H.R. 8828 introduced -Leghold and conibear traps

[Irrelevant]

Can’t stand it.

So, if this thread was full of responses and opinions that you agree with regarding the tools trappers should use you would be happy to support trapping.

Trappers and some trapping associations have been all to happy to slowly let this way of life fade. Sometimes not so slowly.

Don’t piss down my back and tell me it’s raining.

Plenty of Darth Vaders on this thread.

“Resistance is futile”

Maybe, but it sure is fun.

Sorry man, it's just the reality. As soon as someone tells me to GFM and that my dog deserves to die if she gets away from me, or heaven forbid doesn't listen, then it's real hard for me to give-a-shit about their hobby. You might as well tell me my kids don't matter either. Just because you don't have as high a view of my dog doesn't mean I don't. And no amount of "explaining" is going to change that.

Your posts have been an excellent example of someone's I'd support, same with @theat and @huronmtns but when you have other people shooting holes in the bottom of your boat, you might want reconsider where to direct your ire.

 

[Shangobango]

Sorry man, it's just the reality. As soon as someone tells me to GFM and that my dog deserves to die if she gets away from me, or heaven forbid doesn't listen, then it's real hard for me to give-a-shit about their hobby. You might as well tell me my kids don't matter either. Just because you don't have as high a view of my dog doesn't mean I don't. And no amount of "explaining" is going to change that.

Your posts have been an excellent example of someone's I'd support, same with @theat and @huronmtns but when you have other people shooting holes in the bottom of your boat, you might want reconsider where to direct your ire.

Fair points. No ire meant toward you. Sorry for my little rant while I was still on my first cup of coffee.

For the record I get it. I have 3 dogs. They are kinda worthless but I love them. I have had working dogs in the past. Heelers. I have had a squirrel dog. There has never been a time except when I was in the military or college that I didn’t have dogs around.

I do get it.

 

[406dn]

Maybe I'll break out the cell phone camera and see if I can capture the classic inter-action of me being the arsehole for asking them to pick up their dogchit and put their dog on a leash...

Nah, no need to, I think I have an idea.

Yes, many many dog owners have no control of their dog when it's off leash. I often ride my horses on a parcel of BLM land that is also popular with walkers and their dogs. Most of the time they can get them under control. I always make my presence known in a friendly way from a distance that allows them to control their dog. People are going to let their dogs run somewhere, nothing will ever stop that.

Now one time years ago, a Lady and her Doberman provided a memorable experience. From maybe 150 yards from meeting, the Doberman saw me and came on a dead run. The lady trying to call it off. Given I run dogs from the horses, I can't let them think a dog will hurt them. So I put the horse into a faster gait and took a bead on the dog. When we got about thirty feet apart, the dog realized the size differential. I am glad it did not end up with the horse going right thru the dog.

It is interesting that you are so willing to use a broad brush with dog owners but cry foul when it is used against trappers.

 

[BuzzH]

Nah, no need to, I think I have an idea.

Yes, many many dog owners have no control of their dog when it's off leash. I often ride my horses on a parcel of BLM land that is also popular with walkers and their dogs. Most of the time they can get them under control. I always make my presence known in a friendly way from a distance that allows them to control their dog. People are going to let their dogs run somewhere, nothing will ever stop that.

Now one time years ago, a Lady and her Doberman provided a memorable experience. From maybe 150 yards from meeting, the Doberman saw me and came on a dead run. The lady trying to call it off. Given I run dogs from the horses, I can't let them think a dog will hurt them. So I put the horse into a faster gait and took a bead on the dog. When we got about thirty feet apart, the dog realized the size differential. I am glad it did not end up with the horse going right thru the dog.

It is interesting that you are so willing to use a broad brush with dog owners but cry foul when it is used against trappers.

Correct, even in places properly signed with leash laws they let their dogs run loose in violation of the laws, signage, newspaper articles, etc. Nothing is going to change that, even getting ticketed and written warnings (saw the same couple get nabbed 2 times in one day, still runs his dogs offleash). Re-read, 95% from carefully collected data...the brush is what it is. Most days it closer to, or right at 100%.

And yes, I get it, its my responsibility to let other dog owners that are violating the leash law, know that my dog is properly leashed so as to avoid conflicts. Got it.

I'll try to remember how much control people have over their dogs the next time one runs over and picks a fight with my dog, which is leashed exactly 100% of the time...and when I drive my wife over to get another 12 stitches in her hand from trying to break them up.

So many dogs are under such good control that in 2019 that it only resulted in 4.7 million bites and on average 16 human deaths...maybe we just need more BMP's. Hard knowing what would happen if people didnt control their pets.

When 4.7 million dogs get their toes pinched in a trap...let me know and we can talk about who is and isnt taking responsibility and acting responsibly for themselves.

Finally, before you ask, we didn't make any claim against the irresponsible pet owner who's dog caused the 12 stitches in my wife's palm, we're not the sue happy type...chit happens. He did get a citation though for an off-leash pet.

 

[406dn]

I don't know what to tell you. Find another place to take your dog. I use a state section close the Montana's largest city and rarely see another soul. Just me a horse and the dogs.

 

[BuzzH]

I don't know what to tell you. Find another place to take your dog. I use a state section close the Montana's largest city and rarely see another soul. Just me a horse and the dogs.

Right, its always someone else's problem...and I'm expected to compromise and give up the place across from my residence to walk my dog because others cant follow basic laws and common sense. I have to find another place because others cant follow the rules and laws.

You wonder why there's no more compromise to be had with the issue of trapping and pet ownership?

Gee, I wonder...

 

[406dn]

Your'e certainly a glass half full sort of guy.

The things I like to do require elbow room. Kinda like trapping,, but not nearly as much, probably.

It is a thirty minute or fifty minute drive to the two different places I most often go. That seems doable to me.

If my wife got bit walking the dog in a spot across the street, I'd find a better spot. It does no good to whine that people are the way they are. That will never change, it never has.

It's not unlike too many hunters ruining a spot. Well, you or I am are also ruining it for them.

 

[BuzzH]

Your'e certainly a glass half full sort of guy.

The things I like to do require elbow room. Kinda like trapping,, but not nearly as much, probably.

It is a thirty minute or fifty minute drive to the two different places I most often go. That seems doable to me.

If my wife got bit walking the dog in a spot across the street, I'd find a better spot. It does no good to whine that people are the way they are. That will never change, it never has.

It's not unlike too many hunters ruining a spot. Well, you or I am are also ruining it for them.

I'm not whining, just packing an expired can of bear spray...leashes fly out of all kinds of places when they read that "sign" pointed at their off leash dogs.

Of course the size 10.5 boot works too...

 

[BuzzH]

Hey...great idea for a BMP sign. Might get some attention. Universal sign as well, good for unruly dogs, trailheads for grizzly bear areas, etc.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Yeah, in concept and theory it works great, in reality, totally different.

Classic example is the city property where I walk my dog on a leash everyday. Signs stating leash laws, articles in the newspapers, trash cans on each side of 1.5 mile long loop with poop sack dispensers, plumb full of sacks that never get used, for picking up after your dog.

I'll take a picture today for you of all the dogs off-leash, probably 95%, and the pile after pile of dogchit they cant pick up.

Maybe I'll break out the cell phone camera and see if I can capture the classic inter-action of me being the arsehole for asking them to pick up their dogchit and put their dog on a leash...

Oh, those BMP's in action...might work for some user-groups, but not dog owners.

Dog owners... yeah I don't get it.

Here nor there but weird anecdote.

Bozeman, holy-F. Dog disaster. Pooper I mean cooper park. I think part of the reason my dog is so antagonist towards other dogs is because he was a puppy in Bozeman, dog fights constantly.

Aurora, everyone had super scary dogs... everything was a pit mix and they weren't the sweet ones on instagram.
Greater Colorado, everyone has a husky or lab... total shit show on the trails... chasing animals, antagonizing horse, fights, poop everything.

So my experience out west I totally agree with you.

Now Boston...

Bizarre paradox, tons of dogs. But like... it's fine, for the most part everyone picks up poop, and comparatively have not had leash issues. Lots of people run their dogs off leash, percentage wise way more than in CO. That said I've yet to break up a dog fight. Not a huge difference in breeds as compared to Bozeman.

Goldens in CO/MT are terrorists been bit twice, but some how in Boston people can run with them thru Cambridge off leash without ever having an issue.

N=1, yada yada... but it's absolutely a thing I've noticed.

 

[BuzzH]

Maybe people on the East coast have a higher IQ, better comprehension, and a bit of concern for others since they've had to share with, and act responsibly with other people.

Seems those things have slipped a lot in the Rocky Mountain West as of late...

 

[VikingsGuy]

Dog owners... yeah I don't get it.

Here nor there but weird anecdote.

Bozeman, holy-F. Dog disaster. Pooper I mean cooper park. I think part of the reason my dog is so antagonist towards other dogs is because he was a puppy in Bozeman, dog fights constantly.

Aurora, everyone had super scary dogs... everything was a pit mix and they weren't the sweet ones on instagram.
Greater Colorado, everyone has a husky or lab... total shit show on the trails... chasing animals, antagonizing horse, fights, poop everything.

So my experience out west I totally agree with you.

Now Boston...

Bizarre paradox, tons of dogs. But like... it's fine, for the most part everyone picks up poop, and comparatively have not had leash issues. Lots of people run their dogs off leash, percentage wise way more than in CO. That said I've yet to break up a dog fight. Not a huge difference in breeds as compared to Bozeman.

Goldens in CO/MT are terrorists been bit twice, but some how in Boston people can run with them thru Cambridge off leash without ever having an issue.

N=1, yada yada... but it's absolutely a thing I've noticed.

Closer to my experiences in MN. But they do say dogs reflect their owners

 

[Dougfirtree]

Dog owners... yeah I don't get it.

Here nor there but weird anecdote.

Bozeman, holy-F. Dog disaster. Pooper I mean cooper park. I think part of the reason my dog is so antagonist towards other dogs is because he was a puppy in Bozeman, dog fights constantly.

Aurora, everyone had super scary dogs... everything was a pit mix and they weren't the sweet ones on instagram.
Greater Colorado, everyone has a husky or lab... total shit show on the trails... chasing animals, antagonizing horse, fights, poop everything.

So my experience out west I totally agree with you.

Now Boston...

Bizarre paradox, tons of dogs. But like... it's fine, for the most part everyone picks up poop, and comparatively have not had leash issues. Lots of people run their dogs off leash, percentage wise way more than in CO. That said I've yet to break up a dog fight. Not a huge difference in breeds as compared to Bozeman.

Goldens in CO/MT are terrorists been bit twice, but some how in Boston people can run with them thru Cambridge off leash without ever having an issue.

N=1, yada yada... but it's absolutely a thing I've noticed.

People who live in densely populated areas get (relatively) good at living in densely populated areas. New Yorkers could park 6 cars in the space taken up by one F 350 in Idaho. Dogs get leashed and socialized. Dog parks get set up specifically as areas for dogs to run free and act like idiots. Folks are not shy about "educating" those that aren't holding up their end. You still couldn't pay me to live in a big city, but I give credit where credit is due.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Maybe people on the East coast have a higher IQ, better comprehension, and a bit of concern for others since they've had to share with, and act responsibly with other people.

Seems those things have slipped a lot in the Rocky Mountain West as of late...

There does seem to be a high correlation between the number of Huskys named Loki with their own instagram accounts in a State and the amount of dog shit on the local trails

 

[BuzzH]

There does seem to be a high correlation between the number of Huskys named Loki with their own instagram accounts in a State and the amount of dog shit on the local trails

Oh, I'm just that bold...

 

[TheJason]

There does seem to be a high correlation between the number of Huskys named Loki with their own instagram accounts in a State and the amount of dog shit on the local trails

So are we going full send on making this a dog bitch session now? If so (we're at post 336 FFS), I'll play.

I always leash my dog until I get away from the trailhead, then I let Finn loose. He always has an e-collar on, and if we see other people we immediately leash up. More than once I've tried to run by folks while their dogs are circling Finn, and understandably causing him to pull on the leash. All the while, they stand 20 feet away and yell "here Loki" like 40 bajillion times.

I asked a person the other day, "he hasn't come to you in 20 commands, why do you think 21 will work? Please come leash your dog." A 1" nylon leash across the face will leave a pretty lasting impression on an aggressive dog.

 

[BrdHntr]

Total disclosure: I trapped as a kid. Would get up at 5 a.m. and run a 2 mile trapline.

Learned: Body Grip traps and Snares kill

I'm totally for both Snares and Conibears to be used in either - tree sets or underwater sets. To use these indiscriminate devices on land is just plain dangerous for pets/non target wildlife/even people

Don't give me the "oh snares don't kill, so they won't hurt your dog". BS - snares have killed many dogs, but I won't cut and paste the gory proof. If you think one of my hunting dogs isn't worth more than a $1.50 piece of aircraft cable, you'd be wrong. Just one of many stories (there are many news articles about this incident - the location was on a heavily used by the public pathway on BLM, just outside of the Casper city limits, very well known as a place where people walked their dogs...yet, some "trapper" just had to set his devices there) https://trib.com/outdoors/traps-tha...cle_3f3e1256-1a7b-5a42-bfd6-22dc0a33c569.html

I'm also for the newer humane engineered foothold traps.

I'm also for marking/signing sets. I know, this can bolster theft, but a general sign saying there is trapping in the area would respectively have me take my dogs to another location.

I use GPS trackers on my dogs and have probably had 4 snare catches and 2 foothold incidents in the past 2 years. Without a tracking system, I may not of found the dogs until it was to late 3 of these times.

It's not the bird hunters, or the general public who will kill the sport of trapping, it's the trappers themselves. Biff H wants to rant on compromise? Let's start with trappers being put on equal ground with hunters - whoever pulls the trigger accepts the accountability.

PS: saw the comment on "beard oil". Huh? I don't have a beard and have no idea what beard oil is.

 

[brymoore]

I caught two marten and zero dogs today. Bobcat pulled the tail off one of my martens.

 

[Shangobango]

I caught two marten and zero dogs today. Bobcat pulled the tail off one of my martens.

Sweet! Marten and fisher are two I’d love to connect with sometime.

 

[TheJason]

I watched a marten give a couple of squirrels Hell one day when I was bow hunting elk. It was hilarious to watch.