Inedible

[Sheltowee]

I had hit him in the high shoulder / spine in the first shot. He dropped and we gave him 20 min or so. When we walked up to him he tried getting up and I had to shoot him in the neck.

Took a couple quick photos and started breaking him down. From time of death to the first hind going into the snow, maybe 20-25 minutes.

Interesting. Could be a combination of the cortisol release, breaking him down/deboning him quickly and icing the meat? Or he might have just been a tough, rutty animal. One of the most tender animals I've ever eaten was a pronghorn buck that we had quartered and on ice-- but not deboned-- so quickly the meat fibers were still twitching.

 

[Laelkhunter]

Just wondering if you let it hang before processing to allow it to age a little. I had an elk that turned out really tough one year. The only difference was it was a late morning bull killed on the last day. We let it cool after quartering, then put it in ice chests that evening with ice and headed home. Everything was tough on that bull no matter how I cooked it. Even the roasts slow cooked in a crock pot were really hard to cut and chew. We usually let the bulls hang for a day or two before processing and other than that one time, they are really good.

edited to add: I was typing my reply while Sheltowee was replying. Same thought, he just beat me to it.

 

[Addicting]

That might be a reason for it. Good and warm and maybe still twitching when you cut it, into the shock of the cold snow. Does anything like that happen with elk in the snow?

It was still twitching, I’ve never had the opportunity to do it like this before. I’ve always hung them from a branch where the cooling was less dramatic.

 

[Addicting]

Interesting. Could be a combination of the cortisol release, breaking him down/deboning him quickly and icing the meat? Or he might have just been a tough, rutty animal. One of the most tender animals I've ever eaten was a pronghorn buck that we had quartered and on ice-- but not deboned-- so quickly the meat fibers were still twitching.

All my antelope get quartered immediately and then bagged to go into a waiting ice bath. I’ve never had an issue and the meat has always been fantastic. That surely cools faster than just laying it on the snow.

 

[Sheltowee]

To my very unscientific understanding, leaving the large cuts bone-in until they have progressed through rigor mortis gives the muscle fibers something to exert tension against and subsequently release tension following completion of the process. Without the tension, the muscle fibers just end up in an very tough, chewy ball.

I know there are some folks on here with some professional/skilled amateur butchering backgrounds. Hopefully they will chime in on this.

 

[Addicting]

Just wondering if you let it hang before processing to allow it to age a little. I had an elk that turned out really tough one year. The only difference was it was a late morning bull killed on the last day. We let it cool after quartering, then put it in ice chests that evening with ice and headed home. Everything was tough on that bull no matter how I cooked it. Even the roasts slow cooked in a crock pot were really hard to cut and chew. We usually let the bulls hang for a day or two before processing and other than that one time, they are really good.

edited to add: I was typing my reply while Sheltowee was replying. Same thought, he just beat me to it.

The bone in quarters spent 12 hours hanging after the snow. The next 48 hours in a cooler on ice. Then it got 24 hours hanging in dry cold storage before getting cut up and packaged.

 

[Sheltowee]

Just wondering if you let it hang before processing to allow it to age a little. I had an elk that turned out really tough one year. The only difference was it was a late morning bull killed on the last day. We let it cool after quartering, then put it in ice chests that evening with ice and headed home. Everything was tough on that bull no matter how I cooked it. Even the roasts slow cooked in a crock pot were really hard to cut and chew. We usually let the bulls hang for a day or two before processing and other than that one time, they are really good.

edited to add: I was typing my reply while Sheltowee was replying. Same thought, he just beat me to it.

Simple trick to making any cut of meat delicious: give it to some crazy ass Cajun that makes Coach O sound like he speaks the Queen's English.

 

[Laelkhunter]

We can make possum and armadillo that will melt in your mouth, but getting coach O to speak English-Never happen. GO TIGERS !!!!

 

[Forkyfinder]

Id be curious on more science of kills and such with tenderness, rigor mortis, and "cold shortening. I shot a cow, in late nov when it was brutally cold- and it turned out tough as hell. Ironically - i had the complete opposite for neat when i was worried about killing when it was "too" warm during archery.

Anyone know anything about timeline, reccomendation, etc? To be honest - theres not a ton of information about avoiding "cold shortening."

Id have done the same thing @Addicting (with the snow/meat) - but i wont now. Just not sure how long to wait or what temps would result in fast enough cooling to cause that.

 

[BOHNTR]

Nowadays, mule deer are entirely put into jerky. It just doesn’t compare, in my opinion, to whitetail, Coues, or elk as far as table fare.

 

[Nick87]

Coues

They eat pretty
Good?

 

[BOHNTR]

They eat pretty
Good?

Really good!

 

[WildWill]

Nowadays, mule deer are entirely put into jerky. It just doesn’t compare, in my opinion, to whitetail, Coues, or elk as far as table fare.

I've heard this from several people and it just hasn't been my experience. I've killed and eaten mule deer from WY, NM, CO, and OK and they've all been great. They've all also been 3 year olds or younger bucks about 50/50 killed during the rut. One day I'll find out about coues.



The worse venison I ever had was from a early season whitetail doe I killed next to the bighorn river in WY. Didn't appear to be a old animal, was healthy, and I took care of the meat quickly. Always assumed it had something to do with it's diet.

 

[44hunter45]

I had hit him in the high shoulder / spine in the first shot. He dropped and we gave him 20 min or so. When we walked up to him he tried getting up and I had to shoot him in the neck.

Took a couple quick photos and started breaking him down. From time of death to the first hind going into the snow, maybe 20-25 minutes.

I'm thinking this has more to do with his stress before he died. I had a WT I killed with my 44 Mag come out tough like this. My first shot went through both lungs and exited, but it was a pencil hole. I pushed him when I should have waited. Jumped him up two or three times over about a mile.

Finally found him down, but upright. He was trying to get up when I finished him.

 

[TOGIE]

Id be curious on more science of kills and such with tenderness, rigor mortis, and "cold shortening. I shot a cow, in late nov when it was brutally cold- and it turned out tough as hell. Ironically - i had the complete opposite for neat when i was worried about killing when it was "too" warm during archery.

Anyone know anything about timeline, reccomendation, etc? To be honest - theres not a ton of information about avoiding "cold shortening."

Id have done the same thing @Addicting (with the snow/meat) - but i wont now. Just not sure how long to wait or what temps would result in fast enough cooling to cause that.

i never listened to it but i think the meateater podcast had a specialist in this field on discussing the whole science of meat care some time ago.

i think it was meateater.

 

[Sheltowee]

i never listened to it but i think the meateater podcast had a specialist in this field on discussing the whole science of meat care some time ago.

i think it was meateater.

MeatEater Podcast ep. 227 "Red Cutter" and, just a couple of weeks ago, Hunt Backcountry Podcast Ep. 508 "A 'Meat Scientist' on Wild Game Care & Preparation." And our very own Uncle Randy had Hank Shaw on Episode 198 "Meat Care & Prep with Hank Shaw": https://hunttalkradio.com/2022/11/07/episode-198-meat-care-prep-with-hank-shaw/