think he buys all this crap from CAbelas, Midway, etc... as some sort of year-round connection to hunting since he really can't get out to the mountains, sending his credit card to Sydney, Nebraska meets that need for him. I laugh at all the crap he brings that has no value to improving his hunt.

I have seen him spook plenty of antelope at 150 yards while he tries to get his rangefinder on them, then extends the legs of his bipod, then adjust the turrets on his scope, then looks back at me and asks where the animal is.....