73 ranch sold

[Irrelevant]

PN is anti predator hunting as well.

 

[antlerradar]

So you think owners would have been willing to take less, in an APR-less world.

I guess I’m not sure if I agree, I don’t know the circumstances of the 73 owners but it’s possible they might have just held on to it… also possible a Turner /Wilks esk owner would have purchased it for a similar price. Pretty hard to say what prices with be like without APR.

Hard to say, I have been around long enough to see land prices rise and fall. When prices are falling many owners have no choice but to take less. Lot of people found this out the last time housing prices crashed. What is tough on one is a buying opportunity for others. With APR the market is not going to fall.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Hard to say, I have been around long enough to see land prices rise and fall. When prices are falling many owners have no choice but to take less. Lot of people found this out the last time housing prices crashed What is tough on one is a buying opportunity for others. With APR the market is not going to fall.

I guess I see where you’re coming from… but doesn’t that still make the only “winner” from the APRs tax status the seller?

Ostensibly in your argument if the APR was for profit, then the closing price would have been lower, but still would have happened.

 

[Big Fin]

I wonder if people understand that when Kronke, his Wal-Mart wife and inlaws, Turner, Wilks, and the such, form a new entity, whether LLC or Corporation, and they contribute capital to buy land, said LLC or Corporation does not pay tax on those capital contributions. Just like a non-profit does not pay tax on donations.

It is as if some think that Big ELK, LLC pays tax on any capital contributions from investors. It does not. In fact, BIG ELK, LLC doesn't pay any income tax at all, rather is a conduit that allocates its share of profits or losses to the investors where the tax situation of that investor determines what taxes/benefits result.

If a non-profit makes a profit in a business endeavor that competes with private parties and such endeavor is not part of their approved charitable efforts, those profits are subject to Unrelated Business Income Tax, payable at some very high rates. Non-profits are not allowed to operate profit endeavors that compete against other businesses without paying income taxes.

Should we let LLCs pass through the benefits of making large donations, incurring large losses, holding assets for appreciation with said appreciation going away at death, and a host of other tax tricks that make an equally compelling case that LLCs and other privately funded entities drive prices more than a non-profit whose resources are likely far less than the resources of Bezos and the New Age Astronauts.

Should we asses estate tax on large asset based businesses, such as working ranches, in a more difficult way than we asses estate tax on billion dollar stock portfolios, giving those with large portfolios a huge advantage when competing for the purchase of estate burdened ranches?

Should we allow hedge funds to defer taxes on gains for years and years, allowing them to essentially be tax-deferred IRAs for the partners? Should we all those same funds to hold real estate in a way that drives real estate prices to such levels that the average American is likely never to own high quality income producing commercial real estate?

I could go on and on. We really should start a new thread on this stuff, as these comments and ideas related to what is deductible, how entities are used and somehow have competitive advantage because of the tax code, etc. is leading to some conclusions that might benefit from better explanations of some of this.

 

[antlerradar]

I guess I see where you’re coming from… but doesn’t that still make the only “winner” from the APRs tax status the seller?

Ostensibly in your argument if the APR was for profit, then the closing price would have been lower, but still would have happened.

Likely not less now as land prices are rising.

 

[antlerradar]

I wonder if people understand that when Kronke, his Wal-Mart wife and inlaws, Turner, Wilks, and the such, form a new entity, whether LLC or Corporation, and they contribute capital to buy land, said LLC or Corporation does not pay tax on those capital contributions. Just like a non-profit does not pay tax on donations.

It is as if some think that Big ELK, LLC pays tax on any capital contributions from investors. It does not. In fact, BIG ELK, LLC doesn't pay any income tax at all, rather is a conduit that allocates its share of profits or losses to the investors where the tax situation of that investor determines what taxes/benefits result.

If a non-profit makes a profit in a business endeavor that competes with private parties and such endeavor is not part of their approved charitable efforts, those profits are subject to Unrelated Business Income Tax, payable at some very high rates. Non-profits are not allowed to operate profit endeavors that compete against other businesses without paying income taxes.

Should we let LLCs pass through the benefits of making large donations, incurring large losses, holding assets for appreciation with said appreciation going away at death, and a host of other tax tricks that make an equally compelling case that LLCs and other privately funded entities drive prices more than a non-profit whose resources are likely far less than the resources of Bezos and the New Age Astronauts.

Should we asses estate tax on large asset based businesses, such as working ranches, in a more difficult way than we asses estate tax on billion dollar stock portfolios, giving those with large portfolios a huge advantage when competing for the purchase of estate burdened ranches?

Should we allow hedge funds to defer taxes on gains for years and years, allowing them to essentially be tax-deferred IRAs for the partners? Should we all those same funds to hold real estate in a way that drives real estate prices to such levels that the average American is likely never to own high quality income producing commercial real estate?

I could go on and on. We really should start a new thread on this stuff, as these comments and ideas related to what is deductible, how entities are used and somehow have competitive advantage because of the tax code, etc. is leading to some conclusions that might benefit from better explanations of some of this.

I think we can all agree that the tax code is F up.

 

[Big Fin]

I think we can all agree that the tax code is F up.

Oh yeah, 100%. Like a lot of things, it's probably good the general public doesn't know how F'd up.

 

[SAJ-99]

Not confusing at all, Just saying if you don't want to pay taxes, don't make money.
Not a tax accountant, But I don't think you can depreciate the cost of land.

No, the land can't be depreciated, but the cost of acquiring it can.

 

[Irrelevant]

The Latest

www.americanprairie.org

Lots of good quotes here. 9.3k acres of land locked public opened.

 

[rogerthat]

Should we let LLCs pass through the benefits of making large donations, incurring large losses, holding assets for appreciation with said appreciation going away at death, and a host of other tax tricks that make an equally compelling case that LLCs and other privately funded entities drive prices more than a non-profit whose resources are likely far less than the resources of Bezos and the New Age Astronauts.

Just taking a quick look at the board of directors I see Jacqueline Mars on there the fifth richest woman in the world, net worth $46.9 billion as of Sept 2021. The interest she earned on her assets today could buy the 73 ranch, but you and I can still make a donation.

 

[TheJason]

Just taking a quick look at the board of directors I see Jacqueline Mars on there the fifth richest woman in the world, net worth $46.9 billion as of Sept 2021. The interest she earned on her assets today could buy the 73 ranch, but you and I can still make a donation.

If she buys it, pretty sure you’re not hunting it. I guess I don’t see the relevance?

 

[SAJ-99]

Just taking a quick look at the board of directors I see Jacqueline Mars on there the fifth richest woman in the world, net worth $46.9 billion as of Sept 2021. The interest she earned on her assets today could buy the 73 ranch, but you and I can still make a donation.

Better to have money on your side than against you, for sure. Mars and I probably agree on a lot, regarding the goals of the APR at least.

 

[Straight Arrow]

Just taking a quick look at the board of directors I see Jacqueline Mars on there the fifth richest woman in the world, net worth $46.9 billion as of Sept 2021. The interest she earned on her assets today could buy the 73 ranch, but you and I can still make a donation.

I'm truly sorry you have to know that and interpret it in such a strange way. The statement and the way you express it says more about you than about her.

 

[rogerthat]

Haha! You guys are literally ridiculous. Like a bunch of hypocritical hyenas. Have a good night fellas!

 

[TheJason]

 

[brockel]

Did you guys know this about APR?

 

[MarvB]

Damn, didn’t even know about the Indian Zoo…my great great gramps must be rolling over in his grave right now, sans his pony of course!