Hunter Harassment - Antelope Unit 19 State Trust Land

[publichunter1]

Sorry you had the trouble. It definitely can ruin a hunt. Congrats on the buck!

 

[BlakeA]

"Doxing" and encouraging personal harassment is not exactly the "high road" that I have come to expect from HuntTalkers. Please edit you post and remove the pic. These people were clearly asshats and clear in the wrong, but I don't think stooping to their level advances our cause. Congrats to OP for de-escalating, nothing good comes from angry people with guns.

Personal harassment? It's 2018. If you want to do what they did, you better be prepared for your name and face to be blasted all over social media and also receive some emails. Taking your "high road" and just leaving them alone does what exactly? I'm so sick of these POS's threatening people and acting like they own everything with zero repercussions. Just keep our mouth shut and walk away? Imagine if that was a couple young kids just getting into hunting. That confrontation could ruin them for life. F that.

If I was the OP I would be posting those videos all over FB on every fricken account that has to do with Gillette WY.

 

[scubohuntr]

is she about 74. if so she is Mary Patricia Williams. pulic online info in screen shoot. googled right up. She may appreciate so e phone calls letting her know what a peach she is and how much it is appreciated. looks lime doe tags are easy to come by in 19 as are buck tags. 2019 HT antelope rendevous sound great.

the addreess matched what is in Onx...for property adjacent to the trust land.​

This is how the anti's react- threaten and harass without bothering to get the whole story or consider long term consequences. Every time you interact with nonhunters, you are an ambassador for our sport. They expect you to be a violent redneck- it validates their prejudices. If you are unable to control your temper, stay away from places that may lead to confrontation. We need to take the high road, because we are out there armed, and any aggression on our part is possibly actionable. I think the OP handled it perfectly. Don't avoid hunting that area, but as satisfying as in-your-face responses may be for some people on a forum, they generally don't end well for anyone concerned. Be firm, be polite, and don't escalate the situation. Involve the authorities early and collect evidence. When hunting in that area, it might be a good idea to carry a printout of the relevant statutes allowing public hunting. It won't make a difference to someone like that, but being on video politely offering the written proof will go a long way in court.

I've found that anything posted online will generally come back to bite you. I don't know how, but I'd bet that somehow, posting the video would make it inadmissible as evidence if it goes to court. There is also the consideration that if someone who posted on this thread hunts that area and things get out of control, it could be taken as evidence of premeditation- you went to that area specifically looking for a confrontation, particularly if your post said, "Let's all go hunt there- we'll show 'em!" Lose your temper and say or do something that a reasonable person could interpret as threatening, and suddenly you're on the hook for a felony. If you have evidence that you had hunted that area previously, you could claim tradition, but always keep in mind that if it goes to court, their attorneys will be doing everything they can to paint you as an out-of-state whackjob that spent a lot of time and money to go to that particular area specifically looking for trouble, when there are millions of acres of other public lands you could have chosen. And the jury will be made up largely of local landowners. I'm sure there is another side to this, and if you wind up in court and the other side produces documentation of fences cut, cattle shot, and trespassing, going back several years, suddenly the lines aren't as clear to the jury.

 

[sschultz]

Make sure you contact the authorities and check on the status of this

 

[Idahoarcheryhunter]

This is how the anti's react- threaten and harass without bothering to get the whole story or consider long term consequences. Every time you interact with nonhunters, you are an ambassador for our sport. They expect you to be a violent redneck- it validates their prejudices. If you are unable to control your temper, stay away from places that may lead to confrontation. We need to take the high road, because we are out there armed, and any aggression on our part is possibly actionable. I think the OP handled it perfectly. Don't avoid hunting that area, but as satisfying as in-your-face responses may be for some people on a forum, they generally don't end well for anyone concerned. Be firm, be polite, and don't escalate the situation. Involve the authorities early and collect evidence. When hunting in that area, it might be a good idea to carry a printout of the relevant statutes allowing public hunting. It won't make a difference to someone like that, but being on video politely offering the written proof will go a long way in court.

I've found that anything posted online will generally come back to bite you. I don't know how, but I'd bet that somehow, posting the video would make it inadmissible as evidence if it goes to court. There is also the consideration that if someone who posted on this thread hunts that area and things get out of control, it could be taken as evidence of premeditation- you went to that area specifically looking for a confrontation, particularly if your post said, "Let's all go hunt there- we'll show 'em!" Lose your temper and say or do something that a reasonable person could interpret as threatening, and suddenly you're on the hook for a felony. If you have evidence that you had hunted that area previously, you could claim tradition, but always keep in mind that if it goes to court, their attorneys will be doing everything they can to paint you as an out-of-state whackjob that spent a lot of time and money to go to that particular area specifically looking for trouble, when there are millions of acres of other public lands you could have chosen. And the jury will be made up largely of local landowners. I'm sure there is another side to this, and if you wind up in court and the other side produces documentation of fences cut, cattle shot, and trespassing, going back several years, suddenly the lines aren't as clear to the jury.

I have no problem sitting on here and saying I would gladly plan a hunt to this unit because the public land is for our use, if they want to cause a problem that's up to the local Leo not some fist fight out in the Prarie.

 

[Hunting Wife]

Personal harassment? It's 2018. If you want to do what they did, you better be prepared for your name and face to be blasted all over social media and also receive some emails. Taking your "high road" and just leaving them alone does what exactly? I'm so sick of these POS's threatening people and acting like they own everything with zero repercussions. Just keep our mouth shut and walk away? Imagine if that was a couple young kids just getting into hunting. That confrontation could ruin them for life. F that.

If I was the OP I would be posting those videos all over FB on every fricken account that has to do with Gillette WY.

No one just shut their mouth and walked away. The incident was reported to the appropriate folks with multiple organizations and photo evidence was taken during the incident to support the accusation. Google searching someone who lives in the area, has a similar name, and might be the right age and posting that info as definitively belonging to the individual in question, and then urging retaliation directed at that individual is a bit too far. What if that isn’t even her? People are getting all whipped into a frenzy here and that generally leads to poor decision making. There’s a right way and a wrong way to handle things. Let’s not all lose our minds.

This would be great fodder for a podcast- the best courses of action in dealing with these types of scenarios. How to be effective in standing up for yourself in the moment, how and where to report these incidents.

 

[SFC B]

It would be REALLY nice if the various LEOs assigned to these areas would actually started enforcing law on landowners. I am sure some of you have seen the stories of the issues we have had the last 2 years. Both of my complaints to CPW have been accompanied photos and exact details. Both times I have simply been given the we'll look into it line. It seems like these LEOs don't want to rock the boat in the areas where they operate. The parts that really chap my ass is that the rancher in this case gets to graze his cattle on public land at crazy low prices AND makes HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars a year selling hunts that take our public resources (animals) and then is so greedy that he tries to discourage us from using OUR lands.

 

[Sytes]

The pitfall for voter elected County Sheriff's... Non Residents do not keep a Sheriff in office. Sad but true.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Personal harassment? It's 2018. If you want to do what they did, you better be prepared for your name and face to be blasted all over social media and also receive some emails. Taking your "high road" and just leaving them alone does what exactly? I'm so sick of these POS's threatening people and acting like they own everything with zero repercussions. Just keep our mouth shut and walk away? Imagine if that was a couple young kids just getting into hunting. That confrontation could ruin them for life. F that.

If I was the OP I would be posting those videos all over FB on every fricken account that has to do with Gillette WY.

I think the OP is doing all the right things as far as reporting to F&G and LEOs. Also fine with pics on the forum as way of raising awareness. It would be great for out of state hunters via various outdoors organizations to remind WY officials that with our funds comes an expectation of even handed law enforcement. But, most rational (and even some irrational) internet forums draw the line at “doxing”, and I do too.

 

[dwm4375]

My cousin's group was hunting on a (open to the public) timber company property a few years ago, close to the line but definitely somewhere they had the right to be. The adjoining landowner/neighbor came out to confront them and kick them off "his" property. Tempers flared, neighbor fires a shot with his AK-47, hunters flee, neighbor shoots one hunter in the back. Neighbor continues firing at the first hunter's father as he takes cover. Injured hunter rolls over, finds neighbor in his scope, and puts a .30-'06 round through center mass. The neighbor's wife watches him die while the hunters help the wounded man to the truck and head to the hospital. Be safe out there dealing with crazies. De-escalation is the best option.

 

[BlakeA]

I think the OP is doing all the right things as far as reporting to F&G and LEOs. Also fine with pics on the forum as way of raising awareness. It would be great for out of state hunters via various outdoors organizations to remind WY officials that with our funds comes an expectation of even handed law enforcement. But, most rational (and even some irrational) internet forums draw the line at “doxing”, and I do too.

Agree to disagree. I would blast that photo of her and her boys all over the place and the location it happened at along with the videos. The OP did a great job. Hopefully these losers are dealt with but I highly doubt anything will happen and they will just continue doing what they do.

 

[huntin24/7]

The OP handled this incident very well. I agree with Blake though that nothing will happen. These guys will continue to behave this way without repercussions from the warden or sheriff department. That's just the way things operate in the west.

 

[Mallardsx2]

Soooooo.....This is what it has come down to.

Unreal.

 

[RUT JUNKEY]

Hate hearing this stuff! I think you handled it well. I'm 100% sure I would not have taken it as well..I don't take threats well, and the oldest guy in my group would have been my Dad (71)...that's bad for your health! LOL

 

[wytex]

I just got a reply from the State land office and they are looking into this incident.
I would encourage you to email Cole Lambert with the issues that took place: [email protected]
I took time to let them know this is not what we as Wyoming residents want to see play out on state lands.
A threat of physical violence by the lessee's son is not a matter for them to take lightly.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Agree to disagree. I would blast that photo of her and her boys all over the place and the location it happened at along with the videos. The OP did a great job. Hopefully these losers are dealt with but I highly doubt anything will happen and they will just continue doing what they do.

I respect that we disagree, for clarity’s sake only, I do not object to her pic or video. I was referring to your screen shot of a possible home phone number. (That apparently you have taken down, thanks)

 

[BlakeA]

I respect that we disagree, for clarity’s sake only, I do not object to her pic or video. I was referring to your screen shot of a possible home phone number. (That apparently you have taken down, thanks)

??? I did not post a screen shot of phone numbers or photos of anyone ?? I think that was somebody else.

 

[dididraw]

This is how the anti's react- threaten and harass without bothering to get the whole story or consider long term consequences. Every time you interact with nonhunters, you are an ambassador for our sport. They expect you to be a violent redneck- it validates their prejudices. If you are unable to control your temper, stay away from places that may lead to confrontation. We need to take the high road, because we are out there armed, and any aggression on our part is possibly actionable. I think the OP handled it perfectly. Don't avoid hunting that area, but as satisfying as in-your-face responses may be for some people on a forum, they generally don't end well for anyone concerned. Be firm, be polite, and don't escalate the situation. Involve the authorities early and collect evidence. When hunting in that area, it might be a good idea to carry a printout of the relevant statutes allowing public hunting. It won't make a difference to someone like that, but being on video politely offering the written proof will go a long way in court.

I've found that anything posted online will generally come back to bite you. I don't know how, but I'd bet that somehow, posting the video would make it inadmissible as evidence if it goes to court. There is also the consideration that if someone who posted on this thread hunts that area and things get out of control, it could be taken as evidence of premeditation- you went to that area specifically looking for a confrontation, particularly if your post said, "Let's all go hunt there- we'll show 'em!" Lose your temper and say or do something that a reasonable person could interpret as threatening, and suddenly you're on the hook for a felony. If you have evidence that you had hunted that area previously, you could claim tradition, but always keep in mind that if it goes to court, their attorneys will be doing everything they can to paint you as an out-of-state whackjob that spent a lot of time and money to go to that particular area specifically looking for trouble, when there are millions of acres of other public lands you could have chosen. And the jury will be made up largely of local landowners. I'm sure there is another side to this, and if you wind up in court and the other side produces documentation of fences cut, cattle shot, and trespassing, going back several years, suddenly the lines aren't as clear to the jury.

A lot of wisdom here. Glad to hear that the hunter handled it so well. If you've hunted for long enough something like this is going to happen to you, prepare yourself to take the high road and not start something in the heat of the moment that you'll later regret.

More often than not, talking things out with folks (land owners, other hunters, guides, etc) will do you much more good than escalating the situation into something that will haunt you. You can disagree and find ways to resolve the issue without backing down or having an incident.

 

[VikingsGuy]

??? I did not post a screen shot of phone numbers or photos of anyone ?? I think that was somebody else.

My apologies for my error, looks like that one is gone now. My bad.

 

[shootbrownelk]

The OP handled this incident very well. I agree with Blake though that nothing will happen. These guys will continue to behave this way without repercussions from the warden or sheriff department. That's just the way things operate in the west.

You are exactly right. The local sheriff deputies aren't going to pursue this. Neither is the G&F department. Both tend to side with landowners. Our legislature in Wyoming is top heavy with ranchers and agricultural interests. And another thing, the State land grazing lease holder can petition to have that parcel closed to hunting. I've seen that done before. Some of these ranchers who have had long term leases do indeed think they own the School Trust land. And when ranches are sold, the total acreage listed for sale includes all the State & BLM leases they have. In some cases, it's more than the deeded ground. Good luck and I hope the OP prevails and justice is served, but the deck is stacked against you.