E-Scout Plan A, B, or C

[JAG]

I am doing the e-scouting for our group with two bull and two cow tags in Region W of Wyoming. Our side focus is grouse and black bear. Our rifle hunt is in the first half of October 2024. The rut will be over but some bulls will still think it's on. We have four llamas.

I will try to give as much detail on each area without providing the Area number where so I can hopefully refine our hunt approach.

Trailhead A. (30 min drive from C; 1 hour from B). The TH Begins on a ridge at 8200' along the border of a 1-year old burn that is already producing fireweed. The ridge runs north and south with basins running east and west. 1.5 miles from the TH is a basin that appears to hold water with 2-3 springs. The north slopes have moderately thick pines, aspen growth in the basin, and bare south slopes. The terrain does not appear too steep and the bottom of this and the other basins along this ridge are roughly 7,000 feet.

Trailhead B. (1.0 hour drive from A or C), Parking spot at the no-named TH begins at the bottom of a basin at 7,800'. 2.0 miles from the TH is a pretty good campsite at 9,500'. I say a trailhead, but there is no 'labeled trail' on any maps that I can find. The pass above this basin is 10,000'. Our campsite is below a ridge that runs east-northeast and south-southwest between two basins. The north basin has a stream with no name and the south basin has a named stream; neither of these have any trails with names on them.

Glass Spot 1: 3/4 mile east from CampB: The two (2) E-W basins are characteristically steep for this region and have heavy timber on the north slopes with several open meadows and appear to have one or two avalanche chutes. These north-slope meadows face the northeast and seem to be pretty green in all of the historical imagery I could access. The south-facing slopes seem to have some gnarly chutes that provide enough shade for several stands of evergreen timber. Our glassing spot is 3/4 miles from camp.

Glass Spot 2: 1 mile west from CampB: On the west side of the pass above this basin, the main valley below is 5 miles across and contains a majority of gentle sloping terrain with little tree cover; this valley starts on the east at 10K feet, drops to 8,200' in the middle and rises back up to 10,200'. Despite the gentle terrain, it has several relatively small steep cuts that run east and west with dense pockets of trees on their north slopes. These cuts are about 3-400' deep.

A couple of named trails run through this area on the west and east sides of this large basin; one near the bottom on the east side and the other parallel trail runs on the upper west slope, but not the ridge. Onx's peak roadless area displays a purple-white haze on the western side of this valley.

Zooming in on satellite imagery, I can see a lot of game trails running in and out of the purple haze area. I do not see near as much game traffic outside of these areas, so there is some observable contrast in potential activity.

Trailhead C. (1.0 Hour Drive from B, 30 min from A). 7-mile hike beginning at 6,900' up to 9,900' with camp at 9,700'. The basin starts on the east and runs to the west. Very steep and remote for this unit. Outfitters are often in this area.

**************
A local told me about the fire in TH A and it is not on Gohunt or Onx. A biologist I spoke to is not aware of this burn, but agrees and encourages me to focus on TH B. He thinks hiking to TH C will skip a lot of good elk country just to get to good elk country with more outfitters.

I'm trying to sort out 1) which area to hit first and ask for any 2) pointers to improve preparation.

 

[SD_Prairie_Goat]

I am doing the e-scouting for our group with two bull and two cow tags in Region W of Wyoming. Our side focus is grouse and black bear. Our rifle hunt is in the first half of October 2024. The rut will be over but some bulls will still think it's on. We have four llamas.

I will try to give as much detail on each area without providing the Area number where so I can hopefully refine our hunt approach.

Trailhead A. (30 min drive from C; 1 hour from B). The TH Begins on a ridge at 8200' along the border of a 1-year old burn that is already producing fireweed. The ridge runs north and south with basins running east and west. 1.5 miles from the TH is a basin that appears to hold water with 2-3 springs. The north slopes have moderately thick pines, aspen growth in the basin, and bare south slopes. The terrain does not appear too steep and the bottom of this and the other basins along this ridge are roughly 7,000 feet.

Trailhead B. (1.0 hour drive from A or C), Parking spot at the no-named TH begins at the bottom of a basin at 7,800'. 2.0 miles from the TH is a pretty good campsite at 9,500'. I say a trailhead, but there is no 'labeled trail' on any maps that I can find. The pass above this basin is 10,000'. Our campsite is below a ridge that runs east-northeast and south-southwest between two basins. The north basin has a stream with no name and the south basin has a named stream; neither of these have any trails with names on them.

Glass Spot 1: 3/4 mile east from CampB: The two (2) E-W basins are characteristically steep for this region and have heavy timber on the north slopes with several open meadows and appear to have one or two avalanche chutes. These north-slope meadows face the northeast and seem to be pretty green in all of the historical imagery I could access. The south-facing slopes seem to have some gnarly chutes that provide enough shade for several stands of evergreen timber. Our glassing spot is 3/4 miles from camp.

Glass Spot 2: 1 mile west from CampB: On the west side of the pass above this basin, the main valley below is 5 miles across and contains a majority of gentle sloping terrain with little tree cover; this valley starts on the east at 10K feet, drops to 8,200' in the middle and rises back up to 10,200'. Despite the gentle terrain, it has several relatively small steep cuts that run east and west with dense pockets of trees on their north slopes. These cuts are about 3-400' deep.

A couple of named trails run through this area on the west and east sides of this large basin; one near the bottom on the east side and the other parallel trail runs on the upper west slope, but not the ridge. Onx's peak roadless area displays a purple-white haze on the western side of this valley.

Zooming in on satellite imagery, I can see a lot of game trails running in and out of the purple haze area. I do not see near as much game traffic outside of these areas, so there is some observable contrast in potential activity.

Trailhead C. (1.0 Hour Drive from B, 30 min from A). 7-mile hike beginning at 6,900' up to 9,900' with camp at 9,700'. The basin starts on the east and runs to the west. Very steep and remote for this unit. Outfitters are often in this area.

**************
A local told me about the fire in TH A and it is not on Gohunt or Onx. A biologist I spoke to is not aware of this burn, but agrees and encourages me to focus on TH B. He thinks hiking to TH C will skip a lot of good elk country just to get to good elk country with more outfitters.

I'm trying to sort out 1) which area to hit first and ask for any 2) pointers to improve preparation.

Just reading your writing, sounds like you're leaning towards B, which the biologist also recommended.

So that's my vote, go with confidence

 

[SAJ-99]

I would just say that by Oct 1 you will probably be dealing with snow above 9000ft. Just keep that in mind and dress for the wet. The only downside to B looks like camp is above the drainages you will hunt? So your scent will be moving downhill all night. If I have that wrong, then B is a good choice particularly if the bio views it as good elk habitat.

Good write up on the descriptions, but my takeaway is a picture really is worth 1000 words.

 

[JAG]

Yes, I am very much leaning toward plan B. Right now, I like plan A because it is the easiest to get to since the TH is at elevation as opposed to hiking up. We would have more time to glass on the first evening since the hike is also shorter.

If I go with Plan B, it will take more time to get there and we might end up hiking in the dark thus missing our first prime glassing opportunity. I will upload photos in a bit.

 

[JAG]

Plan A, B, C aerial imagery.

 

[brymoore]

Don’t camp where the elk live. I see way too many easterners putting their tents in prime elk habitat. They then wonder why they don’t see any elk after they blew them out of the area.

 

[JAG]

Don’t camp where the elk live. I see way too many easterners putting their tents in prime elk habitat. They then wonder why they don’t see any elk after they blew them out of the area.

So what metrics do you use to determine whether you are camping where elk live vs where they don’t live?

 

[SAJ-99]

So what metrics do you use to determine whether you are camping where elk live vs where they don’t live?

Would like to see the other opinions. My problem with B is the camp site if you plan on hunting the trees at the bottom. When night comes and air cools and sinks it will pull your scent into that basin. I can’t tell distance so it might not matter if you are a mile away. You might want to camp on the backside of that ridge so scent slides down the other side. All that said, I have had elk walk right through camp so .

 

[brymoore]

So what metrics do you use to determine whether you are camping where elk live vs where they don’t live?

I’m not sure I could explain it to you correctly. Obvious signs are fresh scat, rubs and beds. Stay away from meadows and water.

Last year I snuck to a classing point with a buddy in the dark. Elk use the meadow across the way in the morning. At first light, we see a tent with KUIU on it in the middle of the meadow. Tent owner was 20 yards away glassing. He was maybe 1 1/2 miles from the road. Absolutely no reason to hike a camp in to save that little bit of a hike. If he wanted to camp, he should have hid himself in the trees or even better at the dirt road.

Second camp encounter last year I was walking through a rutting area looking for the herd, mid September. Cow calling at first light looking for a response. I knew the elk would move into the area and I was trying to ambush them. Broken timber with lots of Aspen. Tracks, smelt like elk pee, beds, rubs - the whole place was tore up. There was an open finger at the end of the rutting area. Elk would graze low on the ridge and work up the finger to bed in the rutting area. I break out of the timber to the meadow edge to find two guys standing next to a tent. They said they heard bulls the first night but the elk all moved because of wolves. Sure. It had nothing to do with you camping on their front porch. They were camped two miles from their truck.

I have other examples that make me shake my head.

For me, I tend to camp closer to or at roads and hike 1-3 miles in the dark to where I think the elk might be.

The caveat of your hunt is what are you going to do if you need to hike an elk out 2-3 miles plus your camp? I once stupidly killed a mule deer buck 5 miles from my transportation (air strip). My easy 5 mile hike back turned into a 15 mile shuttle the next day.

 

[JAG]

I’m not sure I could explain it to you correctly. Obvious signs are fresh scat, rubs and beds. Stay away from meadows and water.

Last year I snuck to a classing point with a buddy in the dark. Elk use the meadow across the way in the morning. At first light, we see a tent with KUIU on it in the middle of the meadow. Tent owner was 20 yards away glassing. He was maybe 1 1/2 miles from the road. Absolutely no reason to hike a camp in to save that little bit of a hike. If he wanted to camp, he should have hid himself in the trees or even better at the dirt road.

Second camp encounter last year I was walking through a rutting area looking for the herd, mid September. Cow calling at first light looking for a response. I knew the elk would move into the area and I was trying to ambush them. Broken timber with lots of Aspen. Tracks, smelt like elk pee, beds, rubs - the whole place was tore up. There was an open finger at the end of the rutting area. Elk would graze low on the ridge and work up the finger to bed in the rutting area. I break out of the timber to the meadow edge to find two guys standing next to a tent. They said they heard bulls the first night but the elk all moved because of wolves. Sure. It had nothing to do with you camping on their front porch. They were camped two miles from their truck.

I have other examples that make me shake my head.

For me, I tend to camp closer to or at roads and hike 1-3 miles in the dark to where I think the elk might be.

The caveat of your hunt is what are you going to do if you need to hike an elk out 2-3 miles plus your camp? I once stupidly killed a mule deer buck 5 miles from my transportation (air strip). My easy 5 mile hike back turned into a 15 mile shuttle the next day.

Very good points brymoore. On the caveat, the plan is to get meat out first then camp last. Our first camp is a staging area for if we don't see what we want to see. Beyond that, there's another 5-10 miles of promising terrain and glassing spots.

Don't forget we have llamas, but your point is still valid; many hunters (including me) forget to factor in moving camp when it matters.

 

[JAG]

Would like to see the other opinions. My problem with B is the camp site if you plan on hunting the trees at the bottom. When night comes and air cools and sinks it will pull your scent into that basin. I can’t tell distance so it might not matter if you are a mile away. You might want to camp on the backside of that ridge so scent slides down the other side. All that said, I have had elk walk right through camp so .

The arrow for camp is pointing at a cluster of trees to the north of the basin that we have our sights set on. It will be about 100 yards below the ridge, in the trees & away from water. On the south-facing slope, below camp in the basin below, it is talus for a long way before it turns to grass.

The two plan B images are top and bottom basins with parts of each in both images. The top basin is a B+ basin and the bottom basin is A+.

 

[GrantK]

if it was me I'd dayhunt from the truck to start, you have four people, a bull tag and a cow tag each in area A and B, you can easily cover 5 miles back in both areas in two days, meet up at camp at the end of the day and see who saw more elk, hunt there...

packing all your stuff in two miles or less on llamas is going to be a real time killer, I'd avoid moving camp around as much as possible.

 

[stealthy_bowman]

Don’t camp where the elk live. I see way too many easterners putting their tents in prime elk habitat. They then wonder why they don’t see any elk after they blew them out of the area.

I see plenty of western dudes doing this same crap too.

 

[cohunter14]

if it was me I'd dayhunt from the truck to start, you have four people, a bull tag and a cow tag each in area A and B, you can easily cover 5 miles back in both areas in two days, meet up at camp at the end of the day and see who saw more elk, hunt there...

packing all your stuff in two miles or less on llamas is going to be a real time killer, I'd avoid moving camp around as much as possible.

Totally agree with this ↑