Drill Baby, Drill

[Ben Lamb]

This is part of the cost of the Tar Sands project. It's what people are willing to sacrifice in order to have cheap gas (rather than focus on the real issue). Woodland Caribou are declining rapidly, bears are being shot for being habituated to the man camps, ducks are dying in the sludge, and the solution being offered is to poison the wolves.

All because we can't have regulations get in the way of short-term profit.

EDMONTON — Alberta Sustainable Resource Development says 145 black bears were killed by Fish and Wildlife conservation officers last year after being habituated to garbage in the oilsands region.

The number of bears shot in the Fort McMurray district was nearly three times the count the previous year and the highest in recent history, said spokesman Darcy Whiteside.



Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/busine...sands+region/6188143/story.html#ixzz1n9c7JCba

Fingers are being pointed after hundreds of ducks were found dead or dying in a toxic tailings pond belonging to oilsands giant Syncrude Canada Ltd.

CTV Edmonton's Joel Gotlib told Newsnet on Wednesday that it's the worst such incident in the history of northern Alberta's oilsands.

Environmentalists are furious, governments are demanding answers and Syncrude -- located about 40 kilometres north of Fort McMurray -- is scrambling to contain the damage, he said.

The tailings ponds are formed during the oilsands extraction process, Miles Kitagawa of the Alberta Toxics Watch Society told CTV.ca on Wednesday.

"Syncrude utilizes something called the Clark hot water process, where they crush bitumen-containing oil, mix it with heated water and use that to separate the bitumen out of the ore," he said.



Read more: http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/CTVNewsAt11/20080430/ducks_oilsands_080430/#ixzz1n9cZVu4K

Canadian government decides poisoning wolves will save caribou from tar sands


By Jeremy Symons / National Wildlife Federation

The toll of tar sands development has been largely hidden hundreds of miles to the North. Canadian forests once provided the last undisturbed refuge in North America for migrating songbirds, ducks and geese, and the vast stretches of wilderness in northern Alberta have been ideal for wild wolves and caribou that have thrived in balance with nations of native Canadians for countless generations. But that was all before oil companies moved in and took control of the Albertan government.

Alberta’s carefully constructed web of secrecy was pierced this week by news that Canada is planning to poison thousands of wolves in a desperate effort to save caribou decimated by oil development. Recent scientific studies have proved that Canada’s Woodland caribou herds are heading toward extinction due to habitat destruction from tar sands and other oil development. Today’s Los Angeles Times article sums up the story:

Woodland caribou herds in Canada are declining, and tar sands development is a big part of the reason why. But Canada’s national and provincial governments know what do about that: Kill the wolves.
http://dgrnewsservice.wordpress.com...ning-wolves-will-save-caribou-from-tar-sands/

 

[bonedogg]

you have no clue...people forget the tarsands leach oil out of the soil naturally... some lakes are brown and have been brown since the beginning of time. I love how people can jump on the wagon of some miniscule media BS. Ask someone how much money, land and resources are provided to the environment from the major players. If black bear populations were an issue, we as Albertans would not be allowed to shoot two of them a yr.:hump:

 

[bonedogg]

by the way the natives up there are the richest in North America-food for thought

 

[Ben Lamb]

"In utilizing and conserving the natural resources of the Nation, the one characteristic more essential than any other is foresight.... The conservation of our natural resources and their proper use constitute the fundamental problem which underlies almost every other problem of our national life."

"Defenders of the short-sighted men who in their greed and selfishness will, if permitted, rob our country of half its charm by their reckless extermination of all useful and beautiful wild things sometimes seek to champion them by saying the 'the game belongs to the people.' So it does; and not merely to the people now alive, but to the unborn people. The 'greatest good for the greatest number' applies to the number within the womb of time, compared to which those now alive form but an insignificant fraction. Our duty to the whole, including the unborn generations, bids us restrain an unprincipled present-day minority from wasting the heritage of these unborn generations."

Theodore Roosevelt

 

[bonedogg]

also consider your sources, a member of the National Wildlife Federation? not a very neutral source. If and when you come up to hunt in Alberta, you may hunt on land held by the Nature conservancy of Canada, all bought by donations from the syncrudes, shells and other oil and gas companies that donate Millions of dollars each yr. that beats the $10 bucks most "earthy" people like to spring a yr!! We also have the ERCB which regulates the development, what do you guys have in Montana?

 

[spook12]

Ya, Ben the ENVIROMENTS getting money, land and resor.......... WHA?

 

[bonedogg]

Ya, Ben the ENVIROMENTS getting money, land and resor.......... WHA?

that's Environment for the ones that can't spell

 

[bonedogg]

easy to throw stones from a distance, come check it out your selves, see it with your own eyes and then throw in your two cents. Love the armchair quarterbacks that know what's going on from thousands of miles away. I laugh at what the initial fines were for the BP spill!!!!! that there gentlemen, is being short sighted.

 

[Ben Lamb]

also consider your sources, a member of the National Wildlife Federation? not a very neutral source. If and when you come up to hunt in Alberta, you may hunt on land held by the Nature conservancy of Canada, all bought by donations from the syncrudes, shells and other oil and gas companies that donate Millions of dollars each yr. that beats the $10 bucks most "earthy" people like to spring a yr!! We also have the ERCB which regulates the development, what do you guys have in Montana?

We have TNC property here too, paid for by a multitude of sources. We also have the Board of Oil and Gas Commissioners, the BGLM, USFS, USFWS, FWP and a few other alphabet soup agencies that deal with oil and gas issues.

We also had a directive from DC to eliminate a lot of existing protections and go ahead w/o a lot of oversight as well as a legislature that has done their level best to eliminate public input to development on public lands.

All of these together have led to development over all other objections, increased crime, increased property taxes, strained infrastructure, etc.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I laugh at what the initial fines were for the BP spill!!!!! that there gentlemen, is being short sighted.

Me too. That's why there's a ton of folks fighting to make that right, NWF at the lead, btw.

easy to throw stones from a distance, come check it out your selves, see it with your own eyes and then throw in your two cents. Love the armchair quarterbacks that know what's going on from thousands of miles away.

10 years of working at the state and national level on oil and gas issues. I wouldn't say that I'm an armchair quaterback.

 

[BuzzH]

Its just flat ridiculous for anyone to bury their head in the tar sands and pretend extracting said oil has no negative impacts...

Every discussion of this nature is the same old...same old. "Well, the oil companies need to make money, the locals are getting rich, the oil companies throw a few sheckles at the environment, theres this one brown lake where the oil is natural, blah, blah, blah". I've heard it all before.

Never once is there any discussion on how to mitigate the fact that this type of extraction will have impacts...sometimes very large impacts.

Nothing new.

 

[JoseCuervo]

And, that is why the Oil Companies want to transform a Wild and Scenic River Corridor into an expressway for equipment for the tar sands, ignoring ALL the environmental damage to one of Idaho's rivers.

But, hey, they are Canada, we should help them, they make Kokanee beer....

 

[sagebrush]

The way I see it, its their business. How would you like some jackass in a highrise in NYC telling you to release some wolves in your backyard? Oh, wait a minute, already done.

 

[Ben Lamb]

The way I see it, its their business. How would you like some jackass in a highrise in NYC telling you to release some wolves in your backyard? Oh, wait a minute, already done.

Except they are going to pipe it through the Ogallala Aquifer, where a lot of Nebraskans have risen up against the Keystone pipeline, to be processed in Texas refineries, and shipped overseas.

 

[onpoint]

Following some of the recent "hot button" posts lately reminds me of the following quote:

"If you fight with idiots, you will be lowered to their level, then they will beat you with experience."

I am directing that as much at myself as others:W: - have the t-shirt, literally. From MT's 2011 legislative session

Good luck with it.

 

[Pagosa]

Hey Ben and Jose - Do you guys realize they is about 625,000 miles of pipeline installed in the U.S.? A majority was installed back in the 40's, 50's, and 60's before new technology
in the welding, steel, and NDT testing arrived on the scene. Let alone the environmental regulations imposed by FERC, NEB, etc. Why don't you guys go pound some tar sand?

 

[shoots-straight]

Hey Ben and Jose - Do you guys realize they is about 625,000 miles of pipeline installed in the U.S.? A majority was installed back in the 40's, 50's, and 60's before new technology
in the welding, steel, and NDT testing arrived on the scene. Let alone the environmental regulations imposed by FERC, NEB, etc. Why don't you guys go pound some tar sand?

Other than pounding tar sand, is your point the fact that a new pipeline, running across an aquifer would be 100% totally safe, even though tar sand oil is extremely corrosive?

I believe the size, and volume carrying capacity of a new pipeline would dwarf all those other's.

 

[DRAFTSTUD]

SS, Nothing is 100% safe when you have metal and strain upon that metal. Both sides have claims on the corrosive effect of Tar Sands, you can take your pick of studies. With pipelines it really boils down to the maintence of the Pipeline. The size and Volume would not dwarf anything out by a long shot, we have Large Capacity Natural Gas pipelines under much more pressure than what this pipeline will be forced to maintain. My big thing with the Tar Sands is the reclaimation of the area where it is being developed. John

 

[Ben Lamb]

Hey Ben and Jose - Do you guys realize they is about 625,000 miles of pipeline installed in the U.S.? A majority was installed back in the 40's, 50's, and 60's before new technology
in the welding, steel, and NDT testing arrived on the scene. Let alone the environmental regulations imposed by FERC, NEB, etc. Why don't you guys go pound some tar sand?

I'm not opposed to the pipeline, and would prefer that it goes through MT because of the on-ramp for Bakken crude.

However, the route currently chosen has some significant impacts if it goes through the aquifer, and given the lack of enforcement and relaxed regulation, a reasonable person has to wonder if there will be another pipeline spill. The Yellowstone spill was 50% larger than reported, it turns out, and other pipelines still crack, leak and get cratered. So, if the regulations are stronger, then go for it.

 

[Ben Lamb]

SS, Nothing is 100% safe when you have metal and strain upon that metal. Both sides have claims on the corrosive effect of Tar Sands, you can take your pick of studies. With pipelines it really boils down to the maintence of the Pipeline. The size and Volume would not dwarf anything out by a long shot, we have Large Capacity Natural Gas pipelines under much more pressure than what this pipeline will be forced to maintain. My big thing with the Tar Sands is the reclaimation of the area where it is being developed. John

Yes! Agree wholeheartedly. Now how do we get these companies to live up to their promises?