woods89
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Sheep hunting, with a few exceptions, is sort of the dirty little corner we wink and nod about of the North American model. This situation is a prime example of that.
Youngest Sheep Grand Slam
- Thread starter MTLabrador
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BuzzH
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Well, I can afford the things you can't do...but principles mean something to me. Not everything coming down to money matters to me as well.
We aren't cut from the same cloth. Money doesn't direct my moral compass.
I don't have to applaud the article describing the trigger pulling on 4 rams that were bought for a 13 year old. I don't have to stick together with things I don't agree with.
I also don't buy the whole "look at all the good those tags do" argument either. Sheep did fine, in some cases better, when these wealth tags didn't exist. If the family in this article are such champions of wildlife and wild sheep, why don't they donate without needing the tag?
They likely wouldn't donate a cent if a tag wasn't involved.
rjthehunter
Well-known member
I guess I don't know anyone who doesn't have an interest in sheep hunting donating to places like the Wild sheep foundation. Hunters are the best conservationists. No one cares more about a specific species than someone who hunts said species.
Dying with a ton of money doesn't interest me. Some day when I have the money to do so, I'll go on the hunts that entrigue me. Money won't do me any good when I'm dead or too old to use it.
I guess we'll just have differing opinions on the matter.
Dying with a ton of money doesn't interest me. Some day when I have the money to do so, I'll go on the hunts that entrigue me. Money won't do me any good when I'm dead or too old to use it.
I guess we'll just have differing opinions on the matter.
I think sheep are awesome and I hope to hunt them someday. I’ve also never given a dime to wsf and don’t really see that changing. Plenty of other ways to do conservation work other than a photo op capture event with a few people actually working, a bragfest banquet in your finest bolo tie or outspending another wannabe big deal to kill an animal with a pile guides holding your hand
Dinkshooter
Well-known member
until someone buys an auction tag for full price and donates the whole thing back, its not true conservation dolla bills. it's just cutting in line.
The Hedgehog
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You can read an article, and make a lot of assumptions. In this case you only have to read the headline.
I can’t speak to what it’s like to have that kind of income to spend - so my opinion is skewed. But I can say I have never dreamed about a guided sheep hunt, or an Africa hunting trip, or a Marco Polo or argali ram. In my opinion - that’s not what interests me in hunting. That’s more of a great and expensive vacation where you get to probably kill something. Maybe if I was extra wealthy, I’d feel different but I doubt it. Would I spend money like that? Dunno - but I’d like to think not. I’d be buying auction tags left and right though, no doubt.
As to the parenting thing.. few and I mean damn few kids (of parents who are possessed with hunting) have the same drive or interest. I can’t fault a parent for wanting to share that with their kids. If what they’re doing works - they have won. From personal experience - I can say I made my son work way to hard at a very young age and spoiled my daughter with pampering, where I should have maybe been more in the middle with both of them. I’m excited for more fun times hunting with them even though they don’t have near the interest or drive that I do. I do most the work with their hunting, but it’s still a great experience, and I don’t see a problem with that as a parent.
That said, I’d be embarrassed to be that girl’s dad, knowing life long “hunters” who’d love to hunt one sheep, would be reading that.
I can’t speak to what it’s like to have that kind of income to spend - so my opinion is skewed. But I can say I have never dreamed about a guided sheep hunt, or an Africa hunting trip, or a Marco Polo or argali ram. In my opinion - that’s not what interests me in hunting. That’s more of a great and expensive vacation where you get to probably kill something. Maybe if I was extra wealthy, I’d feel different but I doubt it. Would I spend money like that? Dunno - but I’d like to think not. I’d be buying auction tags left and right though, no doubt.
As to the parenting thing.. few and I mean damn few kids (of parents who are possessed with hunting) have the same drive or interest. I can’t fault a parent for wanting to share that with their kids. If what they’re doing works - they have won. From personal experience - I can say I made my son work way to hard at a very young age and spoiled my daughter with pampering, where I should have maybe been more in the middle with both of them. I’m excited for more fun times hunting with them even though they don’t have near the interest or drive that I do. I do most the work with their hunting, but it’s still a great experience, and I don’t see a problem with that as a parent.
That said, I’d be embarrassed to be that girl’s dad, knowing life long “hunters” who’d love to hunt one sheep, would be reading that.
375H&H
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Want to bet this kid isn’t into hunting in 20 years? A little different but I would hate to be in my 70s or 80s and never shot a bison and see this.
DANGLER
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Can't agree with you on this one....That buffalo tag is a draw tag. Only big dollars involved would be the horses to get in there. I have hunted with my daughter since she was literally in pig tails. She has drawn some great tags over the years (LE mule deer, LE elk, antelope, ewe big horn and Buffalo) ... she has hunted hard and filled those tags. She turns 20 next month.... and I don't see her skipping next hunting season. The awesome memories we shared on these cool hunts have definitely made her a "real hunter". I get the animosity toward the big dollars spent on the grand slam...but don't get the hate for a kid drawing a legit tag and making the most of it with the help of his dad. That is just good parenting in my opinion.
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375H&H
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Just to be clear I have no ill will or hate to them, they seem like great people and his dad has helped a ton of people out (myself included). If that’s what they want to do, good for them.
I was just referencing what wllm said above about the skier who lost interest having peaked in her teens and greenhorns comment about the sheep hunter dying to hunt just one sheep and never getting to.
woods89
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People don't want to admit it, but giving a kid access to top tier experiences in any hobby in their teens often, but not always, does not result in them sticking with it for life. I agree with @wllm wholeheartedly on that.
What is there to dream about in hunting when you have already killed 4 sheep as a child? And isn't it the dreams that keep most of us engaged?
rjthehunter
Well-known member
Or, maybe the kid develops a deep love for a challenging hunt. Maybe she ends up working with the wild sheep foundation and helps reintroduce sheep to new areas. Maybe she winds up like Jason Hairston. Sure there's a chance she gets burned out, but there's also a chance she doesn't.
If she managed to win these hunts, I doubt anyone would say anything negative about her.
DANGLER
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"Maybe she winds up like Jason Hairston." ?????????
Might have to explain yourself on that one......
Might have to explain yourself on that one......
rjthehunter
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Someone with a deep love of sheep hunting?
DANGLER
Well-known member
That kind of makes sense....I guess. He was a good dude... ran into him and his original partner back in the day.
Thought you were referring to the way he went out and saying the little girl might end up that way. Didn't figure you were that dark.
woods89
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Maybe......people do surprising things sometimes. My experience, however limited, with children who have been handed a lot of things through parents wealth would make me pretty comfortable putting odds on the fact that she grows up not that terribly enthused about hunting.
And why does it have to be videoed? Kids have times that they whine, they make mistakes, its not always wine and roses (I'm raising 4 currently). They don't need the pressure of a camera in their face. Let them learn and make their mistakes in privacy. Make me king of the world and there would be no kids in hunting videos.
There, I sound like an old man, and I'm only 33.......
OK my 2 cents at her age does she really understand her accomplishment prob not yet so what, she will some day maybe
The family comes from a long line of hunters it seems and wealth hunting sheep costs a lot for the most part as does some other forms of hunting these days its the world we live in and its not going to change, we see this with the Govenor's tags every yr and auction tags
If they have the money and want to spend it this way who cares its theirs to spend
Being able to make any shot on an animal has more to do with ability than age it seems like she was prepared to do so and I take my hat off to her for that
Folks fussing seem like sour grapes a bit to me, Ive gotten crap about some of the things I have done due to $ on a smaller scale like taking 3 weeks off to elk hunt without pay plus bear hunts deer hunt same yrs from guys I know that cant do that
and whine to me
The family comes from a long line of hunters it seems and wealth hunting sheep costs a lot for the most part as does some other forms of hunting these days its the world we live in and its not going to change, we see this with the Govenor's tags every yr and auction tags
If they have the money and want to spend it this way who cares its theirs to spend
Being able to make any shot on an animal has more to do with ability than age it seems like she was prepared to do so and I take my hat off to her for that
Folks fussing seem like sour grapes a bit to me, Ive gotten crap about some of the things I have done due to $ on a smaller scale like taking 3 weeks off to elk hunt without pay plus bear hunts deer hunt same yrs from guys I know that cant do that
and whine to me
rjthehunter
Well-known member
There's always people who will complain of you're able to dedicate more time or money then they are.
One of my grandpas first big game hunts he did was a Dall sheep hunt. He had a brother who lived in Alaska, so he borrowed a rifle from someone and went up to hunt. They didn't get anything the first year, but he was hooked. The second year they went, he got his ram. That's what ignited the fire for him.
He went on to chase 100s of animals across the world. He went on many sheep hunts, some of which were unsuccessful. But he managed to get the grand slam and then some.
It was more about the thrill of the adventure than the kill for him. Sure he enjoyed harvesting animals, but like most good hunters, there's a deeper meaning. I'm sure there were plenty of Buzzs in my grandpas life. Most of which were anti hunters, but there's always a handful of hunters who would get jealous to the point where they acted like antis.
There's more than just sheep in terms of dream hunts. The bison is a big one. Kodiak brown bear, polar bear, cape Buffalo, elephant, hippo, leopard, red stag in New Zealand, Moose, Marco polo, Ibex, grizzly, and many more. Someone's dream hunt might be harvesting a bull elk with a bow. Everyone has different levels and it's typically based on what they can afford; right wrong or indifferent.
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I'm sure some day folks will be flying a helicopter to the top of Everest to get a selfie... no problem with that, but it's not the same as spending months on the mountain to acclimate to climb it without oxygen, it's not the same as when Hillary and Norgay did it, and it's certainly not the same as the Sherpas who climb it multiple times a season ferrying everyone's crap up the mountain.
The reason sheep hunting has cachet is because it's near impossible for the average person to get a tag, it's cool because it's a unique once-in-a-lifetime experience, and if you go unguided it can be difficult. What folks are interested in is seeing people have that unique experience, and imagining themselves having that experience.
Folks are removing all the adversity from the experience and expecting the same cachet.
A big elk head is just a big elk head, what's interesting is the story... "I paid 50k to shoot that in Texas" is different than "I spent 30 years hunting the _________ mountains and connected on that bull 8 miles back in a hell hole".
Rich folks getting butt hurt because plebs aren't enthralled by their cheating... sour grapes indeed.
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IM 100% in agreement on this I should have added its a much bigger accomplishment to go into a UL unit in Montanna and harvest a 3/4 ram . Than having FU money to go anywhere and get any tag you want
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