Im bowing out

406dn said:
If this is meant objectively, as written, it is patently false.

For instance, I WANTED to be a major league baseball player. I worked at it from a young age. I was pretty good also. BUT, at the end, I lacked the necessary talent to make it to that level.

There are endless numbers of examples. I suspect there are a large number of people working their plan B, C or some less hoped for path in life.

I know that in the early 70's, while living at home, I paid for my college education without any debt. I bought a car and hunted often. All of it paid for with a part time job at a grocery store. There is not a kid alive that can pull that off as easily as I did
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Wow, anything to make a point. The reason you didn’t play baseball was because of you, not baseball. The point I was making was that you could be what you want professionally, but there will always be people that can’t cut it.

I had 2 sons that accomplished what you said they couldn’t, but it was because they made it happen and didn’t look for outside help.
 
shrapnel said:
Wow, anything to make a point. The reason you didn’t play baseball was because of you, not baseball. The point I was making was that you could be what you want professionally, but there will always be people that can’t cut it.

I had 2 sons that accomplished what you said they couldn’t, but it was because they made it happen and didn’t look for outside help.
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Alright now it's your turn to post some numbers then. Show me how anyone in the past 15-20 years paid for a college education without debt and owned a car off just a part-time job. Please give me details
 
shrapnel said:
Wow, anything to make a point. The reason you didn’t play baseball was because of you, not baseball. The point I was making was that you could be what you want professionally, but there will always be people that can’t cut it.

I had 2 sons that accomplished what you said they couldn’t, but it was because they made it happen and didn’t look for outside help.
Click to expand...

Well, duh. I said it was because of me. My level of talent was lacking, it was not my willingness, eagerness or effort that was lacking.

That hold trues for many people who might fall short of becoming a doctor, engineer, whatever. It is not as simple as you can be what you want.
 
churchcc12 said:
Alright now it's your turn to post some numbers then. Show me how anyone in the past 15-20 years paid for a college education without debt and owned a car off just a part-time job. Please give me details
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My wife….8 years of college. Paid for her own used car. Saved up enough to buy a house 6 months after she graduated. She worked at 5th 3rd bank and did an intership. Can be done if one wants it
 
churchcc12 said:
Alright now it's your turn to post some numbers then. Show me how anyone in the past 15-20 years paid for a college education without debt and owned a car off just a part-time job. Please give me details
Click to expand...
Both sons, one on a basketball scholarship the other worked 2 jobs and was married with 2 small children.

Oldest played 4 years of college basketball while studying civil engineering, graduating with a 3.85.

Younger son went back to school after a debilitating motorcycle wreck, graduating with a degree in criminal justice and a Spanish minor. Went through the Police academy his last semester of school, graduating both while maintaining a growing family and a mortgage.

Because you didn’t or don’t know someone that did, doesn’t mean it can’t still be done.
 
shrapnel said:
Both sons, one on a basketball scholarship the other worked 2 jobs and was married with 2 small children.

Oldest played 4 years of college basketball while studying civil engineering, graduating with a 3.85.

Younger son went back to school after a debilitating motorcycle wreck, graduating with a degree in criminal justice and a Spanish minor. Went through the Police academy his last semester of school, graduating both while maintaining a growing family and a mortgage.

Because you didn’t or don’t know someone that did, doesn’t mean it can’t still be done.
Click to expand...

Well, working two jobs to get thru school is not doing it nearly as easily as i managed.

I worked 20- 25 hr/week during the school year and 35-37 during the summer bagging groceries and stocking shelves. Tutition was $145/ quarter. My car payment was $35/month for two years, I put about a third down on the car. I bought a nice shotgun, hunted a couple days a week every fall. Partied a little, played lots of fast pitch softball and basketball.

When I graduated, I bought a new car.
 
406dn said:
Well, working two jobs to get thru school is not doing it nearly as easily as i managed.

I worked 20- 25 hr/week during the school year and 35-37 during the summer bagging groceries and stocking shelves. Tutition was $145/ quarter. My car payment was $35/month for two years, I put about a third down on the car. I bought a nice shotgun, hunted a couple days a week every fall. Partied a little, played lots of fast pitch softball and basketball.

When I graduated, I bought a new car.
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Did you have a wife, 2 kids and a mortgage?

According to you, no one will match your standard. Big deal, people can still succeed or fail, depending on their ability.
 
shrapnel said:
Did you have a wife, 2 kids and a mortgage?

According to you, no one will match your standard. Big deal, people can still succeed or fail, depending on their ability.
Click to expand...
You are missing the point, no one said whelp grab the ball kids go home you’re screwed.

It’s more difficult, the $18 wage… that’s actually a worse wage in some measures than $2.3 in 1977.

That’s the only point.

Sounds like you raised two hard working kids.
 
I agree with both of @wllm1313's posts here. I should have rephrased my reply. I didn't mean to say it couldn't be done, just that it's much harder and a lot less common nowadays. Wasn't meant to single shrapnel out, but not everyone is skilled/talented enough to play college basketball, or has a spouse that can help them share the expenses and time commitment of a family. Even then, it's not easy at all - and it's getting more difficult.
 
wllm1313 said:
No one on this thread said that, it’s harder, it’s demonstrably harder to buy a house than it was at other times in the last century.
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wllm1313 said:
You are missing the point, no one said whelp grab the ball kids go home you’re screwed.

It’s more difficult, the $18 wage… that’s actually a worse wage in some measures than $2.3 in 1977.

That’s the only point.

Sounds like you raised two hard working kids.
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5, I had 3 daughters that did the same, they just didn’t hunt all fall like the boys did.

All my kids bought nicer homes at an earlier stage in their lives than I ever did. We live in the smallest house of the whole lot, and it took us longer to get there.

My oldest son is 40 and debt free. He did it buying and managing houses and real estate. I can do it and my kids all did it and telling me you can’t today is only depending on how hard you want to work for it.
 
shrapnel said:
5, I had 3 daughters that did the same, they just didn’t hunt all fall like the boys did.

All my kids bought nicer homes at an earlier stage in their lives than I ever did. We live in the smallest house of the whole lot, and it took us longer to get there.

My oldest son is 40 and debt free. He did it buying and managing houses and real estate. I can do it and my kids all did it and telling me you can’t today is only depending on how hard you want to work for it.
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Harder now than it was earlier, is still my only point.
 
HONEYBADGER said:
A fellow wildcat......man I miss that place sometimes.
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My brother still lives there, he said alot of the areas we used to hike and swim in Bidwell Park are just homeless camps now. Sad. My family has a business that my mom runs and she cleans up needles in the parking lot most Monday morning before everyone comes back.
 
I think the point @shrapnel is trying to make here and I agree with him is that if you really want something bad enough you can get it. 99.99999% won't because they just don't eat sleep breathe whatever the it is they want. There's nothing wrong with that I'm guilty of it too hell we all are to some extent. There's things that I want that I can say I can't have but I'll bet if I gave up things like, raising a family, hunting 30 days of duck season, (insert whatever here) down to not drinking beer or not having a truck whatever I could get there or get to some type of whatever it is that I live for.
 
wllm1313 said:
Harder now than it was earlier, is still my only point.
Click to expand...
I really do understand what you are saying, my point is that I rented a trailer when we were first married. Then we bought a run down cottage out of town and bought the debt down on that for years, before selling it and building the house we live in now. It took years.

What people are buying today are nicer homes than what I have been living in for 42 years, not working their way up from a home that no one today would expect a migrant worker to live in.

Starting out with the house you want because it is nice vs starting out with a shack and working your way up is not in anyone’s playbook. If you have to start out in a $600,000.00 house, of course it is going to be tough. Our first house was tough at $21,000.00.
 
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