A Navy Veteran’s perspective on racism

[3855WIN]

The kid fly fishing with a friend.

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[VikingsGuy]

His pilgrimage to Mecca taught him that the racism he saw in the United States was an American issue. Seeing people of every color showing love and gratitude towards each other can do that.

Thanks for some great remarks. Based on my travels and managing global teams this is not at all unique to America. Brazil, Japan and Belgium, just to name three, have huge underlying problems with racism that are just beginning to get attention. This does not suggest we should take any comfort from being one of many countries with problems, but this is much broader than just us.

 

[Huntkook]

BTW, I had never heard Morgan Freeman discuss race. Not what I was expecting.

Morgan Freeman has and he has a pretty good perspective.

 

[Europe]

I have been fortunate enough to have traveled the world and found bad and good everywhere.

I prefer to look for the good in everyone and usually find it.

My favorite "race" is the human race

Love you guys and gals

Ciao

 

[VikingsGuy]

Morgan Freeman has and he has a pretty good perspective.

A sincere question, not intended as snarky. Do you consider it a "pretty good perspective" because you find it helpful to add an additional view to the many other black American opinions that disagree with him so that you can better understand a very complicated situation, or, because it agrees with your preconceived notions and it trumps the view of those other black opinions?

In all areas, but particularly in areas of strong emotion, we all need to be mindful of the natural and universal human blindspot of "confirmation bias". I am not assuming or accusing - and I am not speaking specifically to you - this just seemed like a timely reminder for us all - myself included.

 

[JLS]

A sincere question, not intended as snarky. Do you consider it a "pretty good perspective" because you find it helpful to add an additional view to the many other black American opinions that disagree with him so that you can better understand a very complicated situation, or, because it agrees with your preconceived notions and it trumps the view of those other black opinions?

In all areas, but particularly in areas of strong emotion, we all need to be mindful of the natural and universal human blindspot of "confirmation bias". I am not assuming or accusing - and I am not speaking specifically to you - this just seemed like a timely reminder for us all - myself included.

I think this is a hugely important point in a hot button issue such as this.

 

[Irrelevant]

A sincere question, not intended as snarky. Do you consider it a "pretty good perspective" because you find it helpful to add an additional view to the many other black American opinions that disagree with him so that you can better understand a very complicated situation, or, because it agrees with your preconceived notions and it trumps the view of those other black opinions?

In all areas, but particularly in areas of strong emotion, we all need to be mindful of the natural and universal human blindspot of "confirmation bias". I am not assuming or accusing - and I am not speaking specifically to you - this just seemed like a timely reminder for us all - myself included.

That is certainly something we should all keep in the back of our minds when we find an opinion we readily agree with, not just about race.

 

[Howie]

Mr. Floyd should not have died under a cops knee, that is a crime........but he should not have done something to put himself in the situation.

There are raging, criminal, a-holes .....totally inconsiderate of anything or anyone, but their whim. There are small time crooks making bad decisions. There are prejudiced folks who are selfish.
They are in control of this and made this choice.
They are from all skin colors and religious realms.
If they break laws punishment should be swift and more severe than presently utilized. Folks on the fence about commiting a crime will think twice. Those that decide to commit should receive no pity.

More importantly ALL VICTIMS should be considered, their rights were taken. Criminals, convicted of taking someones rights or life, should have their rights taken from them until full punishment/restitution is paid by them.

 

[Hammsolo]

All racism is wrong, not just white being racist against blacks. I have black friends, hispanic friends and one native american friend and we get along just fine. That’s the way it should be. Race should never be an issue. Saying whites are racist against blacks is a racist comment to begin with. I am actually offended by that. Assuming anything based on race period is wrong. I think companies hiring a white guy over a black guy because he’s black is absolutely wrong. I think hiring a minority over a better qualified white guy to meet a percentage of minorities is wrong too. I think it’s wrong to assume anything based on race. Affirmative action has escalated racism, not helped it. I disagree with the article where it states we need to scrap our current governmental system and rewrite one for the “modern age”. I did get a lot from the writer’s perspective though. Racism sucks. Don’t assume all whites are racist, and don’t assume non-whites can’t be racist.

I love it. I appreciate your perspective, but how do we make change? You’re right racism sucks hard. Ideally everyone would have this perspective.

Maybe it’s important to break it down to the science of the mind. At its simplest level our +5 senses take in information that is carried to our brain. If it’s an “oh shit moment” it doesn’t even go deep. It hits the amygdala and the fight or flight response is kicked in. We don’t process. This is that crazy time where you ninja defend yourself from that yellow jacket, or your mom throws her hand in front of you in the car without thinking. We need to slow down and let information settle deep into the brain, and even maybe to the prefrontal cortex where we have forethought. We look at our own thoughts there, and analyze possible outcomes.

Ask yourself, what do you think when you “see” someone. Why? Now, act with care, love, and empathy. How do you think they see you? I hope they react the same way.

 

[Nameless Range]

A sincere question, not intended as snarky. Do you consider it a "pretty good perspective" because you find it helpful to add an additional view to the many other black American opinions that disagree with him so that you can better understand a very complicated situation, or, because it agrees with your preconceived notions and it trumps the view of those other black opinions?

In all areas, but particularly in areas of strong emotion, we all need to be mindful of the natural and universal human blindspot of "confirmation bias". I am not assuming or accusing - and I am not speaking specifically to you - this just seemed like a timely reminder for us all - myself included.

The only solution is the most difficult one, and that is to focus on the attributes of an argument, how they jive with reality, and how they compete with opposing statements. There is no such thing as a hierarchy of cogency based on what demographic groups the individual giving the argument is a member of, and where an argument comes from has no bearing on whether or not it is true. Seems obvious, but I have actually heard people argue to the contrary lately and it is dangerous.

Something I have been thinking about lately: Do any of you remember the SHIFT Festival in Jackson, Wyoming, that Steve Rinella gave a speech at in 2016? One of the core themes of that years' festival was Cultural Relevancy How do we insure that our public lands remain relevant and accessible to new and diverse groups of Americans, today and in the future? I had friend go. At the time, Transfer of Public Lands seemed more at the forefront, and in my mind I thought to myself regarding that subject that folks were debating about the color of the drapes while the house was on fire. Looking back now, I think I was way off in thinking that. As I watch folks display their desperation, disdain, and desire for change, I can't quite work it out in my head, but I think that public lands could be a venue for unification, though I know not a priority right now.

 

[Huntkook]

A sincere question, not intended as snarky. Do you consider it a "pretty good perspective" because you find it helpful to add an additional view to the many other black American opinions that disagree with him so that you can better understand a very complicated situation, or, because it agrees with your preconceived notions and it trumps the view of those other black opinions?

In all areas, but particularly in areas of strong emotion, we all need to be mindful of the natural and universal human blindspot of "confirmation bias". I am not assuming or accusing - and I am not speaking specifically to you - this just seemed like a timely reminder for us all - myself included.

I believe what he is saying is stop looking at me as a color. If we were all physically blind what gauge would we use to determine prejudice? I tend to look at people as to how they treat what God has given us. It's only a complicated situation because we as human beings have made it that way.

 

[Trial153]

Mr. Floyd should not have died under a cops knee, that is a crime........but he should not have done something to put himself in the situation.

There are raging, criminal, a-holes .....totally inconsiderate of anything or anyone, but their whim. There are small time crooks making bad decisions. There are prejudiced folks who are selfish.
They are in control of this and made this choice.
They are from all skin colors and religious realms.
If they break laws punishment should be swift and more severe than presently utilized. Folks on the fence about commiting a crime will think twice. Those that decide to commit should receive no pity.

More importantly ALL VICTIMS should be considered, their rights were taken. Criminals, convicted of taking someones rights or life, should have their rights taken from them until full punishment/restitution is paid by them.

You will lose most rational freedom loving people by your second sentence. Victim shameing and the disregard for due process all rolled in one.
If nothing else its a good illustration of why we are where we are, and shines a spotlight on the need for change.

 

[bushman13]

It’s actually "classism" but the upper middle class insulated people and the elites that incite them, would never own up to the truth.

I don't know if it's from living in a diverse state or the people I'm around (mostly minorities) but the systemic racism thing seems to be a regional issue in our country. Where I live is very blue collar, it's about 50% white, 40% Hispanic and 5% each of black and various Asian ethnicities. I work in the ag industry where other than the actual farmers just about everyone is Mexican and a few black guys. I also have family members who are minorities ethnically, when I talk to them about racism most of them laugh at me saying it's not what people make it out to be. From their point of view this is what I've gotten from them....

Are there racist people, absolutely. Are there people in positions of power who look down on minorities of course. Does it make the entire system racist.... now that's painting with a very broad brush.

Many of these guys grew up in rough upbringings and told me that most of the arrests and issues with authorities are brought on from their own doing. Everyday on the local news there are shootings and murders and just about everytime it is gang related. Our jails/local prisons are occupied by mostly minorities, the local gangs are all minority based. Is that because the local cops are racist (many of which are Hispanic) or is it because these guys grew up not respecting humanity, many had fatherless homes and got into drugs?

What that cop did was horrible and needs to pay severe consequences. But I don't see what he did was any more racist than if a black cop did the same thing to a white guy.

The posts from the people to the guy that wrote the article was despicable. It's a bad representation of outdoorsmen that I think most of us would agree isn't the norm. I'm not discounting the fact that he has dealt with racist jerks when fishing but I don't think it can be concluded that all people who fish are racist.

I'm not trying to be the one to throw a different perspective in this thread and cause arguments. The conclusion I think we all have is no matter what race we are all human and all deserve he same respect whether from authority or anyone else. There may be pockets of racism in this country but the white privilege thing has really gotten old.... The fact that we live in America is a privilege, that we are physically able to get up and go to work is a privilege, that we had people of all races die for this country is a privilege. We might not all get to start from the same point but we all have the same opportunities to work your butt of and make something of yourself.

 

[Brandon270]

It’s actually "classism" but the upper middle class insulated people and the elites that incite them, would never own up to the truth.

I can agree with that

 

[VikingsGuy]

I believe what he is saying is stop looking at me as a color.

I understood what he was saying, I was getting more to how is his view "more right "than others who say that this is overly simplistic and insufficient to progress to the world we want. I have come to believe that being "color-blind" is only one step in the path towards truly embracing others fully as multi-faceted individuals. There are lots of good things written about how "I just see people" serves to limit change and allows the underlying historical inequities to remain in place. This is where I was when I was younger - as I have gained life experiences I now more clearly see how this was a good first step, but it was insufficient to really embrace all the people in my life with an open heart.

If we were all physically blind what gauge would we use to determine prejudice?

Religion, gender, sexual orientation, nationality, economic status, etc. - humans are amazingly good at seperating ourselves into groups of "us" and "them".

It's only a complicated situation because we as human beings have made it that way.

I believe it is complicated because it is in fact complicated. I believe that if I value the thoughts and experiences of others and try to place them aside my own it gets messy in a hurry. It is only simple if I choose to dismiss the dissonance and rest in the comfort that my view is the right view.

 

[Howie]

You will lose most rational freedom loving people by your second sentence. Victim shameing and the disregard for due process all rolled in one.
If nothing else its a good illustration of why we are where we are, and shines a spotlight on the need for change.

If you find victim shaming in my statement you have to re read it. I am staunch about the sad situation where victims are ignored and criminals get every consideration. Mr. Floyd was a victim...but if he had not committed a crime the criminal cop would not have been on his neck.

 

[Huntkook]

I believe it is complicated because it is in fact complicated. I believe that if I value the thoughts and experiences of others and try to place them aside my own it gets messy in a hurry. It is only simple if I choose to dismiss the dissonance and rest in the comfort that my view is the right view.
[/QUOTE] Are you married? If so is your other half complicated? How did you resolve your differences? We as humans complicate everything.

 

[FI460]

If you find victim shaming in my statement you have to re read it. I am staunch about the sad situation where victims are ignored and criminals get every consideration. Mr. Floyd was a victim...but if he had not committed a crime the criminal cop would not have been on his neck.

We don't know that he committed the crime though either. It was alleged, but thanks to overly aggressive policing he didn't get a day in court, so now we'll never know.

 

[BuzzH]

If you find victim shaming in my statement you have to re read it. I am staunch about the sad situation where victims are ignored and criminals get every consideration. Mr. Floyd was a victim...but if he had not committed a crime the criminal cop would not have been on his neck.

What crime did he commit? What was he cited for? Where is the trial?

Allegedly passing a fake $20, with no proof, no trial...is not a crime committed, in case you're still unsure about your false assertion.

 

[Trial153]

We don't know that he committed the crime though either. It was alleged, but thanks to overly aggressive policing he didn't get a day in court, so now we'll never know.

Wrong quote. ^ agree