Dyaphram calls for newbs.
- Thread starter Sleeperls
- Start date
Primos makes a "sonic dome" in regular and mini sizes. I think that helps to position it in my mouth better than the standard flat shapes. My narrow palate like the mini size the best.
If I ever need to lighten my wife's mood I need simply to remind her of the day my first mouth calls arrived from my ebay purchase. Popped the call in my mouth, tried to create some kind of sound, and severally gagged myself.
EDIT POST: Probably should check what forums your were posting in......I have turkeys on the brain. Primos does make a sonic dome for elk as well, not sure if there is a mini size for elk
If I ever need to lighten my wife's mood I need simply to remind her of the day my first mouth calls arrived from my ebay purchase. Popped the call in my mouth, tried to create some kind of sound, and severally gagged myself.
EDIT POST: Probably should check what forums your were posting in......I have turkeys on the brain. Primos does make a sonic dome for elk as well, not sure if there is a mini size for elk
Last edited:
emrah1028
New member
I'm trying to learn how to use a turkey mouth call too. All I can do is gag.
Emrah
Emrah
ardrhi
Member
Single reed (one layer of latex) is easier to learn and to control.
In general, the myriad different designs (such as bugling bull vs. cow vs. turkey) are slightly better for what they're labelled to do but any call can be used for much more than what's on the label. I usually have a hard time gobbling or controlling a coyote howl with anything more than a single reed. On the other hand I do prefer a double reed for a mature bull bugle and a triple for raspy turkey calls, but a single reed is just a lot easier to control.
In response to the original question, you could cut the outside to fit better, but that probably won't help much. It is nearly impossible to use one that is too small while an oversized fit may stick through your teeth but it won't keep you from making the right sound.
Finally, if you think you're trying it correctly but nothing is working I would get another call. Maybe change brand or design from what you've been trying. There are some calls that just don't work in my mouth and you might have something that isn't a good match for you. Also, latex will go bad if it gets hot (in the dash of your truck) and it can rot over time.
In general, the myriad different designs (such as bugling bull vs. cow vs. turkey) are slightly better for what they're labelled to do but any call can be used for much more than what's on the label. I usually have a hard time gobbling or controlling a coyote howl with anything more than a single reed. On the other hand I do prefer a double reed for a mature bull bugle and a triple for raspy turkey calls, but a single reed is just a lot easier to control.
In response to the original question, you could cut the outside to fit better, but that probably won't help much. It is nearly impossible to use one that is too small while an oversized fit may stick through your teeth but it won't keep you from making the right sound.
Finally, if you think you're trying it correctly but nothing is working I would get another call. Maybe change brand or design from what you've been trying. There are some calls that just don't work in my mouth and you might have something that isn't a good match for you. Also, latex will go bad if it gets hot (in the dash of your truck) and it can rot over time.
PAGOAT
Active member
Not sure about elk but I diaphragm call is basically the same. I need to trim most calls but after a few I have found TOP calls from Renovo PA has a metal band in them that you can bend for a much better fit. I don't know though if they make elk calls
Goat
Goat
Double Creek
New member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2016
- Messages
- 10
It takes a lot of practice to even begin sounding like an elk or turkey. Everyone struggles with it at first. Just get a handful of calls and practice every day. It will eventually become natural.
Keep your calls in the refrigerator and they will last a LOT longer. Rinse them off and dry them prior to storage.
Practice. More. And more. And more.
You can trim the reeds to fit your mouth. Primos makes different sizes. I really like the Bugling Bulls reeds. The All Star is my favorite, the Mellow Yellow is very easy to use.
Don't worry so much at first about making the right bugles, etc. Instead, simply work on controlling the reed. My wife laughs when I get my reeds out and do scales them (not very good ones). The key is to learn to make the right pitches, then work on your different calls.
Practice. More. And more. And more.
You can trim the reeds to fit your mouth. Primos makes different sizes. I really like the Bugling Bulls reeds. The All Star is my favorite, the Mellow Yellow is very easy to use.
Don't worry so much at first about making the right bugles, etc. Instead, simply work on controlling the reed. My wife laughs when I get my reeds out and do scales them (not very good ones). The key is to learn to make the right pitches, then work on your different calls.
Badger_55
Active member
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2016
- Messages
- 311
Ive had similar issues with the reflex or start drooling like a dog... I just started keeping one in my mouth through the day... rotating it around and such... I've got turkey calls that sound way better than elk calls when i, cow calling.. I say just play around with a few.. you will find a sweet spot. I have Primos and Rocky Mountain calls and like them both.
Murph1
Member
I have tried many different diaphragm calls and found the Primos to be the most consistent and durable. I got some calling CD's to play in my car and practice on my way to and from work, that way you can "sing along" to the CD and nobody can hear you.
zachthebowhunter
Member
Look into Phelps game calls as well. I just bought a three pack of his elk calls for the fall and found them to be very nice. They don't have the little dome like primos so they are tough to figure out at first but with practice that comes easier.
Here's a bit of mouth reed info on fit & use. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
When choosing a mouth reed which is best for us? Reeds come in 1/2" & 5/8" models, many hunters are unaware of this. Most hunters need a 1/2" reed to fit them best. This means if you have a normal size to narrow palate you will need a 1/2" reed, the 5/8" reed will feel too big in your mouth & you will struggle with it causing frustration. This is the most overlooked feature when choosing a mouth reed especially for newer users. Many times a reed is recommended to us to try because a buddy does very well with his. Maybe he has a large palate so he uses the wider version so we try it & hate it! (grin) Next thing you know is we feel reeds aren't for us because we assume all reeds are the same! This is the # 1 mistake, make sure to choose the right reed for you! Newer hunters should start with single reeds.
One thing to note is any hunter can use a narrow framed reed, doesn't matter if he has a wide palate or not but not anyone can use a wide 5/8" reed. If in doubt consider the 1/2" version first! Some wonder if they can learn to use a mouth reed? If you can brush your teeth without gagging then yes you can learn to use one!
Should I use a standard reed or a palate plate reed? Does it matter & what's the difference?
When using a Palate plate reed the part of the reed with the shed roof or dome goes up towards the palate & the latex faces towards front teeth, these type reeds are not intended to bend or shape to ones mouth, they are to be used as is. If non palate plate reed you'll generally notice a small bump on one side of the reed in the frame about center where vinyl covers top part of horseshoe. Most these reeds with this bump will face towards the palate not the tongue but quite possibly can work either way if a single reed. (this can vary from call maker to call maker) If double & triple reeds make sure the layering where you can see them stair step face up towards your palate not down for best results. These types of reeds can be shaped to ones mouth or at times slightly trimming of the vinyl tag for best fit & feel. Don't get carried away on the bending or you will have a saggy or lazy latex if bent in. If bent to your desired fit it may be necessary to pull apart the opening of the horseshoe open end to tighten latex to achieve like new condition.
Too, I like nibbling or chewing on nearly every reed I use when it's new before putting on my tongue & lifting into place. This softens the canvas vinyl like a wet T-shirt so it molds to your palate & dams all air from escaping as well as softens edges & corners so they aren't poking at your gums. Do not chew on the latex itself.
All this can take a minute or two depending on what's needed to soften material. The first time will take the longest & from there it's pretty easily done with continued use.
Before there's any bending, trimming or shaping on non palate reeds you must know where the reed goes! Here are a few points to consider. The reed is not clamped down by your back teeth or any teeth for that matter. Now allow the right & left corners of the vinyl tag to slightly rest against top inside front teeth. The very front of the latex or horseshoe opening should be in the proximity of the ridge or cleft of your palate, the mouth reed itself does not touch your front teeth so it's actually 3/4" or so from teeth, only the corners of the vinyl should be touching inside of top teeth or gum line. You can use center of tongue as contact point on latex for more subtle sounds as cow calling or smaller bull sounds. Tip of tongue, front or the back of tip portion can be used for louder bull sounds as lip bawls or long range location bugles.
One of the easiest sounds to perform are cow sounds, use center of tongue if so desired with light to medium pressure & say Shhhhhhh softly, by adjusting air-flow, tongue tension and or position of tongue in a forward or backward motion very slightly you will achieve the desired tone. You want to practice this first before you move on to bull sounds. Take one step at a time, conquer it, then move to the next step towards bull sounds. One note with bull sounds is you will need to add your own voice inflections into most of these sounds, the mouth reed can only be counted on for those creative higher notes & raspy aggressive sounds, it's a learning process but easily done with the proper motivation & understanding that it will take a few practice sessions to get comfortable with the reed in ones mouth. This cannot be done as a 1st timer in one or two 5-10 minute sessions. Plan on 4 weeks of persistent practice 10 minutes a day, some are quicker learner than others. (grin) Give yourself a chance & be persistent & you can succeed!
Final note, mouth reeds can get old! The latex can fatigue quickly if left in direct sunlight in rig or at home, sometimes in less than 30 minutes. You also have to watch out if left in the home on a table or desk where direct lamplight or sunlight can attack the latex. With lots of daily use they need to be traded out with a new one in a month or so. If doing lots of lip bawls or harsh aggressive bugling their life expectancy can be much less! When sounds are not crisp & clean as the first day of use it's time for a new one! Store in cool dry places.
ElkNut1
When choosing a mouth reed which is best for us? Reeds come in 1/2" & 5/8" models, many hunters are unaware of this. Most hunters need a 1/2" reed to fit them best. This means if you have a normal size to narrow palate you will need a 1/2" reed, the 5/8" reed will feel too big in your mouth & you will struggle with it causing frustration. This is the most overlooked feature when choosing a mouth reed especially for newer users. Many times a reed is recommended to us to try because a buddy does very well with his. Maybe he has a large palate so he uses the wider version so we try it & hate it! (grin) Next thing you know is we feel reeds aren't for us because we assume all reeds are the same! This is the # 1 mistake, make sure to choose the right reed for you! Newer hunters should start with single reeds.
One thing to note is any hunter can use a narrow framed reed, doesn't matter if he has a wide palate or not but not anyone can use a wide 5/8" reed. If in doubt consider the 1/2" version first! Some wonder if they can learn to use a mouth reed? If you can brush your teeth without gagging then yes you can learn to use one!
Should I use a standard reed or a palate plate reed? Does it matter & what's the difference?
When using a Palate plate reed the part of the reed with the shed roof or dome goes up towards the palate & the latex faces towards front teeth, these type reeds are not intended to bend or shape to ones mouth, they are to be used as is. If non palate plate reed you'll generally notice a small bump on one side of the reed in the frame about center where vinyl covers top part of horseshoe. Most these reeds with this bump will face towards the palate not the tongue but quite possibly can work either way if a single reed. (this can vary from call maker to call maker) If double & triple reeds make sure the layering where you can see them stair step face up towards your palate not down for best results. These types of reeds can be shaped to ones mouth or at times slightly trimming of the vinyl tag for best fit & feel. Don't get carried away on the bending or you will have a saggy or lazy latex if bent in. If bent to your desired fit it may be necessary to pull apart the opening of the horseshoe open end to tighten latex to achieve like new condition.
Too, I like nibbling or chewing on nearly every reed I use when it's new before putting on my tongue & lifting into place. This softens the canvas vinyl like a wet T-shirt so it molds to your palate & dams all air from escaping as well as softens edges & corners so they aren't poking at your gums. Do not chew on the latex itself.
All this can take a minute or two depending on what's needed to soften material. The first time will take the longest & from there it's pretty easily done with continued use.
Before there's any bending, trimming or shaping on non palate reeds you must know where the reed goes! Here are a few points to consider. The reed is not clamped down by your back teeth or any teeth for that matter. Now allow the right & left corners of the vinyl tag to slightly rest against top inside front teeth. The very front of the latex or horseshoe opening should be in the proximity of the ridge or cleft of your palate, the mouth reed itself does not touch your front teeth so it's actually 3/4" or so from teeth, only the corners of the vinyl should be touching inside of top teeth or gum line. You can use center of tongue as contact point on latex for more subtle sounds as cow calling or smaller bull sounds. Tip of tongue, front or the back of tip portion can be used for louder bull sounds as lip bawls or long range location bugles.
One of the easiest sounds to perform are cow sounds, use center of tongue if so desired with light to medium pressure & say Shhhhhhh softly, by adjusting air-flow, tongue tension and or position of tongue in a forward or backward motion very slightly you will achieve the desired tone. You want to practice this first before you move on to bull sounds. Take one step at a time, conquer it, then move to the next step towards bull sounds. One note with bull sounds is you will need to add your own voice inflections into most of these sounds, the mouth reed can only be counted on for those creative higher notes & raspy aggressive sounds, it's a learning process but easily done with the proper motivation & understanding that it will take a few practice sessions to get comfortable with the reed in ones mouth. This cannot be done as a 1st timer in one or two 5-10 minute sessions. Plan on 4 weeks of persistent practice 10 minutes a day, some are quicker learner than others. (grin) Give yourself a chance & be persistent & you can succeed!
Final note, mouth reeds can get old! The latex can fatigue quickly if left in direct sunlight in rig or at home, sometimes in less than 30 minutes. You also have to watch out if left in the home on a table or desk where direct lamplight or sunlight can attack the latex. With lots of daily use they need to be traded out with a new one in a month or so. If doing lots of lip bawls or harsh aggressive bugling their life expectancy can be much less! When sounds are not crisp & clean as the first day of use it's time for a new one! Store in cool dry places.
ElkNut1
Texasgamehunter
New member
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2016
- Messages
- 38
That is a very good explanation- I'm new to all of this elk hunting and calling. Where do y'all normally buy your mouth calls? It sounds like it would really be a good idea to take spare calls in the field just in case your primary one goes bad. Do the experienced callers do this? One more question... When using the mouth call do you suck the air in or blow it out?
Thanks! Check out this clip on mouth reed use, it should help you out!
I didn't realize it was showing the other forum, I thought it would just show the video clip, sorry about that!
http://www.wapititalk.com/Hunting/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=72
ElkNut1
I didn't realize it was showing the other forum, I thought it would just show the video clip, sorry about that!
http://www.wapititalk.com/Hunting/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=72
ElkNut1
