Horse, llama, goat pack animals

[LuketheDog]

twsnow, do the goats just follow you without a lead?

 

[ida homer]

twsnow, do the goats just follow you without a lead?

Yep, a literal "pack string" typically ends up tangled and unsafe as they like to jump on rocks and logs etc. If they start to lag and snack on the trail just walk around the corner. When your out of sight they will come running to catch up. They do understand the idea of an established trail well and will fall in line once they work out the pack hierarchy. I do leave 4' leads wrapped around their panniers in case a bull bugles and I need to tie them to a tree quickly.

 

[Sytes]

That is pretty cool. Thanks for chiming in, Twsnow. I'm off my goat kick and kicking around the idea of a burro or another horse. The little I did learn of these Mtn haulers has been pretty cool.

 

[JMG]

So, what breed of goat makes for a good pack goat? How much does a "pack goat" cost?

 

[DRAFTSTUD]

A small Mule or two would be my choice. John

 

[ida homer]

So, what breed of goat makes for a good pack goat? How much does a "pack goat" cost?

Alpine, Saanen, Oberhasli, La Manchas. NOT Nubians. Typically around $250-500 for one that's good. You can get them as babies from pack goat breeders for $100 but you have to wait until they are 3 to put any weight on them and I'm too impatient for that.

 

[LuketheDog]

NOT Nubians.

Ha, we had a couple pet Nubian goats when I was younger, they had to be the two dumbest animals I've ever seen in my life, entertaining as heck though...

 

[Duck-Slayer]

Some good info. here, first and foremost I will say Goat's are the cat's meow when it comes to packing, unless your elderly, overweight, or lazy..... if you have anything else just sell them and cut your loss's. There is way to many pro's and con's here to list about goats, I will touch on just a couple, oh tssnow, you miss spelled Marc's last name, it Warnke, he runs outdoors international, he is very helpful, great stuff. I mostly learned on the go, but did run into him at a breeder's house picking up a goat. Here is the over view of goats and my long quest to find a pack animal. Moved to Idaho in 2000, quickly realized I needed a pack animal, 2002 started research, did research off and on for the next 8 years, lots of info. out there, minus 2 years for a car wreck, decided on goats for these reasons, my kid's use them for 4-H, easy to care for, easy to transport, easy to train, gear is relatively inexpensive compared to horse's, maintaince on the trail is about 0, don't have to carry food, don't have to worry about "shoeing them", if they get hurt well you got meat to eat.... follow great, carry upwards of 60lbs.... I could go on and on, I ran into horse's this year several times and mules, the shit some guy's have to do to there horses/mules and how pissed they get at them is just WOW, I never have to get that crazy with my goats, even the pain in the ass goat. Anyhow its all up to you, most guy's that grow up around horse's/mules/lama's/goats are those type of people and anything else they just role there eye's at, I was non of those, grew up farming and ranching in E. MT, we used tractor's and pickups, so I had no bias at all for 1 or the other, so I consider my choice an unbiased one. Anyhow, there are alot of thing's that go into a decision, not 1 decision is right for everyone, to each there own, this is just what fit's my life. If you have any questions feel free to ask, I have 2 good read's in the Live Hunt section from this past year about my goat packing adventures.
Matt

 

[LWC55]

Anybody have a good resource for packs/panniers for llamas/goats or both? Looking for something simple with no frills. I have a few llamas and was thinking about training them to pack. But looking at prices on saddles/packs has me looking for other resources. I would just like some simple canvas panniers that you could pack a boned out elk with.

 

[Duck-Slayer]

Anybody have a good resource for packs/panniers for llamas/goats or both? Looking for something simple with no frills. I have a few llamas and was thinking about training them to pack. But looking at prices on saddles/packs has me looking for other resources. I would just like some simple canvas panniers that you could pack a boned out elk with.

You can sometime's get used pack saddle's off craigslist, I made some out of wader bags, you can use small plastic trash cans, built small wood ones, pretty much anything you can buy that is small, even some laundry bags and have some loops sewed onto them, in the pics, the purple are used that I bought, the blue are the wader bags that I sewed straps on, and I made the wood panniers that I used small bolts to attach straps onto them, they work slick,
Matt

 

[LWC55]

Thanks D-S. Did you buy or make the saddles you are using?

 

[Duck-Slayer]

Thanks D-S. Did you buy or make the saddles you are using?

I bought them all off of craigslist, a couple local, a couple from AZ, and a one from WY,
Matt

 

[idelkslayer]

This is a good podcast discussing the pros and cons of horses vs llamas vs goats:

http://www.therichoutdoors.net/pack-animals/

I got into llamas a few years ago and I love them. They can pack up to 100 lbs when full grown and well conditioned. I did pack 120 lbs on one a couple times but it was only 2 miles. Most of the time I only pack about 75 lbs on each one but mine are still young.

army surplus duffle bags make good panniers for llamas and I would assume for goats as well.

I don't think I would mix different pack animals into the same string. They may get along fine in a pasture but on the trail their different abilities and walking paces would cause conflict.

 

[Northwoods Labs]

As someone who has never experienced western hunting, I have found this thread interesting. It may be a stupid question, but I am curious: if you folks are using these pack animals to get into wilderness settings, what do you do with the pack animals when you are out hunting? Leave them in camp? Any real worries about areas with grizzlies?

 

[ida homer]

I leave mine at camp all the time but I've never had them in grizzly country. They would be a layup for cats or griz. I also hunt with them alongside me sometimes. If your gonna move in on a critter I just tie them off to a tree. They've packed out 3 bulls and a buck, it's nice not having to go back to camp to get them.

When I do leave them at camp I highline them very sturdily. Or I stake them out and sink big ass stakes into the ground. Marc had a black bear cruise by camp and he spent a full day tracking down all 7 of his. That's where having a $250 goat beats a $5000 horse. Worst case, buy a couple more.

 

[ida homer]

Idelkslayer,

Are llamas a concern to big horns like goats? Do you have to pack food for them?
100lbs is a good payload, better than I've read from others. The reason I went with goats over llamas was the mobility and I kept reading that llamas would only do 60-80lbs. Which didn't seem efficient pound for pound compared to a goat.

What are your complaints about llamas?

 

[squirrel]

Idelkslayer,

Are llamas a concern to big horns like goats? Do you have to pack food for them?
100lbs is a good payload, better than I've read from others. The reason I went with goats over llamas was the mobility and I kept reading that llamas would only do 60-80lbs. Which didn't seem efficient pound for pound compared to a goat.

What are your complaints about llamas?

No, no, I've gone 150, but would not ask them to do it again (moose in grizz country, in the dark...) complaints are I need more llamas I have 19 and needed 50 last fall...

 

[squirrel]

As someone who has never experienced western hunting, I have found this thread interesting. It may be a stupid question, but I am curious: if you folks are using these pack animals to get into wilderness settings, what do you do with the pack animals when you are out hunting? Leave them in camp? Any real worries about areas with grizzlies?

they stay in camp, slowest gets eaten first.

 

[squirrel]

Anybody have a good resource for packs/panniers for llamas/goats or both? Looking for something simple with no frills. I have a few llamas and was thinking about training them to pack. But looking at prices on saddles/packs has me looking for other resources. I would just like some simple canvas panniers that you could pack a boned out elk with.

I make my own due to cost new set-up costs around $250/llama.

 

[squirrel]

They do attract un-real numbers of women, very annoying at the trailhead when you are trying to get going... I had to call my wife last fall while on a llama-less backpacking trip and tell her I seemed to have lost my mojo. That is my complaint.



DSC04043 by squirrel2012, on Flickr