Biden Plan to End Online Ammo Sales

[Irrelevant]

People who strongly support specific language and interpretations of the constitution are omitting that the founding fathers weren't united on every topic. They disagreed and fought and argued and used politics to get others to support their stance or reject their opponents and that the language we see is the compromise. It includes enough vaugeries to allow several interpretations. The lack of specificity was by design in many cases.

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

Call me crazy, but I don't think 99.9% of gun owners will lay down their weapons to a tyrannical government that would disarm its citizens. Randy said he won't be disarmed and there are many others like him.

Like I said, it's more fun to talk tough.

What is your argument that you haven't already been disarmed? What good is your AR against tanks and missles?

One could argue that we've already made the choice to "disarm" ourselves by restricting who and what "arms" a civilian can own vs. what "a well regulated militia" (aka, our military) can own. So now we're just arguing over where that line is...

 

[LWC55]

People who strongly support specific language and interpretations of the constitution are omitting that the founding fathers weren't united on every topic. They disagreed and fought and argued and used politics to get others to support their stance or reject their opponents and that the language we see is the compromise. It includes enough vaugeries to allow several interpretations. The lack of specificity was by design in many cases.

They were united against a tyrannical form of government. That is pretty clear.

 

[Wildabeest]

Lost all mine in a mysterious boating accident.

Where are my guns? Ask Carole Baskin...

 

[Wildabeest]

People who strongly support specific language and interpretations of the constitution are omitting that the founding fathers weren't united on every topic. They disagreed and fought and argued and used politics to get others to support their stance or reject their opponents and that the language we see is the compromise.

How did they do that without social media?

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Call me crazy, but I don't think 99.9% of gun owners will lay down their weapons to a tyrannical government that would disarm its citizens. Randy said he won't be disarmed and there are many others like him.

This is a bit wonky... but first row breaks down the US electorate. So there are more independent voters than either D or R. The second row is the percent of people in each party who identify as a gun owner.
The third column is the percent of the total electorate who report as a member of that party and as a gun owner.

Take away, there are more dem + independent gun owners than republic gun owners by a fair margin (almost double). I.E. 2 out of 3 gun owners aren't registered republicans.

99.9%... honestly... 10% is generous, fight with votes... maybe 80%, fight with their guns...

Protecting your right though changing public sentiment, messaging, revamping laws, including new groups in shooting sports... etc. seems like a much better long term strategy.


* registered voters from gallup
** gun demographics from https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...aphics-and-politics-of-gun-owning-households/

 

[VikingsGuy]

This is a bit wonky... but first row breaks down the US electorate. So there are more independent voters than either D or R. The second row is the percent of people in each party who identify as a gun owner.
The third column is the percent of the total electorate who report as a member of that party and as a gun owner.

Take away, there are more dem + independent gun owners than republic gun owners by a fair margin (almost double). I.E. 2 out of 3 gun owners aren't registered republicans.

99.9%... honestly... 10% is generous, fight with votes... maybe 80%, fight with their guns...

Protecting your right though changing public sentiment, messaging, revamping laws, including new groups in shooting sports... etc. seems like a much better long term strategy.

View attachment 145316
* registered voters from gallup
** gun demographics from https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...aphics-and-politics-of-gun-owning-households/

A few interesting graphs along these lines:

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

I bet it blows some people's minds that 22% of people who identify as Dems, own guns. LOL

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

"Essential to their own "sense" of freedom..." That's spot-on. See my question above about having already been disarmed.

 

[LWC55]

This is a bit wonky... but first row breaks down the US electorate. So there are more independent voters than either D or R. The second row is the percent of people in each party who identify as a gun owner.
The third column is the percent of the total electorate who report as a member of that party and as a gun owner.

Take away, there are more dem + independent gun owners than republic gun owners by a fair margin (almost double). I.E. 2 out of 3 gun owners aren't registered republicans.

99.9%... honestly... 10% is generous, fight with votes... maybe 80%, fight with their guns...

Protecting your right though changing public sentiment, messaging, revamping laws, including new groups in shooting sports... etc. seems like a much better long term strategy.

View attachment 145316
* registered voters from gallup
** gun demographics from https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...aphics-and-politics-of-gun-owning-households/

I don't disagree. But if we get one more anti 2A (individual rights) SC Justice, all that may be for not.

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

I don't disagree. But if we get one more anti 2A (individual rights) SC Justice, all that may be for not.

Some days, I wonder if we shouldn't be voting for SC justices and not the federal gov't's CEO. SC justices seem to be what most folks are most worried about these days anyway.

 

[3855WIN]

I don't see that as a statement against the 2A so much as she recognized it was needed at the time it was written and is now outdated. We can disagree with that interpretation, but again, it's why they were hired and why we have 9 of them. I think a lot of people - and even many gun owners I know - would agree that the 2A could use some updating. We're going to get there one way or the other with technology changing how we define "arms." Look at the recent taser decisions for example.

Look at the technology when the 2A was written.

Multi-Shot Assault Weapons Of The 1700s And The 2nd Amendment

Proponents of stricter gun control have a problem with the Second Amendment: “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” One of their arguments is that our Founding Fathers could not have...

arizonadailyindependent.com

 

[Sytes]

Great... Let metropolis cities define our SCOTUS. No thanks

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

Great... Let metropolis cities define our SCOTUS. No thanks

Is having them selected by partisan politicians beholden to special interest groups any better?

 

[3855WIN]

Like I said, it's more fun to talk tough.

What is your argument that you haven't already been disarmed? What good is your AR against tanks and missles?

One could argue that we've already made the choice to "disarm" ourselves by restricting who and what "arms" a civilian can own vs. what "a well regulated militia" (aka, our military) can own. So now we're just arguing over where that line is...

Afghanistan is proof that small arms can work against tanks, etc

 

[Justabirdwatcher]

Look at the technology when the 2A was written.

Multi-Shot Assault Weapons Of The 1700s And The 2nd Amendment

Proponents of stricter gun control have a problem with the Second Amendment: “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” One of their arguments is that our Founding Fathers could not have...

arizonadailyindependent.com

I don't think her "outdated" comment was referring to firearm technology as much as it was the formation of "well regulated" militias.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Some days, I wonder if we shouldn't be voting for SC justices and not the federal gov't's CEO. SC justices seem to be what most folks are most worried about these days anyway.

No way... the court and the process is already way to partisan.

The president should nominate 5 or so candidates, then the president and both houses of congress should be locked in a room and not allowed to leave until there is an unanimous vote on one person.

 

[LWC55]

Like I said, it's more fun to talk tough.

What is your argument that you haven't already been disarmed? What good is your AR against tanks and missles?

One could argue that we've already made the choice to "disarm" ourselves by restricting who and what "arms" a civilian can own vs. what "a well regulated militia" (aka, our military) can own. So now we're just arguing over where that line is...

I didn't see your edited question until 358WIN responded. But I agree with him that afghanistan as well as vietnam are both recent examples of seriously outgunned warriors that were not able to be defeated by our great military. Mix in the fact that most US Military members come from gun owning families and would be asked to kill their own families and go against their own personal beliefs. That would make for a very curious outcome if it ever comes time to try forcibly remove guns.

 

[Sytes]

No way... the court and the process is already way to partisan.

The president should nominate 5 or so candidates, then the president and both houses of congress should be locked in a room and not allowed to leave until there is an unanimous vote on one person.

 

[Doublecluck]

No way... the court and the process is already way to partisan.

The president should nominate 5 or so candidates, then the president and both houses of congress should be locked in a room and not allowed to leave until there is an unanimous vote on one person.

I like the part of locking them in a room, but do we have to let them out? Some of us just want to be left alone after all..

I’m not a criminal, all my life I’ve felt like there is a group of people enacting laws that directly effect the things I love about this country and rarely if ever solve the problems intended. online ammo purchases is just another one. I was completely apolitical the first half of my life, the California gun control movement is probably the most influential factor in what brought my political beliefs to what they are today.